4 Years of being stagnant

[Crimson2005]

I hope you're happy Master Storm and co. You've had 4 years to make progress and it's actually gone backwards. How did you do it? I didn't even know that was possible, it really is astonishing. Abysmal playercount, awful hit detection and clueless staff are just a few of the hundreds problems on Classic right now, I can't list them all as Christmas is coming.

Classic could literally be weeks away from being removed, yet it's getting even worse. I hope you're pleased with it, Storm. It's pretty much all your fault in my opinion and probably not mine alone. You've had 4 years, tell us your excuse and how you can justify 4 years of nothing.

On Classic we have a Hit Detection which can't detect hits. We have had more movement systems than quests. The quests that have been released have been sub-par at best and redone a few times I think too. Really don't deserve any players, can you blame us for playing elsewhere?

Some of us have expressed how we feel already yet it seems it just falls on deaf ears. This thread is going to be for people to write in how they feel about Classic and the direction it's going in. Staff and Developers of Classic take note.

[xnervNATx]

ive been hiding this for some time but, i honestly think master storm want classic to die . no matter what we say , he doesnt give a sht. And i really think the staff there are not even giving their 100% to make classic update , wtf is this joke releasing a dumb npc called love , all its does is put heart on top of your head , were you working on that for past months?

[maximus_asinus]

Of course Storm doesn't want the server to die. I'll agree that he has been partly to blame for its current state due to his indecisiveness, but you can't put all the fault on his shoulders. Look at the LAT team, they've spent the last years trying to one up their predecessors, erasing some good work and potential quests. Add to that the whole division was in complete chaos, there was no communication with any other person so it took weeks instead of days to complete simple projects. I'll even take part of the blame, I spent all these years criticizing the teams without really offering my abilities to help out (the times I held a position, I was in it merely to work on my own projects, and I'd submit my scraps as work).

Right now they've got someone in place who is actually doing something for a change. I've talked to Thor on a few issues, and he and whoever is on his team seems to be willing to reach a middle ground between the newbies asking for new content, and the oldbies demanding everything be left how it was. Hell, he is even open to player created quests (or thats what I was lead to believe) which I'm willing to do. If you feel Classic has been wronged, why don't you get off your collective asses and work on something to help redeem the server?

[Kill]

The "new" HD is appauling.
I get flawed in some spars and cannot hit anyone in CTF.
It is an absolute joke and I hope it gets removed as soon as possible. This is not a HD, it is a mockery of Classic and everything about the server.

The HD is supposed to be the most important part of Classic; since that is what you predominantly do on the server: Spar, PK, and events. Clearly this is not the case as it is not taking into account the majority feeling of the change, (90% are not happy with the new HD. Click source: HERE )

If pretty much everyone (excluding who made it) hates the HD, then they won't play the server. Simple. That explains why Classic's playercount has decreased all of a sudden, and won't get back up until this HD is sorted out because without the HD the server is virtually unplayable.

I agree with Xaphan's post entirely. Along with Xaphan (although a bit earlier) I started Graal/Classic 4-5 years ago, and I've seen the changes it's gone through, and I've seen the failures that have come and gone, but Storm has been the center of it all and has focussed on his "life" more than Classic, his care factor wasn't there or else he would've left his position long ago - someone else which was more active would have taken his spot and fixed things, made better decisions, hired people who aren't idiots and make Classic go in the right direction.

Over the past 5 years I've seen virtually no change in Classic, there have been no quests or anything major. It's always been tiny minor releases which have made the players angry, frustrated and made them realise that over the past half-decade there has been nothing major added. So what have they been doing all this time?! created a crappy unplayable HD, that's what.

