true question - Page 3

Chris · #1 01-25-2007, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrinceDark

I really doubt Moonie is the reason for this new argument. More like 1 mod that picks fights with people in personal messages. Then imagine that mod becoming biased and deciding to take it out on individuals abusively by giving them unwarranted infractions and causing them to be banned.
That is the issue. Users being silenced along with their complaints in the support tickets.

I have access to the infractions section here. I have yet to see an unwarranted infraction. I've seen a few that I didn't agree with but that is because there are 1-2 rules I deem unnecessary. Other than that it isn't happened, yet. I doubt it will, but then again I lack precognition.

Andy0687 · #2 01-25-2007, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris

I have access to the infractions section here. I have yet to see an unwarranted infraction. I've seen a few that I didn't agree with but that is because there are 1-2 rules I deem unnecessary. Other than that it isn't happened, yet. I doubt it will, but then again I lack precognition.

Could you look at my infraction that was a "Personal Attack on Someone" in regards to the malinko thread.

I think that was unwarranted because I didnt say anything that was a personal attack.

But im over it, its the only one ive ever gotten, so im not cryin still.

Infernix · #3 01-25-2007, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris

I have access to the infractions section here. I have yet to see an unwarranted infraction. I've seen a few that I didn't agree with but that is because there are 1-2 rules I deem unnecessary. Other than that it isn't happened, yet. I doubt it will, but then again I lack precognition.

Problem is about that is you wouldn't know the true situation as it is of each and every case.

Skrobo2 · #4 01-25-2007, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

It does not belong on the forums, Unixmad does not want it on the forums, he wants it done via support center, how hard is that to understand? It is not my choice. Oh man, I am repeating myself again.

Oh, and look up what harrassment is

As stated many times, the support center is useless and customer support is almost non-existent on this game. We've tried making threads to bring that to the attention of higher ups. A forum is a place for open discussion and maybe you should show Unixmad what we have to say instead of deleting our threads when we try to say it.

In reply to you trying to justify Sam's corrupt actions, I have a question for you. Is it right for Sam to look to see who negative repped him, then pm them insulting them for it. It's immature and I expect you as the forum admin to deal with it and punish him in some way. Maybe he's not mature enough to be a super mod.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris

Ibonic and Moonie already fit this archetype. More specially the people causing trouble want Moonie out simply because she has reprimanded them in some way or another (they broke a rule and thought they would get away with it) and now they lash out at her every chance they get.

I have nothing against Moonie and I have only received one infraction, which I had/have no complaint about. I surely don't have a problem with Ibo and I think he's one of the better global staff members. I'm not speaking out against any individual moderator, but at moderation as a whole. It's too tight and strict here and it's really screwing up the forum community. If we don't speak out, eventually we will have a dead forum community and people will be clueless about issues of interest that are discussed here. This is about saving the forums, not an individual moderator. Although I do have a problem with some of Sam's actions and have stated it in a previous post.

Darlene159 · #5 01-25-2007, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skrobo2

As stated many times, the support center is useless and customer support is almost non-existent on this game. We've tried making threads to bring that to the attention of higher ups. A forum is a place for open discussion and maybe you should show Unixmad what we have to say instead of deleting our threads when we try to say it.

Unixmad can view deleted threads/posts.

Quote:

In reply to you trying to justify Sam's corrupt actions, I have a question for you. Is it right for Sam to look to see who negative repped him, then pm them insulting them for it. It's immature and I expect you as the forum admin to deal with it and punish him in some way. Maybe he's not mature enough to be a super mod.

I don't recall the people who recieved these PM's reporting this to me.

Skrobo2 · #6 01-25-2007, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

Unixmad can view deleted threads/posts.

Would he want to look at a thread you deemed wrong and deleted?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

I don't recall the people who recieved these PM's reporting this to me.

Because, it's pointless and you would have done nothing about it.

PrinceDark · #7 01-25-2007, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

Unixmad can view deleted threads/posts.

I don't recall the people who recieved these PM's reporting this to me.

They don't have faith you can handle this problem. They don't believe Unixmad or Stefan will handle the issue when they have more important game-related things to take care of.
We believe something like a Forum Manager, or what Tyhm pointed out as a possible better solution to dealing with these problems.

coreys · #8 01-25-2007, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

Unixmad can view deleted threads/posts.

