64 bit support

ReBorn_Spirit · #1 03-24-2007, 08:56 AM

Should say Lack of, but seriously people. Some acknoledgement that 64bit atleast exists would be great.

Did you know that your crappy little graal client won't even lauch on a 64 bit Environment?!

I am seriously annoyed at this, I just want to get on the game and play. I can't even do that, I might have to end up thinking of moving on into another game, but I really like graal for what potential there is here.

Maybe I should find someone to just hack the client and remove that stupid "memory checker" so I can just play without being stopped by some fickle little bit of programming that THINKS I am trying to hack just because I'm on a 64bit XP copy.

Skyld · #2 03-24-2007, 11:24 AM

First, drop the angst.

Second, will you explain exactly what happens when you try to start the client? Does it start and close again? Does it write anything to graal4console.log? Does it write anything to the Windows event log? Do any dialog boxes with errors come up?

ReBorn_Spirit · #3 03-25-2007, 05:36 AM

the "anti memory editor" built into the graal program prevents any and all logs from being written to disk for debug purposes. Also the Windows System event viewer will not log it because its graal4.exe that closes itself, not an actuall error.

So unless its re-written legitimately, my only choice to ever play graal again on this PC is to spen a good week restoring my computer to a 32 bit state, and to be honest. You have no idea how much I hate doing that, however I might as well start soon. Its just too bad I don't exactly have a DVD-rom to use anymore seeing mine just died on my PC. Its going to be a bit before I can get a replacement, so installing windows is out of the question right now anyways.

Any idea who I should contact to rewrite graal for 64 bit? Or should I do the run around in a circle dance some more?

Falcor · #4 03-25-2007, 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReBorn_Spirit

the "anti memory editor" built into the graal program prevents any and all logs from being written to disk for debug purposes. Also the Windows System event viewer will not log it because its graal4.exe that closes itself, not an actuall error.

So unless its re-written legitimately, my only choice to ever play graal again on this PC is to spen a good week restoring my computer to a 32 bit state, and to be honest. You have no idea how much I hate doing that, however I might as well start soon. Its just too bad I don't exactly have a DVD-rom to use anymore seeing mine just died on my PC. Its going to be a bit before I can get a replacement, so installing windows is out of the question right now anyways.

Any idea who I should contact to rewrite graal for 64 bit? Or should I do the run around in a circle dance some more?

You seriously have an attitude problem. Do you think if you sound angry that people will be more inclined to help you? Thats false logic my friend, so next time you ask for help, don't start crying like a toddler.

I don't even know why you need to have your computer on a 64 bit OS. are you doing high-precision mathematical calculations? Do you have more than 4 GB of ram? 32 bit emulation is sufficient for most ordinary tasks (Including playing high-end games)

Perhaps the reason that there is no 64 bit support for Graal is the same reason that Adobe didn't release a 64bit flash plug-in. Simply no market for it, wasted resources... Until the majority of program writers move their default platform to 64 bit, it will suffer the same kind of support Linux has for drivers.

ReBorn_Spirit · #5 03-25-2007, 11:15 PM

Alright Falcor, think of this once.
That new Vista came out takes atleast a good 1GB of ram just to run properly, now on most 32 bit systems thats 1/4th their max capacity. But the real fact is, its actually about 1/2 or 3/4th their capacity because not all boards actaully support a full 4 GB's of ram. Did you know that Oblivion takes 512 to 1GB of ram to run properly? If your doing math that is 2GB right there, now on most board's, thats the most you'll ever get right there. However if you wanted to stay ontop of your hardware updating things you'd go for 3 GB of ram. Soon 4.. Just because of the extras that are starting to come out.

In compairison, 32 bit has its days numbers, 64 bit doesn't. The actual Ram support is built into the XP OS as about 128 GB or something, no way you can top that really. Not to mention the fact I can actually hold all 8GB's of Ram and use Both of my processors on XP PRO (32 & 64 bit). I'd much rather stay with my 64 bit OS because of future requirements for these huge applications.

So go ahead, keep thinking they should only make 32 bit appz, its a dead architecture soon anyways. In my personal opinion your view on 64 bit being a waist, is rather ironic, as I think further development of 32 bit is waisting ones time.

** Told DEP to ignore graal, so I finally launches after I run about 30 other programs. This is rediculous.

Googi · #6 03-25-2007, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReBorn_Spirit

its a dead architecture soon anyways.

No, not "soon".

Admins · #7 03-25-2007, 11:27 PM

To be honest, if that little company that made the OS is unable to make it compatible with existing programs then it is a shame, other companies are able to write things that work (Apple). Of course I would like to work on making Graal more compatible with 64 bit systems, but there are priorities. Like I said we might soon be able to debug Graal on 64 bit Vista, but I cannot guarantee when a compatble Graal version will be released.

ReBorn_Spirit · #8 03-25-2007, 11:28 PM

At this point I could try several different beta versions for you, as I have nothing better to do. Or what actually might work in this case, seeing that the current graal version won't launch at all at this time.