The problem with Classic is that it's stuck between it being unable to go back in time and be the same as the successful Graal2001 version it was back in the day but also not with the current times. It's stuck inbetween those two eras and failing at being either one.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

I'll agree that he has been partly to blame for its current state due to his indecisiveness, but you can't put all the fault on his shoulders. Look at the LAT team, they've spent the last years trying to one up their predecessors, erasing some good work and potential quests. Add to that the whole division was in complete chaos, there was no communication with any other person so it took weeks instead of days to complete simple projects. I'll even take part of the blame, I spent all these years criticizing the teams without really offering my abilities to help out (the times I held a position, I was in it merely to work on my own projects, and I'd submit my scraps as work).

Right now they've got someone in place who is actually doing something for a change. I've talked to Thor on a few issues, and he and whoever is on his team seems to be willing to reach a middle ground between the newbies asking for new content, and the oldbies demanding everything be left how it was. Hell, he is even open to player created quests (or thats what I was lead to believe) which I'm willing to do. If you feel Classic has been wronged, why don't you get off your collective asses and work on something to help redeem the server?

You have got to be kidding. The two people who have posted in this thread above you are players of the server and have been regular and consistent players for years. They have stuck through the crap, unlike the rest of you older players who come in every couple of months and decide to give your opinion. These people are players, not developers and as far as I know they have no development capabilities nor should they need them. The point of the thread was pretty obviously outlining the regression within recent years alone. It really has little to do with Massokre or Hell Raven, because these players played through those times and it isn't built up angst originating from those ex staff members. They've got someone in who is doing something? Yeah, regressing it more and adding crappy replacements or incentives to log on.

Within nearly a year we've had two quests, bowling, a new hit detection, and the recently added map system. We had the hearts already, we had the Knife of Fiends already, so all we really gained out of the exhausting content was the hammer, which was scripted back when Massokre was around. We had a hit detection, but now because it has completely changed the regulars can't enjoy the regular activities they did and it really is not a case of adjusting. Bowling was terribly made and I've already explained that, and the map system is something that is terribly easy to do, so really what is positively coming out of this? It's pretty much all regression of content like what was said in the opening post.

Players should not have to develop to enjoy the activities they were doing for years while the staff teams ****ed around, they should be playing with consistency.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

If you feel Classic has been wronged, why don't you get off your collective asses and work on something to help redeem the server?

Sorry, but Graal is advertised as a game, and to the average player, they should never have to worry about 'helping' a server be fun.

[maximus_asinus]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

Sorry, but Graal is advertised as a game, and to the average player, they should never have to worry about 'helping' a server be fun.

if they want to have fun they shouldn't be playing a server under development. Complaining about this is only a waste of energy, if you truely want something done, you can lend a hand.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

if they want to have fun they shouldn't be playing a server under development. Complaining about this is only a waste of energy, if you truely want something done, you can lend a hand.

What are you talking about? Server under development? Any server on the Cclassic list is not 'under development'. It's there as a representative server of Graal and should be treated as such. People have to pay for access to the classic servers, so they're paying for Classic as well. If it's under development it should be an UC server that's not on the main list.

[maximus_asinus]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

What are you talking about? Server under development? Any server on the Cclassic list is not 'under development'. It's there as a representative server of Graal and should be treated as such. People have to pay for access to the classic servers, so they're paying for Classic as well. If it's under development it should be an UC server that's not on the main list.

You're just arguing semantics. You and I both know the server is under development. If you're arguing that it should be hidden while it is in development, then you'll have no objections from me, but trying to argue its current status based on where it is listed seems stupid, and I won't accept that as an arguement.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

You're just arguing semantics. You and I both know the server is under development. If you're arguing that it should be hidden while it is in development, then you'll have no objections from me, but trying to argue its current status based on where it is listed seems stupid, and I won't accept that as an arguement.

Online servers are always being developed. Always additions, always fixes, that does not mean they are 'under development'. Now, I agree, Classic seems to be more under development than being a live developing server... but that is no players responsibility. As long as it is on the classic server list it should not be recognized as under development. So you can especially not claim that to players who are paying for access to it. You have to think about how a new player, who has never browsed the forums or ever heard of Graal is going to see things. They try out Graal, see a list of servers to try out and log on Classic. It does not mention 'under development' anywhere. Oh no, their 4 whole ****ing hours of observer time has ran out, but they want to see more so they pay for an upgrade. They have no idea they're paying for a server that is under development until they really start getting into things and seeing how much of a true mess Classic is.

