Just close Graal.

[WaDaFack]

Just close Graal, its going on a HUGE downfall. There isn't anything you can do about anymore.

WHOs fault is this?
The globals and Stefan FAILED to cooperate, and did not listen to anyones opinion. Bell the Player World Administrator had a GREAT idea of downsizing Graal so it would be more like 5 servers, unstead of a million. But nope, globals thought they can handle things on there own, guess not.

WHAT is causing this?
Stefan, and unixmad. Stefan for not being loyal enough to Graal, and unixmad for everything being overpriced. I got a bajillion PMs from my friends on Zone, and Graal Kingdoms saying that they WASTED money on garbage when they could have been paying for other games, for cheaper and offer more. I mean, it cost 40$, 40 freaking dollars for Zone, or GK. Everyday you log on, your just doing the same thing you did yesterday, pulling out a gun and shooting everyone. There is NO variety what so ever, Graal is just getting dull and boring.

WHERE is this happening?
No were else, but Graal.

WHEN is this happening?
Right now, Graal is just going on a huge downfall. There is nothing you can do about it, but just wait. Just watch, soon the message will appear on the forums when Stefan announces Graal shutdown.

WHY is this happening?
No one cares. For example, I sent in my ticket a month ago and still hasn't been replied. If you guys did care, you would actually take the money we gave you to advertise, to hire professional developers and to improve on your firewall. Right now, as I see it, you just don't give a crap and just letting Graal die, so you have an excuse to just walk away with our money.


HOW is this happening?
The population is decreasing, and is not going up at all. I don't think anymore P2Ps are being bought, nor is gold. The only people who are probaly buying are the people who bought before, because they are what we call ADDICTS and never played any other game BUT Graal. The ADDICTS are the ones keeping Graal alive, at the moment.

*Note, this post has nothing to do with anti-graal,anti-unixmad or a threat to hack Graal Online,cyberjouers in anyway.*




What do you think?

[Elizabeth]

'just close graal now. we might as well add on to the downfall.'

maybe if they hired people that cared, you'd get a response faster.


but anyways, i don't know what you guys are talking about, because i've never gotten a response that took over 4 days.

[CharlieM]

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

What do you think?

That you should give up. Graal isn't going on a downfall. Its average.

[WaDaFack]

Have you not noticed the drop in the playercount?
Take UN for example, in the summer of 2005 it had about 200+players, the summer of 2006 it had 190-200players, after 2007 it had 150-180players, now in 2008-2009 it has 100players in the summer.
You'll probaly say "Oh people, got bored of Graal and just quit" well, thats the globals duty, to make Graal entertaining and not dull, and boring.

[Elizabeth]

'playercount is dropping so lets just give up'.

[Pimmeh]

So, why are you still here?!
Get out, we dont need you...

[Elizabeth]

Originally Posted by Pimmeh

So, why are you still here?!
Get out, we dont need you...

you're just the players, it's not like you support graal or anything! we don't need you!

[CharlieM]

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

Have you not noticed the drop in the playercount?
Take UN for example, in the summer of 2005 it had about 200+players, the summer of 2006 it had 190-200players, after 2007 it had 150-180players, now in 2008-2009 it has 100players in the summer.
You'll probaly say "Oh people, got bored of Graal and just quit" well, thats the globals duty, to make Graal entertaining and not dull, and boring.

No I am not going to say that..What happend to UN was Zodiac. When Zodiac players realized what they could do on there own server/other server players. They set out to make there own servers/play other servers. The playercount hasn't changed it has just spread out

[Tigairius]

I was trying to decide whether or not I had the energy to respond to this thread. I think I will.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

Just close Graal, its going on a HUGE downfall. There isn't anything you can do about anymore.

People who don't think they can change anything usually don't. Remember that.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

WHOs fault is this?
The globals and Stefan FAILED to cooperate, and did not listen to anyones opinion. Bell the Player World Administrator had a GREAT idea of downsizing Graal so it would be more like 5 servers, unstead of a million. But nope, globals thought they can handle things on there own, guess not.

