Please Welcome Xor

[Twinny]

Originally Posted by Scary_Sock

I really never heard of Xor before, and I doubt more than half of the community has heard of him before. The point of getting INVITED is because that person has helped out other people with Server issues, problems, Etc....

I have known Tig before he became a "Global" and I have known TSA before he became a global and I've known other "Globals" before they actually became "Globals". The point is that Xor hasen't been judged by the community yet to actually give their opinion on Xor being a "Global" member, and the only people that actually have judged Xor are the other Global Administrators.

What I think that should of been done is that someone should of have asked the community is Xor was good enough for this position.

A good function of the PWA hiring thread which has been overlooked for the last 3 in the end o.O....just get a random notice, "OI! <blah> is a pwa now!"

[TSAdmin]

I guess it's lucky that I am not entirely bothered by someone being added to the team. I knew Bell was going to seek a new member and I didn't really mind who, so long as when it comes to the job they could do it without a fuss, but I honestly didn't expect this I mean that in a good way, but an honestly shocked way.

Welcome to the team, Xor.
White text that people will likely find: Don't screw up on me, or I'll beat you silly! >=O

[Gambet]

Never heard of Xor before, and considering his only post on these forums was posted in this thread, I'd be curious to know how he was considered perfect for the job. Nonetheless, congratulations, you obviously made a good impression on somebody.

[Sinkler]

Congrats Xor!

[fowlplay4]

Originally Posted by Gambet

Never heard of Xor before, and considering his only post on these forums was posted in this thread, I'd be curious to know how he was considered perfect for the job. Nonetheless, congratulations, you obviously made a good impression on somebody.

You deal with the troublemakers on Zodiac long enough, and act appropriately. Global Staff tend to like you a lot.

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by TSAdmin

I knew Bell was going to seek a new member[/SIZE]

Yea, makes all the people that actually applied feel warm and fuzzy inside knowing she either completely ignored our applications or consider none of us good enough for the job while seeking for a new member.

[Elk]

Welcome to the team!

[TSAdmin]

Originally Posted by Clockwork

Yea, makes all the people that actually applied feel warm and fuzzy inside knowing she either completely ignored our applications or consider none of us good enough for the job while seeking for a new member.

Well, Bell is my boss, and I can't be picky and choosy about who she has me work alongside. That would be unprofessional. The fact that she chose someone who seemingly never applied and was hand-picked was an executive decision she made. As Tig said, we're always on the lookout and obviously people who apply within the forum would like to have precedence of choice over someone who has not applied. Having seen Xor in action directly and noticed his abilities, I think Bell obviously opted to act on positive grounds rather than an intention of "taking a stab" at the people who did apply.

I'm not for or against the choice made. I understand previous applicants' frustration, but I also understand Bell's current standing and highly doubt in any way it had anything to do with the applicants of the past being any more or less "qualified" than Xor.

[Hiro]

Originally Posted by Scary_Sock

I really never heard of Xor before, and I doubt more than half of the community has heard of him before. The point of getting INVITED is because that person has helped out other people with Server issues, problems, Etc....

I have known Tig before he became a "Global" and I have known TSA before he became a global and I've known other "Globals" before they actually became "Globals". The point is that Xor hasen't been judged by the community yet to actually give their opinion on Xor being a "Global" member, and the only people that actually have judged Xor are the other Global Administrators.

What I think that should of been done is that someone should of have asked the community is Xor was good enough for this position.

i don't see why you should expect us commoners to have any input into what the staff of graal do. obviously none of us are good enough to be hand selected for the PWA, including both those who applied and didn't apply. so really, what would we know about who makes a good candidate for the PWA? i don't know who xor is, but he must be awesome if the PWA hand selected him over...all of us?

[TheJames]

Sup Xor!

Aside from all these congratz. What is Xors job actually going to be..? There are scripting pwa's and pwa inspectors and whatnot, what is his title?

Directed: Bell,TSA,Tig

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by TSAdmin

Well, Bell is my boss, and I can't be picky and choosy about who she has me work alongside. That would be unprofessional. The fact that she chose someone who seemingly never applied and was hand-picked was an executive decision she made. As Tig said, we're always on the lookout and obviously people who apply within the forum would like to have precedence of choice over someone who has not applied. Having seen Xor in action directly and noticed his abilities, I think Bell obviously opted to act on positive grounds rather than an intention of "taking a stab" at the people who did apply.