Sorry, but Graal is a game foremost as well as a business. If people are having to pay for access to this game, they should never have to worry about needing to develop to actually have fun on it. As far as it appears now, Classic is one of the servers that represents the Graal business model, and will be treated as such until someone wises up and removes it.

[Luda]

Hey Stefan, just curious..do you ever read these threads?

[Ares]

i cant imagine how fun classic events would be with the default hd

[Crono]

Originally Posted by Luda

Hey Stefan, just curious..do you ever read these threads?

Why would he care?

[Mighty]

I'd hate to see this but I think Classic needs to be moved from the server list to UC but still being accessible by non gold members (wich I'm sure is possible) so it doesn't prevent players and those who want to develop from logging in. Although I'm afraid if it were to be moved that it wouldn't come back + that it would take a lot of time and I'm not refering to quality but haven't you noticed we've only had two developers for a long time. Those of you with development skill who complain or really want to see something happend to Classic why don't you help them. As far as I know pretty much all the latest releases has been made by Thor alone who actually deserves credit. He didn't give up like many other, he keeps going even though many of you give him a lot of crap. Sure some releases are to be argueable and wrong if you believe so but what do you really expect from a two-man/one man team.

Back to the moving part. Once there is enough new good content, announce it and then move it back. I believe this would bring a far much bigger playercount than there has been lately.

Imagine the server being "gone" for a while and then brought back, once back you read about it and would of course log on to check it out. Then you notice a major release like for example a full player-reset wich would make events etc more competetive, a start with level1 sword, 3 hearts and your the way to quest up to what we currently have.

I don't know about you but I'd find it very interesting. A release like what I stated as an example might not need the server being removed though, I don't know, but it's important that it all gets released together.

[xnervNATx]

Originally Posted by Mighty

I'd hate to see this but I think Classic needs to be moved from the server list to UC but still being accessible by non gold members (wich I'm sure is possible) so it doesn't prevent players and those who want to develop from logging in. Although I'm afraid if it were to be moved that it wouldn't come back + that it would take a lot of time and I'm not refering to quality but haven't you noticed we've only had two developers for a long time. Those of you with development skill who complain or really want to see something happend to Classic why don't you help them. As far as I know pretty much all the latest releases has been made by Thor alone who actually deserves credit. He didn't give up like many other, he keeps going even though many of you give him a lot of crap. Sure some releases are to be argueable and wrong if you believe so but what do you really expect from a two-man/one man team.

Back to the moving part. Once there is enough new good content, announce it and then move it back. I believe this would bring a far much bigger playercount than there has been lately.

Imagine the server being "gone" for a while and then brought back, once back you read about it and would of course log on to check it out. Then you notice a major release like for example a full player-reset wich would make events etc more competetive, a start with level1 sword, 3 hearts and your the way to quest up to what we currently have.

I don't know about you but I'd find it very interesting. A release like what I stated as an example might not need the server being removed though, I don't know, but it's important that it all gets released together.

id find it interesting too but you know that if the server is moved to UC its will still be dead even after its come back . yet i dont think its would come back. Still the level 1 sword and 3hp is a good idea. And to answer maximus first post , why dont YOU go and help the server? i never saw you help it , all you do is shttalk about us sitting on ours a**. if i had any experience i would go and help classic dev , but i have none , surprising? i dont thing so. and for someone that log on classic once in a month , i dont think you have right to say anything about us.

about the hd , i think your right kill , even in ctf sumo people can hardly hit me in the water , ask mystic i turned around him for about 10 seconds before he hit me in the water. And about all these polls , 90% are just useless.

[Crimson2005]

Originally Posted by Ares

i cant imagine how fun classic events would be with the default hd

Have you tried this new HD in events? Fun is the last thing that comes from it.