But does he? Yeah, no, probably not. Probably too busy counting his money.

zell12 · #9 01-25-2007, 01:11 AM

I think this is getting childish now... :/

Personal Jesus · #10 01-25-2007, 01:11 AM

A forum is an arena for communication and sense-making.

As defined by Google.

Tyhm · #11 01-25-2007, 01:15 AM

I believe I had a thread about this...it's conveniently buried in Future Improvements somewhere. The Support Center should have very specific levels of complaint: general, supervisor, and Top-level. If you complain to Stefan that you lost your forum password, you should get in trouble and risk losing your access - that level should be reserved Only for emergencies (like how it's a $10,000 fine for abusing 911)...but the level should still exist. Similarly there should be an in-between level, for trusted admins to take care of corruption charges before Stefan has to stop development to step in...

Another thing - maybe the support center gets spammed with people trying to reach Stefan for matters other than corrupt admins?
Maybe the support center should be specific: "Only post to Stefan or Unixmad if it's an emergency or you're reporting corruption in an admin that only reports to them; for any other matters, forum PM them [link]." I mean, it took me months and months to eke out how to get a response from Stefan nowadays...partially because, busy as he is, it takes months and months to Get a response. :-P

Yet Another Thing - Forum Admin is a good idea. I'd even say Moonie should be promoted to it - and before those of you who dislike Moonie riot, hear me out - that way she'd be entitled to make decisions without Unixmad's permission, And responsible for her actions on the forums. If Sam goes around deleting your posts, Moonie would be responsible for reaching a resolution or liable for corruption in failing so to do.
But maybe that would just make More paperwork for Unixmad.

Darlene159 · #12 01-25-2007, 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

Yet Another Thing - Forum Admin is a good idea. I'd even say Moonie should be promoted to it

I am already forum admin, but I still have to get most things approved by Unixmad. I can't just go changing things out of respect for his forums.

Infernix · #13 01-25-2007, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

I am already forum admin, but I still have to get most things approved by Unixmad. I can't just go changing things out of respect for his forums.

Do you bother to ever address to him that things might need to be changed? If we cant speak to unixmad personally that you must be there as a representatives on the player. But you kinda just sit there as a mod..who mods because Unixmad says so...even though the true motive of a mod is suppose to be to moderate the forums for the player.

Tyhm · #14 01-25-2007, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

I am already forum admin, but I still have to get most things approved by Unixmad. I can't just go changing things out of respect for his forums.

I disagree - while I believe you're as much the Forum Admin as anyone, if you were truly the Administrator of the Forum, it would be your domain, your fief to rule as you see fit. Since you can't, you aren't, and that's wrong. I've been there, I know.
The way it is, you have to enforce rules whether you agree with them or not, and not even you are allowed to grant exceptions to these rules. You should either be granted the power to act in Unixmad's absence or we should get someone who can.

Skrobo2 · #15 01-25-2007, 03:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

I disagree - while I believe you're as much the Forum Admin as anyone, if you were truly the Administrator of the Forum, it would be your domain, your fief to rule as you see fit. Since you can't, you aren't, and that's wrong. I've been there, I know.
The way it is, you have to enforce rules whether you agree with them or not, and not even you are allowed to grant exceptions to these rules. You should either be granted the power to act in Unixmad's absence or we should get someone who can.

I concur. Moonie's no more than a mod with a red bolded name as it stands.

Darlene159 · #16 01-25-2007, 03:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Infernix

Do you bother to ever address to him that things might need to be changed? If we cant speak to unixmad personally that you must be there as a representatives on the player. But you kinda just sit there as a mod..who mods because Unixmad says so...even though the true motive of a mod is suppose to be to moderate the forums for the player.

I have sent Unixmad complaints/threads/post, yes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devil

Darlene only forwards tickets to unixmad if you're "harrassing her" or if she wants to get you threatened, I have proof.

Uh, when people say they want something sent to Unixmad, I send him the link.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyhm

I disagree - while I believe you're as much the Forum Admin as anyone, if you were truly the Administrator of the Forum, it would be your domain, your fief to rule as you see fit. Since you can't, you aren't, and that's wrong. I've been there, I know.
The way it is, you have to enforce rules whether you agree with them or not, and not even you are allowed to grant exceptions to these rules. You should either be granted the power to act in Unixmad's absence or we should get someone who can.

*shrugs* I work for Unixmad, as does everyone else. I guess Unixmad is the only true forum admin.

