Event Coin problem - Page 2

hampy · #41 02-23-2007, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hampy

was suggested earlier in the thread that maybe more items could be added with lower prices, something like 1-10 EC for other items

Yeah, the super brains behind this idea was the nappy:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Felix_Xenophobe

More EMs and more coins to play with. Either that or lower the prices in the ecshop. And some cheaper items in the shop (1-10ec).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

Like a blade, a hilt ect. And It eventally can be crafted into a weapon. Depending on what Hilt and blade you've chosen.

Sounds good, this would mean more things could be used when making craftable items, could make it more interesting when making them

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crow

Im not talking about gscript, Im talking about general coding. There is something for "random" values already, but still, not even that thing is random, it just looks like it actually is

Already implented to Graal btw, for years.

Oh ok, well as I said I don't know hardly anything about scripts but my point was that it could be done

Ravenblade1979 · #42 02-23-2007, 04:40 PM

More ec's to us em's. I have like a rucksack and can hold a lot..lol.

Gothika · #43 02-23-2007, 04:41 PM

This idea is getting good feedback. Although I can see Bjorn dismissing this idea for no reason at all.

hampy · #44 02-23-2007, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

This idea is getting good feedback. Although I can see Bjorn dismissing this idea for no reason at all.

If that does happen... we shall fight for our right, a better server to play on!
Although I don't see what there is to dismiss, I quote "brilliant idea" <-- couldn't put it better myself

Gothika · #45 02-23-2007, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hampy

Sounds good, this would mean more things could be used when making craftable items, could make it more interesting when making them

Yeah, also they can combine a different items, Like some event, some alch some quest items to make somthing new.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hampy

We shall fight for our right, a better server to play on!

We sure will! This idea can solve a lot of problems. I can help the econemy and rise the player count. And help newbies fairly. A newbie can have some good stuff because of this and people can't moan about it because he acquired it fair and square and they had the same chances of getting it as that guy did.

Ravenblade1979 · #46 02-23-2007, 04:48 PM

The problem here is Bjorn. If he will accept it. So far anything that might help GK has been shot down.

hampy · #47 02-23-2007, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

This idea can solve a lot of problems.

Indeed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

rise the player count.

It indeed will, it will also bring people out of the trade room and create a new meeting point for people to come and socialize, while winning or losing their money

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

And help newbies fairly. A newbie can have some good stuff because of this and people can't moan about it because he acquired it fair and square and they had the same chances of getting it as that guy did.

Yeah it will, thats a good thing too. Seems as though the advantages raised abliterate the disadvantages

Gothika · #48 02-23-2007, 05:16 PM

The disadvantages are few and small. And there an lots of great advantages.

Ravenblade1979 · #49 02-23-2007, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

The disadvantages are few and small. And there an lots of great advantages.

Uh oh you said advantages. There goes the idea.

I want to see this one go through. Its a wicked idea.

Gothika · #50 02-23-2007, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Uh oh you said advantages. There goes the idea.

I want to see this one go through. Its a wicked idea.

Yeah, not that I'm blowing my own trumpet. But I think this is one the best idea's in a long time.
Anyway. We can use this idea on WoD aswell.

CidNight1142 · #51 02-23-2007, 05:57 PM

*note - I stopped reading at around post 25

I kind of like the casino idea, it sounds fun. It would have to be very carefully scripted to avoid inflation/deflation issues. It would probably need a full time GP to make sure its running smoothly and without corruption as well.

Ravenblade1979 · #52 02-23-2007, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CidNight1142

*note - I stopped reading at around post 25

I kind of like the casino idea, it sounds fun. It would have to be very carefully scripted to avoid inflation/deflation issues. It would probably need a full time GP to make sure its running smoothly and without corruption as well.

GP...thats a joke..only one left is Paul!o

hampy · #53 02-23-2007, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CidNight1142

*note - I stopped reading at around post 25

I kind of like the casino idea, it sounds fun. It would have to be very carefully scripted to avoid inflation/deflation issues. It would probably need a full time GP to make sure its running smoothly and without corruption as well.

Yeah, i'm pretty sure some logs could be set up to monitor whats going on, shouldn't be hard for someone to whizz through them to look for anything majorly out of the ordinary. (Happy b'day btw.