[DustyPorViva]

The only problem I have with Classic going UC is that it might not ever come back.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

The only problem I have with Classic going UC is that it might not ever come back.

That is not a problem, someone capable will pick it up some day.

[xnervNATx]

Originally Posted by Rufus

That is not a problem, someone capable will pick it up some day.

i hope that person is not named thor or whitedragon

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by xnervNATx

i hope that person is not named thor or whitedragon

I said someone capable.

[Ares]

Originally Posted by Crimson2005

Have you tried this new HD in events? Fun is the last thing that comes from it.

i dont think i have, there's usually 5-6 people on the server so there's no events being held

[maximus_asinus]

just like someone capable will eventually pick up Graal2001

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

just like someone capable will eventually pick up Graal2001

Yeah, like the day when you start posting unpredictable responses.

[Bell]

I'm trying very hard to keep an unbiased and impersonal attitude towards Classic but after 8 years and over 10,000 hours of actual play time there, you'll forgive me my slip, I hope. If it weren't for Thor, Classic would of been gone a long time ago. I often wonder why he still tries as hard as he does to please all of you when he gets nothing but grief. To be totally honest with you all, Rufus and Thor would make a great team but I can't even begin to imagine that being a team that could work together without killing each other. Hence killing Classic even more.

I'm currently trying my best to find a good solution for Classic but I will readily admit, I don't forsee a good outcome in the future as long as Thor tries to continue to please the oldbies as well as try to draw in new people to build a new community.

[xnervNATx]

how can he please us with npc such as Love* idont think new players will just stay because you can throw hearts in 4 directions . he had the chance to please everyone when he became dev admin , he failed and now classic is at his lowest

[DarkCloud_PK]

the love npc has been around way longer than thor has been in staff.
i think storm made it a very long time ago.

[Remonq]

hey guys, i know i don't post here often but for those of you who don't know me, i'm Ranger, i recently came back to classic as FAQ Admin, and i've been playing for roughly 7 or 8 years now.

i've watched and supported each development team that has passed through for the past few years. Thor is surprisingly doing the best, but that can mostly be contributed to the loudest voices being silenced via inactivity. i've always been of the opinion that storm should be removed and honestly, i'm wondering why PWA hasn't done it yet. his gross negligence is causing extreme duress amongst many and he has done nothing good that i can recall. any progress has come out of the Dev Admins, and THAT progress is always criticized by the community that it is given to. i'm not saying that that criticism isn't deserved but it sure as hell effects server morale. and right now, morale is at it's all-time lowest.

i left classic because i was frustrated with the tatsumi's handling of the FAQ team. i have heard several theories about why i came back, but the truth is i wanted to come back to see if i could make a difference somehow. what classic REALLY needs is a revamp of it's staff divisions. if the staff divisions can coordinate and compromise between each other then there would be no need for a manager. first of all, we would have to get at least 1 new administrator, i know nighty always comes around when things pick up. some people would like to see him removed but i don't see him as an extreme problem.

[maximus_asinus]

Originally Posted by Rufus

Yeah, like the day when you start posting unpredictable responses.

I just find it funny how you have pretty much the same track record running Graal2001 as Storm has had with Classic (yours is probably slightly better) and you're here criticizing him. When is Graal2001's release date?

[xnervNATx]

lol ranger ur right when you say storm need to be removed.

[Remonq]

imo they should unban mog and get him to create a classic gscript tutorial

[Oni]

OK im just furious.
For 1, i dont care if maximus asinus knows me, doesnt knows me, cares or doesnt care. All i know is he doesnt have room to post because HE DOESNT PLAY CLASSIC ANYMORE.

Classic is bullsh** PERIOD. You have a manager who is ALL TALK AND NO SHOW (and his talk is even bullsh!t). HE HAS DONE NOTHING. Thor has done quadruple the ammount MASTER STORM HAS EVEN THOUGHT OF DOING.