Infernix · #17 01-25-2007, 01:43 AM

I usually hear "Unixmad" brought up for a excuse for the moderators reactions. Personally I don't think the Mods would act any different if Unixmad didn't enforce these "Laws". If they did, wouldn't they address the problem that his community constantly brings up to him illegal or not.

excaliber7388 · #18 01-25-2007, 02:25 AM

You can't make everyone happy.
But how about aiming for the majority?

Dean · #19 01-25-2007, 02:45 AM

After reading through numberous posts I think the way Unixmad is blamed for all of this is what causes such stupid problems like "Anti-Unixmad". Unixmad is constantly being used as a scapegoat reason for problems on the forums to act as though some people are being forced by him to carry out his wishes. If you're going to do something, for god sake take responsibility for your own actions.

No wonder people turn Anti-Graal with attitudes like this.

Devil · #20 01-25-2007, 03:28 AM

Darlene only forwards tickets to unixmad if you're "harrassing her" or if she wants to get you threatened, I have proof.

killerogue · #21 01-25-2007, 03:42 AM

It's not like Moonie's a terrible mod it's more so like Infernix said she just kind of sits there and mods because unix says so and he should give her full reign over the forums then it would be more orderly and less confusion.

killerogue · #22 01-25-2007, 03:45 AM

Yet, he never addresses them so he should give you some power to do something. O_O

excaliber7388 · #23 01-25-2007, 03:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

I am already forum admin, but I still have to get most things approved by Unixmad. I can't just go changing things out of respect for his forums.

That's a vast exaggeration.

Darlene159 · #24 01-25-2007, 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by excaliber7388

That's a vast exaggeration.

No sir, actually it is not. It is what he told me.

Andy0687 · #25 01-25-2007, 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by killerogue

Yet, he never addresses them so he should give you some power to do something. O_O

Just no.

She has not proven that she could handle "Full control" of the forums based upon just working on what unixmad says.

Unixmad hardly uses the forums OR plays on graal client, it is his Buisness yes but look at it this way

A man who owns Man Resteraunts will appoint a "General Manager" to each one who is allowed to act in the best interest of the Resteraunt which they represent. They do not come down to talk to or change things the General Manager does unless things are going VERY wrong (money loss, or something like that).

The only people I could think fit this bill entirely would be Stefan and Ibonic, yet they are both more like Unixmad in that they are also not as involved as they could be. I think what graal needs is a positive "General Manager" (or Game Master if you will, someone besides Ibonic) who its their JOB to take care of everything.

Nemesis had that job, and as much as I hate the guy, he actually did what he was supposed to very well (right up until that very nasty end).

Same with Spark, but he was removed for Disagreeing (Dosent the General Manager report whats happening and try to help the Owner earn more profits?)

What now?

excaliber7388 · #26 01-25-2007, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

No sir, actually it is not. It is what he told me.

You changed it before contacting him.
And you deleted the threads before it was against the rules!
Too Much Power

Darlene159 · #27 01-25-2007, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by excaliber7388

You changed it before contacting him.
And you deleted the threads before it was against the rules!
Too Much Power

What in the world are you talking about? I don't change things before sending them to Unixmad. I have no clue what you are talking about at all. what on earth are you dredging up now?

PrinceDark · #28 01-25-2007, 04:31 AM

lmao. What the heck is he on about?

excaliber7388 · #29 01-25-2007, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

What in the world are you talking about? I don't change things before sending them to Unixmad. I have no clue what you are talking about at all. what on earth are you dredging up now?

No discussions of the VAST consumption of alcohol.
Yet we weren't allowed to speak of our favorite alcoholic beverage.
Then, you delete the thread, and take 'vast' out of the rule. It was fast, there was no way you talked to Unix that quickly.
You can do whatever you want, and that's too much power.
If you didn't enjoy having too much power, you wouldn't mind if it was limited a bit.

Infernix · #30 01-25-2007, 04:14 AM

I am ashamed to know that a game Ive played for so many years has has gone so low in quality in so many levels compared to where it was before.

coreys · #31 01-25-2007, 04:52 AM

I like how Moonie changed her title to "FORUM ADMINISTRATOR"

Darlene159 · #32 01-25-2007, 04:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coreys

I like how Moonie changed her title to "FORUM ADMINISTRATOR"

Obviously people didn't know since they think one is needed.

coreys · #33 01-25-2007, 05:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

Obviously people didn't know since they think one is needed.