"The globals and Stefan?" We are constantly listening to your opinions. What gives you any right to tell us how to do our jobs? What gives you any right to tell Stefan and unixmad how to run their game? You are a customer. You are a player. They are business owners. They can run their business however they want to.
You don't have any idea what you're talking about. "Globals thought they can handle things on their own," when we haven't even had a "sit down" discussion about that plan yet. Please, before you go on and start denouncing all globals maybe you should consider that these decisions take time, and making big decisions like this requires a "go ahead" from everyone. It's not something that can be done over night.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

WHAT is causing this?
Stefan, and unixmad. Stefan for not being loyal enough to Graal, and unixmad for everything being overpriced. I got a bajillion PMs from my friends on Zone, and Graal Kingdoms saying that they WASTED money on garbage when they could have been paying for other games, for cheaper and offer more. I mean, it cost 40$, 40 freaking dollars for Zone, or GK. Everyday you log on, your just doing the same thing you did yesterday, pulling out a gun and shooting everyone. There is NO variety what so ever, Graal is just getting dull and boring.

$40 is not a lot of money. Stefan and unixmad are still doing things for Graal, but like any business, they are concentrating on what is generating the most money right now: iPhone. Do you honestly blame them? So what? So they're trying to make money? Maybe if they make a lot of good money from iPhone they can bring that positive energy back to Graal and bring it up. So, let's NOT give up and continue playing Graal, like we all know you're going to do anyways.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

WHERE is this happening?
No were else, but Graal.

Cite this please. For some reason I don't think Graal can be the only potentially failing business in the world right now.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

WHEN is this happening?
Right now, Graal is just going on a huge downfall. There is nothing you can do about it, but just wait. Just watch, soon the message will appear on the forums when Stefan announces Graal shutdown.

You can watch all you want, but while you're watching, I'm going to actually be taking initiative and trying to improve the current situation.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

WHY is this happening?
No one cares. For example, I sent in my ticket a month ago and still hasn't been replied. If you guys did care, you would actually take the money we gave you to advertise, to hire professional developers and to improve on your firewall. Right now, as I see it, you just don't give a crap and just letting Graal die, so you have an excuse to just walk away with our money.

We care. Submit a ticket to the playerworld section. I guarantee you that you will receive a response within 2 days. Most likely within 24 hours. I usually respond to tickets within 3 hours or so after they're submitted.

Just because one section of the support center isn't very active doesn't mean we're all just sitting around on our hands.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

HOW is this happening?
The population is decreasing, and is not going up at all. I don't think anymore P2Ps are being bought, nor is gold. The only people who are probaly buying are the people who bought before, because they are what we call ADDICTS and never played any other game BUT Graal. The ADDICTS are the ones keeping Graal alive, at the moment.

Again, I'm going to have to ask you to cite this information. To me, this sounds like some more opinionated nonsense. As far as I know, unixmad and Stefan don't disclose any of their financial information about Graal.

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

Have you not noticed the drop in the playercount?

Ever heard of school?

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

You'll probaly say "Oh people, got bored of Graal and just quit" well, thats the globals duty, to make Graal entertaining and not dull, and boring.

It is not our duty to "make Graal entertaining."

All of this, on top of the fact that several years ago when UN had 180+ players, there was no Zodiac. Now if you do the math, which just division, you can see that the playercount has been cut in half from UN and has gone to Zodiac.

Thanks.

[salesman]

There's a lot of factors contributing to the low playercount, but you cannot pin it solely on school and Zodiac...that's just denial, and will get us nowhere.

[gravator]

I would also like to see a downsize of graal servers, there are many playerworlds that are under construction because nearly everyone wanted to make their own server, and that isn't good because it causes people that do the work to get spread out too much and very little actual work gets taken care of.



There are some servers that were started maybe once or twice but didn't really work out, but STILL people cling to them and try their own "revival project" and should just let those servers go already.