I'm not for or against the choice made. I understand previous applicants' frustration, but I also understand Bell's current standing and highly doubt in any way it had anything to do with the applicants of the past being any more or less "qualified" than Xor.

I'm not really attacking the process, I'm sorry. I am sort of frustrated though for watching that each time a new pwa is picked, it is only after someone has seen them in action with players on a server. Basically eliminating anyone who cannot be found on a server that is not classic or has the attention of the pwa.

[TSAdmin]

Originally Posted by Clockwork

I'm not really attacking the process, I'm sorry. I am sort of frustrated though for watching that each time a new pwa is picked, it is only after someone has seen them in action with players on a server. Basically eliminating anyone who cannot be found on a server that is not classic or has the attention of the pwa.

I was picked through the application process, but I guess as far as "Seeing in action" with me came from the fact that I didn't let HoudiniMan miss me. I was always in his face and wasn't afraid to challenge his decisions (Provided I knew they were wrong or flawed) and I think the fact that he couldn't shake me forced him to see me in action and helped my application even more. Perhaps it's not all about reputation and applications, but getting in there and not just hoping you'll get noticed, but make yourself noticed.

@James: Title's aren't really given. You can do what you can do. Tig and I can script, but as far as I'm aware, neither one of us has held a "Subtitle" under PWA status. We're just PWA.

[Crono1508]

Originally Posted by Xor

thanks guys!



Nope

His official first post on the OGCC.
Hense why many of us have never heard of him.

Your first step to this job should be perfection with grammar.

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by TSAdmin

I was picked through the application process, but I guess as far as "Seeing in action" with me came from the fact that I didn't let HoudiniMan miss me. I was always in his face and wasn't afraid to challenge his decisions (Provided I knew they were wrong or flawed) and I think the fact that he couldn't shake me forced him to see me in action and helped my application even more. Perhaps it's not all about reputation and applications, but getting in there and not just hoping you'll get noticed, but make yourself noticed.

I've tried several ways to write this post but to just write it a final time, I feel slightly spoken down to ><! I know it's not all reputation and applications, and I know the correct way to get noticed is by not trying, but you've missed my point.

You're saying that if you want a chance at being a pwa you must work where you may get noticed basically. Tell me the name of a pwa that was not hired after working on a server that has not been popular and classic.

[bioboi]

Xor will do a great job Bell made a good choice

[Loriel]

Originally Posted by Hiro

what would we know about who makes a good candidate for the PWA?

Look, if you are still actually playing Graal, you obviously lack the critical-thinking skills required for informed decisions regarding PWA applicants~

[DuBsTeRmAn]

That explains why he logged on at my server yesterday on a rc

[Lyndzey]

Originally Posted by Loriel

Look, if you are still actually playing Graal, you obviously lack the critical-thinking skills required for informed decisions regarding PWA applicants~

Haha...

Applications are not the ideal way to select someone for a global staff position. PWA members need to be fair and respectful to players, a quality that cannot be represented through applications but only through personal interaction. The PWA hiring section probably should have never been added, as it would be much better for a person to be selected by global staff based on how they interact with the community.

Congrats to Xor, and good luck.

[CharlieM]

Welcome Xor, hope you do good, I've seen you on graal once and you were playing around with squirt on era, Hopefully you get more experience with things and do your job well

[Darlene159]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

Applications are not the ideal way to select someone for a global staff position. PWA members need to be fair and respectful to players, a quality that cannot be represented through applications but only through personal interaction. The PWA hiring section probably should have never been added, as it would be much better for a person to be selected by global staff based on how they interact with the community.

Congrats to Xor, and good luck.

I very much agree.

[TSAdmin]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

Applications are not the ideal way to select someone for a global staff position. PWA members need to be fair and respectful to players, a quality that cannot be represented through applications but only through personal interaction. The PWA hiring section probably should have never been added, as it would be much better for a person to be selected by global staff based on how they interact with the community.

Congrats to Xor, and good luck.

Beat me to a response, but I honestly couldn't have worded it any better.