)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

GP...thats a joke..only one left is Paul!o

Yeah, Paul won't be back for a while also... it seems as though the current GK Administration do not want to hire anymore GPs, I don't blame them though recent GPs imo have not been up to standard (Not meant towards anyone in particular, just as a whole)

dNeonb · #54 02-23-2007, 06:57 PM

We actually gave more coins out than in the beginning when we released them. Raven asked me for a bag-refill, one thing of the refill was 20 eventoins. 2 days later he told me he evented everything off. That would make 10 ec's a day just from him and not counting the other events masters and the stuff besides the eventcoins.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Its not that easy. YOu first have to be reccomended by Sam to I think Bjorn...then ((I think its bjorn))

Don't just guess and start rumors. You should know things if you post them. I have nothing to do with that for ages.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Right now with Sam on vacation its hard to get a em bag refill.

Have a look at yourself, it's not my fault. I just do it like Sam. No list what the stuff we gave out was used for -> no new stuff. Next time think about what you complain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

The problem here is Bjorn. If he will accept it. So far anything that might help GK has been shot down.

I don't see how merging MMT and Bomboria trade helps GK

hampy · #55 02-23-2007, 07:09 PM

Bjorn, what do you think about this idea of a Casino being added to GK then? As you can see there is a good amount of support for this idea

*wonders what Mr. Boss Man thinks*

garglius1 · #56 02-23-2007, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dNeonb

I don't see how merging MMT and Bomboria trade helps GK

That would help GK short term, for a few weeks, there would be more ativity, then everything would go back to normal. A casino, on the other hand, would be when like alchemy came out. HUGE activity right at the beginning, then continuous activity forevermore. (Notice how many PMoPs, FHoMs, Marks are out there and DoV and DoPV recipes being made.) That was the last huge change the server got, other than magic, which didn't affect everything on as big a scale as alchemy. Time for something new and big!

Googi · #57 02-23-2007, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

But it's just as easy to lose as it is to win.

Let's assume this is the case. If people lose as much as they win, the total number of ECs wouldn't change, so how are you solving the problem?

garglius1 · #58 02-23-2007, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Googi

Let's assume this is the case. If people lose as much as they win, the total number of ECs wouldn't change, so how are you solving the problem?

Lets say person x puts in 1k plat in tokens and walks away with 10k plat in tokens. He trades that for 1 EC. (Using imaginary values to prove a point). Person y comes in with 10k plat in tokens and loses it all. 1 More EC was added to the economy. We would be playing with tokens, not EC, so they wouldn't fluctuate, only the tokens used to buy them

hampy · #59 02-23-2007, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garglius1

Lets say person x puts in 1k plat in tokens and walks away with 10k plat in tokens. He trades that for 1 EC. (Using imaginary values to prove a point). Person y comes in with 10k plat in tokens and loses it all. 1 More EC was added to the economy. We would be playing with tokens, not EC, so they wouldn't fluctuate, only the tokens used to buy them

Yeah, so you would need a certain amount of tokens to get items/ECs/money, perhaps there could be items which would need more tokens to get then others, then there is more reason to keep gambling to try and get more tokens.. weee fun!

Ravenblade1979 · #60 02-23-2007, 07:26 PM

Bjorn I am not gonna flame you here but I pm'd you my list of events that I did and who won as well as posted on the em forums. not my problem if you don't look. Well i already knew your answer on the MMT/Bomb trade thing Bjorn. YOu can't even upload a level in mmt that I made minor fixes too. thats why i pm'd stefan about my idea too. Something might actually happen. And I gave you at least 4 or 5 ideas what you could do with the building that bomb trade is in. I think the best is the Recipe Shop. And the ec's going in two days shows that I host.

Googi its a idea to say the least but I agree. The only thing thats gonna go up is plat...ppl will be buying that with dias and plat would be worth more, saphs will go up in price, carrots too and ppl will dopv like crazy. More then anything I think it will offset our current economy. I think just lowering the price of what costs what in the coin shop would do it.

Googi · #61 02-23-2007, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garglius1

Lets say person x puts in 1k plat in tokens and walks away with 10k plat in tokens. He trades that for 1 EC. (Using imaginary values to prove a point). Person y comes in with 10k plat in tokens and loses it all. 1 More EC was added to the economy. We would be playing with tokens, not EC, so they wouldn't fluctuate, only the tokens used to buy them

But that isn't increasing the number of ECs by "giving them out," that's increasing the number of ECs through currency conversion. If an equal amount of tokens are lost as are won, then, statistically speaking, the economic effect would be identical to just allowing people to convert 10K plat into 1 EC.

dNeonb · #62 02-23-2007, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Bjorn I am not gonna flame you here but I pm'd you my list of events that I did and who won as well as posted on the em forums. not my problem if you don't look. Well i already knew your answer on the MMT/Bomb trade thing Bjorn. YOu can't even upload a level in mmt that I made minor fixes too. thats why i pm'd stefan about my idea too. Something might actually happen. And I gave you at least 4 or 5 ideas what you could do with the building that bomb trade is in. I think the best is the Recipe Shop. And the ec's going in two days shows that I host.

