PW Admin opinion plz?

royce · #1 06-10-2002, 01:45 AM

Ok. First of all I would like to hear some opinions on this thread. Do you think that it is right, to use something that is on another up and running playerworld, excluding Graal 2002,2001, and Classic? Even though it was given to the playerworld from the owner of the other server, is that right? I mean, still its ripping what they have, no matter if you think about it as a gift or not, its cheap that you could not alteast make your own thing. Also, there is something else I would like to talk about. Do you think it is right, for a playerworld to find something then just modify it a bit, then call it theirs? Basically you spend a week on a script, after a month some ppl get it, then its all over the place. You dont want anyone to have it, everyone knows you made it. Here comes along a playerworld admin, sees that his staff DID NOT make it, but just modified it a bit. Seeing that it is on that playerworld, it is in ownership of that playerworld and the PW Owner is responsible for what goes on with that playerworld. Basically, before this dumb account suff, I could get bomy gfx, draw some big ears on them, then call them bemeys, then upload that to a non-p2p playerworld. I need some feedback, Gastly disaggrees with everything I say reguarding this.

warp2ukew · #2 06-10-2002, 01:53 AM

I know this cant be random coming from you so what up? and I think its alright to modify a script as long as it doesnt work the same

AlexH · #3 06-10-2002, 01:55 AM

You can't claim ideas.
So if you have something on your server then every other server has it too, there's nothing you can do about it.
But if the other servers have used your same script that's a different story.

royce · #4 06-10-2002, 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by warp2ukew
I know this cant be random coming from you so what up? and I think its alright to modify a script as long as it doesnt work the same

No no, Not just ripping a few lines of code. Maybe changing the string values, a little more script organization, then stamping your name on it. I am not really reffering to scripts, I am more concerned about other things at this moment, but I am trying to stay in the general area.

royce · #5 06-10-2002, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AlexH
You can't claim ideas.
So if you have something on your server then every other server has it too, there's nothing you can do about it.
But if the other servers have used your same script that's a different story.

I'm not saying its illegal. I am stating that you basically took no time to make your own. Instead, just take whatever is available. I call it Cheap. I have every right to go to someone and say I dislike your playerworld because you ripped from this server even though you are allowed to have it, without him yelling back at me.

warp2ukew · #6 06-10-2002, 02:00 AM

so sum1 rippes some scripts off your game or your gonna do it to some1 elses? anyway you should give credit toi the person who made the original script

royce · #7 06-10-2002, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by warp2ukew
so sum1 rippes some scripts off your game or your gonna do it to some1 elses? anyway you should give credit toi the person who made the original script

Lets say, your friend (partner owner) made the script. He gives it to someone and they use that while its somewhere else. Thats basically a rip-off. It shows that he/she is not capable of generating their own work.

konidias · #8 06-10-2002, 02:09 AM

#1. I wouldn't be stupid enough to allow others access to my scripts.

#2. I think if someone takes something, and modifies it a little bit, then that is stealing, and it can be removed from the server given enough evidence.

Stealing a script, re-organizing it, changing some variables, and stamping your name on it, does not make it yours. If the script does the exact same thing as the other pw's and it is THEIR code, then they can get Stefan or someone to check it and remove it.

Now there is a fine line between stealing something and copying something. If, for example, someone makes little round pets for their server, that look similar to bomies but not quite a bomy, yet the graphics and scripts our their own, then that is okay. If someone blatantly steals a script and changes some lines of code, then it's not right.

Of course there are some owners that don't know the npcs their staff make are actually stolen, so either way, the stuff should get removed.

BARGAD · #9 06-10-2002, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by konidias
#1. I wouldn't be stupid enough to allow others access to my scripts.

Like... I think he mean't for a PlayerWorld. It is quite hard to keep others away from your things if you do uppload it to the server and someone else also got the right to download levels from the server (Co-owner?!).

royce · #10 06-10-2002, 02:35 AM

Hows this Koni, someone that works for you that has all your graphics, gives me them and says I can do what I wish with them. I am allowed to do that because your guy said I could use it. Even though if you permitted it and still used it for you, thats basically telling everything that I cannot think of my own shiz. NOW, heres the seperate topic. - I take that gfx and maybe add a mustache to the characters and use that for a game I am making. How's that? Are you fine with that?

konidias · #11 06-10-2002, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by royce
Hows this Koni, someone that works for you that has all your graphics, gives me them and says I can do what I wish with them. I am allowed to do that because your guy said I could use it. Even though if you permitted it and still used it for you, thats basically telling everything that I cannot think of my own shiz. NOW, heres the seperate topic. - I take that gfx and maybe add a mustache to the characters and use that for a game I am making. How's that? Are you fine with that?