THOR ISNT THE PROBLEM. MASTER STORM IS. Give us a new god damn manager NOW!. Why does UN, ERA, Zodiac, and even NPULSE get new Managers to give a go @ the server. ANYONE, and i meen, ANYONE would be better then master storm. He doesnt do jack ****, but watch the server die. I dont care if you guys dont know a suitable replacement, GET ONE.

THOR ill admit, is one of the hardest working devs. The only problem with Thor is, HE DOESNT KNOW WHAT NEEDS TO BE RELEAED AT WHAT TIME. He has the skill and work ethic, but honestly has no idea what he should be doing. He needs a manager and others, to tell his ass what to do becasue what hes doing isnt helping anyhting.

Im dead serious, im not playing this server anymore until you lazy globals get off your @#!# and fire master storm and give us the manager (or at least try) that we deserve.

And if you dont care that a player like me, or other players like me are quitting? Then !$# you and gtfo because you should.

ASINUS SHUT UP!!! U - HAV - NO - IDEA , go back to ugcc

[Crimson2005]

I am going to repeat myself: 4 years of nothing.

Let's look at what has has released so far in the Thor/Storm era. Bowling which was fun for a couple of days then everyone lost interest, A gimped hit detection that doesnt detect hits, 2 quests that we had to do to get the hearts we already had back, a map system where we already had the maps. Thor released the hammer, which he himself didn't make, just released. Our most recent addition was the Love NPC that's going to last for a couple of days which again, he apparently didn't even make, just released. All that has done is make Classic regress, not progress. I think it's also safe to say that the whole development team does not have a clue.

Why can't everyone see that Classic can not seriously move forward with Master Storm and Thor at the core of it? Master Storm is seriously spineless with his developers and always has been for as long as I've played.

I'd also like to hear from Thor himself in this thread, not the people he's getting to post for him.

[maximus_asinus]

Originally Posted by Oni

stupidity

While you were typing this post I was PKing in level14 and winning an LMS. Where were you?

[Oni]

not playing classics trash HD, i havent seen you in months if not years, just shut up dude. Has your way of thinking improved classic? NO! Your just like a washed up republican who still wants to dump money into the iraqi war, gtfo.
WE WANT CHANGE WE WANT CHANGE WE WANT CHANGE WE WANT CHANGE WE WANT CHANGE

[Remonq]

ya know oni, if you were actually able to calm down, make sense and act mature people might actually listen to you. you are pointing out all the problems but offering no solutions whatsoever. okay, we get rid of storm, then what? you are not thinking ahead sufficiently enough

[Oni]

You want a decision? You cant handle it but here it goes.

Make Rufus Dev Admin(Do u see what him and dusty do with bomy?!). Make Zip manager (his ideas are actually good but i dont kno if hes joking) Ranger your fine as a Faq admin. Get all the staff together, talk about what we want and what we need. Release, work, release, work, Motivate the people, get everyone involved, AND ATTEMPT A TRUE REVIVAL.

thor can stick around, but he's not the type to be making decisions, he just needs to be told what to do.

[DarkCloud_PK]

Originally Posted by Oni

You want a decision? You cant handle it but here it goes.

Make Rufus Dev Admin(Do u see what him and dusty do with bomy?!).

No. Rufus isnt a developer, and while maximus attacks him for it, he's right. No, I dont see what he and dusty do with bomy island, because it isnt done, theres no expected release, and its been like that for awhile. Is that what you want? Things to be stagnant some more like that?

[Oni]

Bomy is kind of a UC SERVER?
maybe if the server was live such as Classic, there would be more motivation to put out work.

[DarkCloud_PK]

Originally Posted by Oni

Bomy is kind of a UC SERVER?
maybe if the server was live such as Classic, there would be more motivation to put out work.

There isnt very much more motiviation left. Until recently anyway.
Bottom line is, things really don't matter until they're completed and released.

[Oni]

Trust me i bet Rufus would much rather manage classic over bomy island if he got the chance.