Reading the thread it's not only me who dislikes your idea about Bomb trade. No, I don't have your MMT level and I also got no pm with the list of events. But I read the thread yestrday and I'm not gonna post here what reading it tells me about what you said to me.

garglius1 · #63 02-23-2007, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Googi

But that isn't increasing the number of ECs by "giving them out," that's increasing the number of ECs through currency conversion. If an equal amount of tokens are lost as are won, then, statistically speaking, the economic effect would be identical to just allowing people to convert 10K plat into 1 EC.

Not if you have the machine take plat and dish out tokens, many games work on the fact that you can trade in x money for y tokens then then tokens for prizes. This would be convsersion, and pointless. If you had the slot take plat and then you could either lose it all, or gain tokens if you won, it would stop conversion from happening

Ravenblade1979 · #64 02-23-2007, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dNeonb

Reading the thread it's not only me who dislikes your idea about Bomb trade. No, I don't have your MMT level and I also got no pm with the list of events. But I read the thread yestrday and I'm not gonna post here what reading it tells me about what you said to me.

I pm'd you on gk the list. its the same one as i posted on em forums. I sent you the MMT level twice now. Both times in a zip file. Look I want sam back he's easier to deal with then you Bjorn. I don't care if I get a refill. I will just keep hosting Bog Arena and let ppl kill themselves. I had one person be nice enough to give me two sacks of holding to event off. I will survive doing those and the mass amount of maps I got.

Ravenblade1979 · #65 02-23-2007, 08:24 PM

About my idea for trade...at least its a idea that would have been new and kept ppl's interest for a few weeks. All they do now is sit in trade and lame outside and when i host bog spar kill. What does that tell you about the current way this game is heading?

Googi · #66 02-23-2007, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garglius1

Not if you have the machine take plat and dish out tokens, many games work on the fact that you can trade in x money for y tokens then then tokens for prizes. This would be convsersion, and pointless. If you had the slot take plat and then you could either lose it all, or gain tokens if you won, it would stop conversion from happening

No it wouldn't. Suppose that there's a machine where I have a 50% chance of losing whatever I put in and a 50% chance of receiving twice the value of the plat I put in in tokens (such a machine would statistically break even). For the sake of simplicity, we'll assume that if I put in 500 plat and win, I get 1000 tokens (if I put in 500 and lose, I obviously get zero.) Playing the machine 20 times would result in an average payout of 10000 tokens (I should win 1000 tokens about ten times and win nothing about ten times). If 10000 tokens = 1 EC (which it would have to if we're operating from the premise that 10000 plat = 20 diamonds = 1 EC is the "ideal" EC value) then the average time that I put 10000 plat into the machine I get 1 EC. I am doing what amounts to a currency conversion.

Earl_Having_It_Large · #67 02-23-2007, 10:47 PM

i fully support this idea about the Casino.. i think it would do great thinks for graal kingdoms! hope to see this idea put into the game

garglius1 · #68 02-23-2007, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Googi

No it wouldn't. Suppose that there's a machine where I have a 50% chance of losing whatever I put in and a 50% chance of receiving twice the value of the plat I put in in tokens (such a machine would statistically break even). For the sake of simplicity, we'll assume that if I put in 500 plat and win, I get 1000 tokens (if I put in 500 and lose, I obviously get zero.) Playing the machine 20 times would result in an average payout of 10000 tokens (I should win 1000 tokens about ten times and win nothing about ten times). If 10000 tokens = 1 EC (which it would have to if we're operating from the premise that 10000 plat = 20 diamonds = 1 EC is the "ideal" EC value) then the average time that I put 10000 plat into the machine I get 1 EC. I am doing what amounts to a currency conversion.

Yes, but you have to assume that some people will win more and some will lose more, and as you know in all casinos, the house always wins. Make it more like 33% win 66% lose.