And the tileset or item rights deal going on, why are certain works and tilesets not allowed to be used in another server, i've seen some very good tiles on multiple servers and thought they would go pretty good together in one massive new age server, just an example would be classic, you have all those wonderful and fun quests from before the reset, just give them a makeover! New look, new scripting, but the same stuff the older playerbase loved when they first started.


But no, people are so darn set on keeping "their" tileset and if even ONE sprite looks like theirs and it's on another server........holy cow does all kinds of crap hit the fan and it turns into a big mess on who owns what and where, I could be mistaken but shouldn't all graphics, music, scripts and all that belong to Cyberjoueurs? I would think that allowed people to use any tileset or graphic they needed for their server without someone complaining about it.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by salesman

There's a lot of factors contributing to the low playercount, but you cannot pin it solely on school and Zodiac...that's just denial, and will get us nowhere.

Right now there are 102 players on Era, 82 on Zodiac and 72 on Unholy Nation. That's fantastic. Just last weekend there were over 100 people on Era, 100+ people on Zodiac and about 80 people on UN.

How can you honestly call that "denial?"

[zephirot]

Originally Posted by CharlieM

That you should give up. Graal isn't going on a downfall. Its average.

wat

Originally Posted by Tigairius

Right now there are 102 players on Era, 82 on Zodiac and 72 on Unholy Nation. That's fantastic. Just last weekend there were over 100 people on Era, 100+ people on Zodiac and about 80 people on UN.

How can you honestly call that "denial?"

You obviously were not here when UN itself had approx 190-240 players on during the week.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by zephirot

You obviously were not here when UN itself had approx 190-240 players on during the week.

I've been here pretty much the whole time. I NEVER remember 240 players on UN. Sometimes 220 or so. 220/2 (2 since 1 is UN and 1 is Zodiac, 1+1 = 2) = 110 + all of the other private servers that have gone up since then = What??? Same playercount, different servers.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

Right now there are 102 players on Era, 82 on Zodiac and 72 on Unholy Nation. That's fantastic. Just last weekend there were over 100 people on Era, 100+ people on Zodiac and about 80 people on UN.

Is this sarcasm? I really hope it is, but I can't tell.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by Rufus

Is this sarcasm? I really hope it is, but I can't tell.

It's not sarcastic. The playercount hasn't moved. That's the point I'm trying to make.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

It's not sarcastic. The playercount hasn't moved. That's the point I'm trying to make.

http://statistics.graal.us/server/graphs/year

[Nataxo]

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

The ADDICTS are the ones keeping Graal alive, at the moment.



What do you think?

Player-Staff are the ones keeping Graal Alive, mostly.

Though, School might affect too...=P

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by Rufus

http://statistics.graal.us/server/graphs/year

This happens every year watch, a few months from now it'll go right back up.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

This happens every year watch, a few months from now it'll go right back up.

12 months ago.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by WaDaFack

Just close Graal, its going on a HUGE downfall. There isn't anything you can do about anymore?

You sound a bit too sure of your statements within your first post. What happens when your proved wrong? o.o

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by Rufus

12 months ago.

We'll see.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

We'll see.

What do you mean? 12 months ago the playercount was significantly higher than it is now. 12 months ago being exactly one year ago, so the playercount overall has dropped. Coupled with the fact that there are less development servers now than previously, one would assume...

[Darugo]