*Basically hold down the enter key on the graal4 shortcut until a window or two pops up or the system finally crashes from running the cpu(s) over 100%. (the later of system crashing occurs more often, almost always infact)

Falcor · #9 03-26-2007, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReBorn_Spirit

Alright Falcor, think of this once.
That new Vista came out takes at least a good 1GB of ram just to run properly, now on most 32 bit systems thats 1/4th their max capacity. But the real fact is, its actually about 1/2 or 3/4th their capacity because not all boards actually support a full 4 GB's of ram. Did you know that Oblivion takes 512 to 1GB of ram to run properly? If your doing math that is 2GB right there, now on most board's, thats the most you'll ever get right there. However if you wanted to stay on top of your hardware updating things you'd go for 3 GB of ram. Soon 4.. Just because of the extras that are starting to come out.

In comparison, 32 bit has its days numbers, 64 bit doesn't. The actual Ram support is built into the XP OS as about 128 GB or something, no way you can top that really. Not to mention the fact I can actually hold all 8GB's of Ram and use Both of my processors on XP PRO (32 & 64 bit). I'd much rather stay with my 64 bit OS because of future requirements for these huge applications.

So go ahead, keep thinking they should only make 32 bit appz, its a dead architecture soon anyways. In my personal opinion your view on 64 bit being a waist, is rather ironic, as I think further development of 32 bit is waisting ones time.

** Told DEP to ignore graal, so I finally launches after I run about 30 other programs. This is ridiculous.

The reality is that, right now, 64-Bit OS is more or less like the unstable branch of any OSS. Its got the latest features, but is largely unsupported and is not production-ready. The only 64-Bit OS (Aside from UNIX/Linux) that the main-stream gets to enjoy is Windows Vista (And to a much smaller extent, XP 64). And that has been release for only a few months. 32-Bit platforms have been around for much longer.

Its like the switch from DVDs to BluRay or HD-DVD. It will take time for people to make the switch. (A very long time) And while this is happening, its not wise to alienate your already existing (and large) base of 32-Bit users by investing a lot of time into 64-Bit fixes/optimizations/etc that will only be enjoyed by a small percentage of the customer base. This is especially true since the 64 bit processors can run 32 bit programs, so by developing 32 bit programs you alienate no one.

ReBorn_Spirit · #10 03-26-2007, 03:58 AM

Yea ok, How about we just get some fix to get graal to work. Thats all I want to do K...

AbsoluteMonkey · #11 03-26-2007, 05:51 AM

I might be wrong on this, but I think you can tell Vista (In the compatibily options) that you want graal to run Windows XP SP2 compatible. Which also emulates 32-bit and puts the program in an allocated block of memory that is 32bit readable. This might solve the cheat reader error.

Angel_Light · #12 03-26-2007, 05:59 AM

Whats the point of even having a 64-bit system, Besides the Nintendo64 XD

kenyonandelliot · #13 03-26-2007, 06:50 AM

I had the same problem.. I reformatted to 32bit not to play Graal but because ATI messed up really badly, and 64bit has lots of problems that I doubt will ever get fixed.

But yeah, I agree with ReBorn_Spirit, while I had 64bit I had to go to my mom's computer and my parents yell at me for spending too much time on my mom's computer. Just start and get a 64bit computer and get someone to start debugging.

ReBorn_Spirit · #14 03-26-2007, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AbsoluteMonkey

I might be wrong on this, but I think you can tell Vista (In the compatibily options) that you want graal to run Windows XP SP2 compatible. Which also emulates 32-bit and puts the program in an allocated block of memory that is 32bit readable. This might solve the cheat reader error.

Unfortunately I have Windows XP PRO x64 (Based on the Windows 2003 Server technologies for 64 bit). This is not Vista, its actually an XP version. The big difference between 32 bit XP and 64 bit XP, is 64 bit XP either runs only 64 bit programs or 32 bit programs under its "32bit emulator". Unfortunately its not a true 32 bit environment so your programs can actually detect the few exabytes of memory such 64 bit architectures can support.

The best & most stable way to get graal to run on this 64 bit XP would be to recompile it for either XP x64 or windows 2003 x64. They are basically the same things, with a few minor differences. Chances are, if a 64bit version of the Windows Vista graal client were to be compiled it would have a fair chance of succeding.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angel_Light

Whats the point of even having a 64-bit system, Besides the Nintendo64 XD

Future use of computer technology and more advanced applications will call for more then the 32 bit limit of 4 GB of memory, 64 bit architectures can support well into the exabyte of memory. If you need more information I suggest you use Wiki to study up on it.
**here, read up on the "memory limitations"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/64_bit

** What is an exabit/exabyte, take a look
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte

Angel_Light · #15 03-27-2007, 03:29 AM

I know what bytes are and how they work , yibbibyte or however you spell, I'm just saying I dont really know any applications that run on 64-bit that can be run on 32-bit. oh well, I dont have the money to go buy a new OS or more RAM only have 512 MB right now