Yeah, your title already said it though. Apparently people can't read. But you act like a mod, thats the problem. A very strict mod. Okay. Lets make an analogy.

Sam is a Canadian leader, and you are a Communist Dictator. Figuratively speaking. Maybe be a little more lenient with the moderation, hmm? This is an honest request, because I know you have the common sense to know that just because something may possibly break a rule doesn't mean it's negative, or may somehow harm these forums or Graal. Please? =)

Take it up with unix if you have to, but rather than helping these forums, you, among other moderators, are harming these forums. This a major reason why they are inactive, and it's just no as enjoyable, and people are wanting to stop posting here.

zim5354 · #34 01-25-2007, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coreys

Yeah, your title already said it though. Apparently people can't read. But you act like a mod, thats the problem. A very strict mod. Okay. Lets make an analogy.

Sam is a Canadian leader, and you are a Communist Dictator. Figuratively speaking. Maybe be a little more lenient with the moderation, hmm? This is an honest request, because I know you have the common sense to know that just because something may possibly break a rule doesn't mean it's negative, or may somehow harm these forums or Graal. Please? =)

Doubt it.

excaliber7388 · #35 01-25-2007, 05:05 AM

She's not limited at all.
We all know how hard it is to contact Unix, let alone carry on a conversation with him. Unless you can read his mind across thousands of miles, you are lying.
Why is a forum with the majority of people between the ages of 18 and 25 have older mods anyway?

Darlene159 · #36 01-25-2007, 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by excaliber7388

She's not limited at all.
We all know how hard it is to contact Unix, let alone carry on a conversation with him. Unless you can read his mind across thousands of miles, you are lying.

I am lying? Wow, I am so glad that you know it all. I am not lying at all. Very few things offend me, or make me mad, but being called a liar is one of them. Unless you have proof that I am a liar, do not call me one. I talk to Unixmad quite often in fact. No matter what you think, I do not own these forums therefore, I do have someone to answer to.

Quote:

Why is a forum with the majority of people between the ages of 18 and 25 have older mods anyway?

I don't know, why was the game made by people older than 18 to 25?

Infernix · #37 01-25-2007, 05:23 AM

Read:

Moderation needs to be more Lenient and the rules need to be changed in order to better the community. For this to be done we need the support of the Moderation team.

Do we have that, and are we All ready to make a effort to have Unixmad change things for the better? If we come together as a community there is no doubt things are going to be changed. We hold the power working together than splitting up into "teams."

zim5354 · #38 01-25-2007, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Infernix

Moderation needs to be more Lenient and the rules need to be changed in order to better the community. For this to be done we need the support of the Moderation team.

Do we have that, and are we All ready to make a effort to have Unixmad change things for the better? If we come together as a community there is no doubt things are going to be changed. We hold the power working together than splitting up into "teams."

There is no team there is everyone and her, I have never ever seen any major complaints about Sam or any other Mod for the matter.

Darlene159 · #39 01-25-2007, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Infernix

Read:

Moderation needs to be more Lenient and the rules need to be changed in order to better the community. For this to be done we need the support of the Moderation team.

Do we have that, and are we All ready to make a effort to have Unixmad change things for the better? If we come together as a community there is no doubt things are going to be changed. We hold the power working together than splitting up into "teams."

I'm not in this fight.
The rules do not bother me. If the community wants the rules changed, then the community can use the support center. Stop trying to use me to fight for you.

excaliber7388 · #40 01-25-2007, 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

I am lying? Wow, I am so glad that you know it all. I am not lying at all. Very few things offend me, or make me mad, but being called a liar is one of them.

Threads closing is a big thing for me

Quote:

Unless you have proof that I am a liar, do not call me one. I talk to Unixmad quite often in fact. No matter what you think, I do not own these forums therefore, I do have someone to answer to.

I gave some good reasons as to why it was impossible for you to have talked to him before you deleted the thread. Logic is enough.

Quote:

I don't know, why was the game made by people older than 18 to 25?

Because they can program. Doesn't mean they understand this generation well enough to moderate their forums.
I'd never trust my 40 year old mother to know what guys my age are in to!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darlene159

I'm not in this fight.
The rules do not bother me. If the community wants the rules changed, then the community can use the support center. Stop trying to use me to fight for you.

No we can't. Now you certainly ARE lying!
The support center is useless for this topic, and you know it!