No one has access to FTP or NC on my server but me and the global admins, and no one ever will. Simple solution.

But about this, it still is stealing. That's basically the same thing as going through the graal images directory and using things from other pw's, since it isn't like they don't show up there anyway. Now if you have staff that you think are going to give stuff away to other pw's, just make them agree to a contract of some sort before they work for you, and make sure stefan knows that every person working for you has seen the contract, and that he has seen the contract, something along the lines of:

"Everything on <playerworld> and that is made for <playerworld> will only be used for <playerworld> and may not be used for anything else, or given out to people that are not currently staff on <playerworld>."

BARGAD · #12 06-10-2002, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by konidias

No one has access to FTP or NC on my server but me and the global admins, and no one ever will. Simple solution.

Not saying that you will... but what if the owner decides to give away levels, scripts and graphics to someone which was really made by the LATs, NATs and GATs?!

konidias · #13 06-10-2002, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BARGAD

Not saying that you will... but what if the owner decides to give away levels, scripts and graphics to someone which was really made by the LATs, NATs and GATs?!

To be honest, I think all of the stuff on the server belongs to the owner. (hence the name OWNER) The owner can do what they want with the stuff. Just like Stefan owns all of Graal, so he can take whatever he wants from any server. (although I don't think this is right, it's just the way I feel that it goes)

BARGAD · #14 06-10-2002, 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by konidias

To be honest, I think all of the stuff on the server belongs to the owner. (hence the name OWNER) The owner can do what they want with the stuff. Just like Stefan owns all of Graal, so he can take whatever he wants from any server. (although I don't think this is right, it's just the way I feel that it goes)

Ya most likly

Still... when I work for a server I do the work because I want it to be put up on that server... and not other servers x.x!

Milkdude99 · #15 06-10-2002, 03:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by konidias
#1. I wouldn't be stupid enough to allow others access to my scripts.

#2. I think if someone takes something, and modifies it a little bit, then that is stealing, and it can be removed from the server given enough evidence.

Stealing a script, re-organizing it, changing some variables, and stamping your name on it, does not make it yours. If the script does the exact same thing as the other pw's and it is THEIR code, then they can get Stefan or someone to check it and remove it.

Now there is a fine line between stealing something and copying something. If, for example, someone makes little round pets for their server, that look similar to bomies but not quite a bomy, yet the graphics and scripts our their own, then that is okay. If someone blatantly steals a script and changes some lines of code, then it's not right.

Of course there are some owners that don't know the npcs their staff make are actually stolen, so either way, the stuff should get removed.

I agree with you on this , but since Graal owns all , claims to anything is a mute point if the Graal Admin rules against you on it with Stefans or Unximads approval. As I am sure you have noticed we are not refered to as "Owners" any longer for the simple fact we have never really owned anything but Graal does and we just manage it thus we are Managers now not Owners.

royce · #16 06-10-2002, 03:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by konidias

To be honest, I think all of the stuff on the server belongs to the owner. (hence the name OWNER) The owner can do what they want with the stuff. Just like Stefan owns all of Graal, so he can take whatever he wants from any server. (although I don't think this is right, it's just the way I feel that it goes)

What about Ex-Owner?

ZanderX · #17 06-10-2002, 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by konidias

To be honest, I think all of the stuff on the server belongs to the owner. (hence the name OWNER) The owner can do what they want with the stuff. Just like Stefan owns all of Graal, so he can take whatever he wants from any server. (although I don't think this is right, it's just the way I feel that it goes)

Actually, we're Managers now, not Owners.

So we don't own anything.

Torankusu · #18 06-10-2002, 08:36 AM

Uh, anything in my webgifs that is not graal2001/graal2001/graal classic-only material, I am going to use if I need to.

Xbob42 · #19 06-10-2002, 10:45 AM

I don't think it's right to take someone else's very good graphics and use them. Like on NP for example they have some pretty nice flower graphics around tampus. I don't think it would be right if UN took them and started using themm all over.
Same with X. They have very nice cactus graphics. I don't think it's right if Delteria takes them and sticks them on there.

Those are very good graphics and I don't think they should be used on every other playerworld, unless the person that made them says it's okay, but it will still won't seem right entirely.

Now you see graphics like amz_chair.gif. I also notice that on NP there are lots of recolorations of them and the names changed. Like right now there's a blue version of it and the name was changed to bluewizardchair.gif The name of the person that recolored it.