I admit, the player count has declined a bit over the years, even though I've been here for only 2 (don't try to look at how long I've been on the forums, I've had a second account ;D)
People try to put the blame on people like Stefan, Unixmad, and Globals. Yes Globals, you shall indeed take some of the blame, everybody needs to take some of the blame, including the players. There has been a recent decline in being NICE to others also, a lack of respect if you will. I will use Zodiac as an example, persay I asked where Goblins are (npc monsters), sure a FAQ might be on, but if not? The players will ignore you, or point you in the direction without help, I feel that blame should be shifted on all of us. Players constantly complaining that Graal did not commit itself fully to advertising. Graal was never a game that COULD be advertised, it cost too much and trials would come and go too much. I usually try to throw in a quick hey look at this game it's pretty fun, with the new Gelat system I can also donate a month to my friends if they are in need of help, the gelat system is very good and will help me in later months. About the new trial system; As a regular said in a topic that was preaching on about how Graal was dead, the trials were leeching off of us, not paying and abusing the system. Instead of creating topics about how Graal sux graal sux close dis **** omg dis shyt is ghey and liek stfen n unyxmud r jst stuleing monies frum us. DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. ADVERTISE TO YOUR FRIENDS, TELL THEM ABOUT THIS GAME THAT NEEDS HELP, PUT A MESSAGE IN A BOTTLE, THROW IT OUT TO SEA!!

It's time for less talk more action, Graal has built itself up from the ground (except for the part its kind of like Zelda), get on Graal, start playing, every player helps. Sure there are 3rd mmos and fps and stupid shooters like that, It's time we acted like a real community, shut the hell up, and did something useful. I'm sorry for being a drama queen but jesus christ you guys need to stiffen up. The world of games have been tough, the recession tougher. It's up to YOU to save Graal, it always has been, the playerworlds were what mostly kept Graal alive. Hell learn GS whatever and start latting for servers, who cares if it takes long, instead of complaining on the forums DO SOMETHING FOR THE PEOPLE.
I admit I do believe Stefan and Unixmad are milking the cow until it dies, but hell I am not going to let this cow run dry

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by Darugo

It's time for less talk more action, Graal has built itself up from the ground (except for the part its kind of like Zelda), get on Graal, start playing, every player helps.

Why should we force ourselves to log on and play when it's just not fun?

Also, Graal has never been newbie friendly. You can't really associate player-drop with that, because back in the day new players were greeted by jump-squads out of Big Brothers house and constantly sword-raped. And that has nothing to do with the fact Graal was free, because it still carried on like that over the years.

[MysticX2X]

Tig's Post:

"The globals and Stefan?" We are constantly listening to your opinions. What gives you any right to tell us how to do our jobs? What gives you any right to tell Stefan and unixmad how to run their game? You are a customer. You are a player. They are business owners. They can run their business however they want to.
You don't have any idea what you're talking about. "Globals thought they can handle things on their own," when we haven't even had a "sit down" discussion about that plan yet. Please, before you go on and start denouncing all globals maybe you should consider that these decisions take time, and making big decisions like this requires a "go ahead" from everyone. It's not something that can be done over night.

We as players should give our constructive criticism in regards to a Game's condition. We as players should give our constructive criticism towards a Game's management. A complaint is what any customer is entitled to because it shows dissatisfaction towards the product. Most companies offer satisfaction policies while we are on the aspect of how they run their business. No one can deny the game's quality has been deteriorating within the recent years, and it surely isn't because some people are getting older and quit. It's because there's nothing to satisfy people anymore.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

Also, Graal has never been newbie friendly. You can't really associate player-drop with that, because back in the day new players were greeted by jump-squads out of Big Brothers house and constantly sword-raped. And that has nothing to do with the fact Graal was free, because it still carried on like that over the years.

I've got to agree with what he said. The state of the community on the majority of servers has severely deteriorated. It comes with this new culture of internet idiots being glamorized as tough guys. People get away with everything, because like we've spoke about before in private, if you remove these people they somehow weed their way back. There has been no attempt to promote a pleasant community so far, only forced measures as you'd expect, but it needs to be done and it needs to be done well to ensure new players are on good standing when they start playing.

[zephirot]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

I've been here pretty much the whole time. I NEVER remember 240 players on UN. Sometimes 220 or so. 220/2 (2 since 1 is UN and 1 is Zodiac, 1+1 = 2) = 110 + all of the other private servers that have gone up since then = What??? Same playercount, different servers.

I'm going to repeat myself, but obviously you were not here, Zodiac did not even exist back then.
And UN easily reached the 220 players itself.