Googi · #69 02-24-2007, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garglius1

Yes, but you have to assume that some people will win more and some will lose more

This is true if you only play a few times. If you play a bunch of times, your record will come to be a pretty close reflection of the probabilities.

Quote:

Originally Posted by garglius1

and as you know in all casinos, the house always wins. Make it more like 33% win 66% lose.

All that changes is the rate of conversion. At a 1/3 win rate and 2/3 lose rate, it would take an average of 15000 plat to get an EC. So EC prices would be 15000 plat = 30 diamonds = 1 EC, which defeats our purpose.

Gothika · #70 02-24-2007, 01:22 AM

Googi, your expecting people for every time they win 1. They loose 1. It is possible for people to win 10 times in a row.

Googi · #71 02-24-2007, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

Googi, your expecting people for every time they win 1. They loose 1. It is possible for people to win 10 times in a row.

It's possible for people to lose 10 times in a row and (in a 50/50 scenario) will happen on average the same number of times a person wins 10 times in a row. I'm talking about averages which are what's important when talking about what kind of influence this will have on the economy.

(The odds of losing or winning 10 times in a row in a 50/50 scenario, by the way, are 0.1%).

Ravenblade1979 · #72 02-24-2007, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Googi

It's possible for people to lose 10 times in a row and (in a 50/50 scenario) will happen on average the same number of times a person wins 10 times in a row. I'm talking about averages which are what's important when talking about what kind of influence this will have on the economy.

(The odds of losing or winning 10 times in a row in a 50/50 scenario, by the way, are 0.1%).

Exactly how many casino games have you played? Out of 10 ppl I know only 1 has any luck getting 10 in a row. Myself out of 10 pulls on slots I will win maybe 2 or 3 times total.

Gothika · #73 02-24-2007, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Exactly how many casino games have you played? Out of 10 ppl I know only 1 has any luck getting 10 in a row. Myself out of 10 pulls on slots I will win maybe 2 or 3 times total.

Yeah, that happens. Just because the odds are 50/50 it doesn't mean you win 1 you lose 1. It's still totally random.

hampy · #74 02-24-2007, 07:04 PM

Yeah, but I think what Googi is saying would be that if the odds were 50/50 then it would just spread the money around. Not necessarily to the same person though, e.g if 100,000 plat was gambled 100,000 plat will be given back out (If you understand what I mean) more like the money would get spread around between players which also isn't a bad thing+_+

Ravenblade1979 · #75 02-24-2007, 08:22 PM

No but they try to make things realistic on the game so they would have to do the same and again out of 10 spins you have only a 50% chance of winning. And there will be days when you don't win anything.

Googi · #76 02-24-2007, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Exactly how many casino games have you played? Out of 10 ppl I know only 1 has any luck getting 10 in a row. Myself out of 10 pulls on slots I will win maybe 2 or 3 times total.

So the probability probably wasn't 50/50?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gothika

Yeah, that happens. Just because the odds are 50/50 it doesn't mean you win 1 you lose 1. It's still totally random.

It appears you don't understand statistics. Go to Wikipedia. Type in "law of averages" and read up. Try "law of large numbers" too if you think you're really cool.

jonnyrocks2 · #77 02-24-2007, 09:13 PM

Well, really it depends on how they program it Googi, they may put the odds against the player, or for the player...just depends.

Ravenblade1979 · #78 02-24-2007, 09:14 PM

Err still Googi there are a lot of other factors you have to add into all of this. Amount of people using the machines, how much, what the scripts or script will be doing. A lot more things need to be factored in then just one person.

Googi · #79 02-24-2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonnyrocks2

Well, really it depends on how they program it Googi, they may put the odds against the player, or for the player...just depends.

I dealt with this issue above. All that this would effect would be the conversion rate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

Amount of people using the machines, how much

I've said this. Even if one person plays only a few times an has an unlikely big win or big loss (in fact, if a lot of people play, it's statistically likely that a few people will win big or lose big), the total effect on the economy will be nearly identical to simply allowing people to convert plat to ECs directly at the consequent rate created by the machine's probability because total plays will probably easily be in excess of 1000.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

what the scripts or script will be doing. A lot more things need to be factored in then just one person.

You believe that it's possible to write a script that can't be reduced to a conversion rate? I'd like to see that.

Ravenblade1979 · #80 02-24-2007, 09:27 PM

Ok plain and simple have you included ALL variables before you started arguing about this. Its not as simple as you think.