Another example is the couch graphics. On Delteria you will see recolored versions of the couch and the filename was changed to hunter-couch.gif.

As for scripts. If the NPC was tooken and used without permission then thats bad, but if permission was given then I think it's okay.

Remember the SK-Hookshot that appeared on Doomsday, N-Pulse, and who knows how many other playerworlds.
Example:
NP has an NPC called the Grappling hook that does almost the same exact thing as the SK-Hookshot, only it is used to climb up mountain cliffs. It's a good chance it was just edited or some parts of the sk-hookshot was copy and pasted and/or edited.
I think this would be wrong if they did do that.

It is hard to prove an NPC was stolen unless its an NPC that is not oftenly seen on all playerworlds.

Torankusu · #20 06-10-2002, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Torankusu
Uh, anything in my webgifs that is not graal2001/graal2001/graal classic-only material, I am going to use if I need to.

Quote:

Originally posted by Xbob42
I don't think it's right to take someone else's very good graphics and use them. Like on NP for example they have some pretty nice flower graphics around tampus. I don't think it would be right if UN took them and started using themm all over.
Same with X. They have very nice cactus graphics. I don't think it's right if Delteria takes them and sticks them on there.

Those are very good graphics and I don't think they should be used on every other playerworld, unless the person that made them says it's okay, but it will still won't seem right entirely.

Uh, so what. They make a nice graphic, upload it, and expect it to not get used anywhere else? I don't read the maker's name or say "I MADE THIS." I just change it to "server-whateveritis.png/mng" So that it does not overwrite others' images. An example would be door.png. I keep getting the old ugly door.png because servers have that in their files. Ugh. That gets annoying.

konidias · #21 06-10-2002, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Torankusu
Uh, anything in my webgifs that is not graal2001/graal2001/graal classic-only material, I am going to use if I need to.

Shouldn't it be more of a Graal Gold servers thing? At least I think it is anyway.. you're not supposed to use any graphics from the Gold servers without consent from the manager of that server or whatever. That would make the most sense anyway.

edit: I use "oasis-<name>" for all of my server's images. Not just because I want people to know they are graphics for Oasis, but also because it's good organization. (so I can just look in the webgifs folder and see all oasis graphics in one place) Also what Torankusu said, it helps to not overwrite other graphics. Of course, ALL of Oasis graphics are new and made for that server.

Nemesis · #22 06-10-2002, 11:25 AM

If someone makes a script, and decides that he is going to give it to all other servers...That person can do so. It's not a rip off of an idea because it belongs to that person.

If someone makes something for the server, gets fired, inturn uses that same something for another server, that is allowed. I also believe in prior to hiring someone, you make them agree to what is made for the server, only remains on the server ,thus insuring that, that person does not go out and give out levels / scripts / gfx to other servers and or people to use.

But the creator of whatever should get full credit. IF you did not create it, and are giving it around, that is not allowed, and that is theft of an idea / work, that someone made in their time.

Also modifications and adjustments without the creators consent is illegal as well.

But this issue cna get bigger before it actually gets resolved. I know there are many sides to this coin we have, but then again, the way I view it is just another way to see it, in a different light.

mhermher · #23 06-10-2002, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by royce
Ok. First of all I would like to hear some opinions on this thread. Do you think that it is right, to use something that is on another up and running playerworld, excluding Graal 2002,2001, and Classic? Even though it was given to the playerworld from the owner of the other server, is that right? I mean, still its ripping what they have, no matter if you think about it as a gift or not, its cheap that you could not alteast make your own thing. Also, there is something else I would like to talk about. Do you think it is right, for a playerworld to find something then just modify it a bit, then call it theirs? Basically you spend a week on a script, after a month some ppl get it, then its all over the place. You dont want anyone to have it, everyone knows you made it. Here comes along a playerworld admin, sees that his staff DID NOT make it, but just modified it a bit. Seeing that it is on that playerworld, it is in ownership of that playerworld and the PW Owner is responsible for what goes on with that playerworld. Basically, before this dumb account suff, I could get bomy gfx, draw some big ears on them, then call them bemeys, then upload that to a non-p2p playerworld. I need some feedback, Gastly disaggrees with everything I say reguarding this.

Heres some fact:
About the frolic thing, you got nothing to do with. If KJL made it he choose where it shall be, he chose Maloria.

And about that graphic you say, it were given by Mista Micro and it was not as it is... it was crap, so we fixed it up alot.

What script have i EVER stole from you?
The lumberjacking? NO!
I made it 100% my self for Mista Micro, then he didnt use it, so i did.