[Darugo]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

Why should we force ourselves to log on and play when it's just not fun?

Also, Graal has never been newbie friendly. You can't really associate player-drop with that, because back in the day new players were greeted by jump-squads out of Big Brothers house and constantly sword-raped. And that has nothing to do with the fact Graal was free, because it still carried on like that over the years.

This has been said many times by many players, just leave if you do not like it, but I am not going to do that, and I hope others follow my footsteps.

Just try a different server, yes there are some gem friends in Graal Online, and you are bound to have one or be one. If you don't like it anymore, try being a helpful sport to others on the server you frequent most and give hints and tips.
I can see you have been here long, longer than me infact, hell longer than most people around here. I'm sure over these years, you have been satisfied with the game, you may have or have not been loyal to some servers, or the globals infact, and to change your opinion on something you liked within Graal is a decision made by you and you alone. Maybe if there were some way I could change the way you thought of Graal, I would do my best. So just ask what you want changed, I will do everything in my newbie power to help you.

Edit: I do also want to apologize on being so negative in this thread:
http://forums.graalonline.com/forums...ad.php?t=84156
It was dumb of me to think that people were not helpful.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Darugo

I can see you have been here long, longer than me infact, hell longer than most people around here. I'm sure over these years, you have been satisfied with the game, you may have or have not been loyal to some servers, or the globals infact, and to change your opinion on something you liked within Graal is a decision made by you and you alone. Maybe if there were some way I could change the way you thought of Graal, I would do my best. So just ask what you want changed, I will do everything in my newbie power to help you.

For a "professional jerk" you sure are nice

[Darugo]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

Why should we force ourselves to log on and play when it's just not fun?

Also, Graal has never been newbie friendly. You can't really associate player-drop with that, because back in the day new players were greeted by jump-squads out of Big Brothers house and constantly sword-raped. And that has nothing to do with the fact Graal was free, because it still carried on like that over the years.

Also Dusty, it is obvious you have Classic, and I have noticed in another topic you decided you were not upgrading, or atleast pointed that you didn't.
This was, I'm sure, partly why they removed Classic, people went ahead and said "hey why bother upgrading i am already set up enough to not need Gold again"
I am also running on Classic, but once I get some more cash I will GLADLY upgrade to support the community.


Also thank you Rufus

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by Darugo

This has been said many times by many players, just leave if you do not like it, but I am not going to do that, and I hope others follow my footsteps.

This contradicts your post before, though. First you say we should log on and play, then you say we should leave if we don't like Graal. Us all logging on and 'playing' isn't going to improve anything, just increase the playercount. By increasing the playercount when we're not really having fun will only be counter-productive as then they will have the numbers to back themselves with.

Originally Posted by Darugo

Just try a different server, yes there are some gem friends in Graal Online, and you are bound to have one or be one. If you don't like it anymore, try being a helpful sport to others on the server you frequent most and give hints and tips.

I have tried many servers, and I never really stick around for long. This may be my own personal problem because I have a hard time getting into anything. Regardless... it has been like this for years for me.

Originally Posted by Darugo

I can see you have been here long, longer than me infact, hell longer than most people around here. I'm sure over these years, you have been satisfied with the game, you may have or have not been loyal to some servers, or the globals infact, and to change your opinion on something you liked within Graal is a decision made by you and you alone. Maybe if there were some way I could change the way you thought of Graal, I would do my best. So just ask what you want changed, I will do everything in my newbie power to help you.

A lot has to do with decisions made by the higher-ups that none of us can change. We have tried, but Stefan and Unixmad(I suspect the latter more than the formal) aren't very interested in our opinions.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by Darugo

Also Dusty, it is obvious you have Classic, and I have noticed in another topic you decided you were not upgrading, or atleast pointed that you didn't.
This was, I'm sure, partly why they removed Classic, people went ahead and said "hey why bother upgrading i am already set up enough to not need Gold again"
I am also running on Classic, but once I get some more cash I will GLADLY upgrade to support the community.


Also thank you Rufus

It has nothing to do with me having classic. I can understand why they removed classic subscriptions, it was bad for their income. I don't want to upgrade because I have no reason to anymore. I would subscribe just to support Graal if they gave me a reason to, but I'm tired of the way players get treated around the forums and by the higher-ups.

[Darugo]

[QUOTE=DustyPorViva;1467469]This contradicts your post before, though. First you say we should log on and play, then you say we should leave if we don't like Graal. Us all logging on and 'playing' isn't going to improve anything, just increase the playercount. By increasing the playercount when we're not really having fun will only be counter-productive as then they will have the numbers to back themselves with.

No I said that most people say just get out and leave if you do not like it, but I said no to that because it is rude and we should welcome oldbies like you.
Sorry if that was phrased badly.

Also sorry for getting your membership involved in this.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by Darugo

No I said that most people say just get out and leave if you do not like it, but I said no to that because it is rude and we should welcome oldbies like you.
Sorry if that was phrased badly.

Also sorry for getting your membership involved in this.

I'm sure people will leave if they're not happy, but that's not a good argument. People should never feel like they have to leave, if they're still here then there is a reason why. Maybe it's to complain, but even so, they're not playing for a reason. Admins should take that into consideration. I'm still here because honestly, I tend to want to help. I like the community and I want to help it out, but they don't make it too easy.

I think Graal has amazing potential, but it's just one bad decision after the next. It's good to see a perspective from a newer player, though. Obviously some people still enjoy it, and I'm not out to stop anyone from enjoying it.

[DarkRenji]

Why are you comparing summer player counts, to these school day player counts? :x

[Darugo]

Summer is when players are more active as School playtime players usually go to sleep earlier and are gone for school half of the day.

[SwimChao]

I haven't been on Graal long, so it's hard for me to say what things were like when other things weren't here -- or what things were like in older days.

However, I do know that a majority of UN's players have spread out to other servers. I know that we used to get a majority of the classic server list's players, but who can blame them for spreading out to other servers? We've gone through so many Managers in the past month so we really haven't had a consistent development plan. That being said:

People certainly are spreading across the server list. However, we're still losing players and I often look at the list and do the math and notice it's at an all time low for the time I've been on Graal.

I have a theory as to why it's so low as it is (though it doesn't account for all of the drop in players). Know that a majority of the people who play Graal are in the 13-18 age group. School is going on and I think that alot of people are just focusing their time on school, rather than Graal. I predict it'll balance back out to a steady flow during the summertime, which isn't all that far away.

I can't really account for much else, and I skipped a few of the posts so I could write this up before I left. Hope it made sense. :P

[FaLLChiLD]

I don't see how anyone could say that is isn't the fault of the higher-ups.

What have we seen from them? A more "kid" friendly website that I actually find harder to navigate. Minimal updates to the actual client, game play, or development tools (that player-developers use to make the game with). Failure to accept player opinions.

I never got into the whole games server. I don't understand why they keep popping out half ass projects instead of improving what we have or want. Graal iPhone was not there when the playercount was higher. The games server was not there. This kind of stuff isn't what drew players in originally and it doesn't seem to be helping that much.

And Tig - Zodiac wasn't there. UN had well over 200 players. Maloria, Atlantis, Delteria, N-Pulse, Valikorlia; All servers actually had a steady fan base ranging anywhere from 30-70 players everyday. How you can diminish all these into two servers hardly equal to what UN had itself is beyond me.

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by zephirot

I'm going to repeat myself, but obviously you were not here, Zodiac did not even exist back then.

Originally Posted by FaLLChiLD

And Tig - Zodiac wasn't there.

That's what I've been trying to say this entire time.

Zodiac wasn't around back when UN had that playercount. Once Zodiac was released, half of UN's players went to Zodiac. ~200 people from UN *divided by* 2 = 100 people. There are 100 people on each server now. This is because 200/2 = 100. Plus there are other new servers that have come up on the private world list. The playercount has just shifted, not decreased.