[Bell]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

Haha...

Applications are not the ideal way to select someone for a global staff position. PWA members need to be fair and respectful to players, a quality that cannot be represented through applications but only through personal interaction. The PWA hiring section probably should have never been added, as it would be much better for a person to be selected by global staff based on how they interact with the community.

My sentiments exactly. While the applications may provide us with players that we may not of already noticed the fact remains that the primary job of the Playerworld Administration is to provide support to players that have issues regarding things that happen to them on servers that they feel the local staff did not handle correctly. We are the judges of those actions.

The people that stand out are those that are usually at the forefront in handling player problems on servers on a daily basis. We deal with them constantly and the proof is in their actions. No application can show us how they handle graal life situations.

I am highly skeptical at using the judgement of the forum users or server players as a basis for judging a PWA as its well known that usually only those that didn't get the result they wanted during an investigation are the ones that speak the loudest.

My hopes are that once Xor has become more familiar with his new surroundings that the addition of another member will help us to have better coverage of all servers. Right now we're spread pretty thin so its difficult for us to address all the problems that the players would like to see us improve upon. I would like to see the addition of 1 or 2 more actually even though its not needed on support itself.

[MysticX2X]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

Haha...

Applications are not the ideal way to select someone for a global staff position. PWA members need to be fair and respectful to players, a quality that cannot be represented through applications but only through personal interaction. The PWA hiring section probably should have never been added, as it would be much better for a person to be selected by global staff based on how they interact with the community.

Congrats to Xor, and good luck.

Do real jobs hire you just because they think you're good or require a resume first to know your credentials, and then move on from there?

Clockwork made a good point up there too.

[pooper200000]

Originally Posted by Bell

stuffz.

Actions speak louder than words?

[Robin]

Cool

[WanDaMan]

I place confidence in Xor, enough to say that I do believe he is capable of dealing with PWA enquiries. Congratulations & goodluck!

[Lyndzey]

Originally Posted by MysticX2X

Do real jobs hire you just because they think you're good or require a resume first to know your credentials, and then move on from there?

This isn't the real world. This is an online gaming community where we already know the majority of players, not a country of 300 million people where we have to go off of resumes because we haven't been able to observe the person interacting with others.

I would say that becoming a PWA member is more of getting a promotion from a server staff job, as I believe all global staff members were at one point staff somewhere. This actually does parallel real jobs somewhat, as we are typically promoted based on our interactions with others, not because we sent in an application.

[Robin]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

This isn't the real world. This is an online gaming community where we already know the majority of players, not a country of 300 million people where we have to go off of resumes because we haven't been able to observe the person interacting with others.

I would say that becoming a PWA member is more of getting a promotion from a server staff job, as I believe all global staff members were at one point staff somewhere. This actually does parallel real jobs somewhat, as we are typically promoted based on our interactions with others, not because we sent in an application.

Unless you're required to apply for your new role in the same way as new applicants to meet with EU Law.

[Hiro]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

This isn't the real world. This is an online gaming community where we already know the majority of players, not a country of 300 million people where we have to go off of resumes because we haven't been able to observe the person interacting with others.

I would say that becoming a PWA member is more of getting a promotion from a server staff job, as I believe all global staff members were at one point staff somewhere. This actually does parallel real jobs somewhat, as we are typically promoted based on our interactions with others, not because we sent in an application.

i think you are trying to create a reason for PWA to hire people they like, rather than people who have applied

applications should be used as a way for the PWA to know which people want into the PWA, like in real jobs where you apply to make it known that you want the job. it shouldn't be said that applications are useless or unnecessary, because they aren't. further, once the application is done, only then can you really look at the person (interview) and then make a rational decision based upon the credentials and the impression

just deciding that someone is good enough because you "know them" or "have seen them at work" isn't as great as when someone applies, waits, shows themselves as competent, and then is hired. i could care less if xor is PWA or not - i don't know a single thing about him, nor a single thing about why he was hired, other than he worked on zodiac and was apparently helpful to players. i also know FAQs on UN that help players out - why don't you go and watch them? i mean honestly, how much time did the PWA stay on RC just watching for people's performances? you couldn't have been looking at his posts, as he didn't have any, and unless you were playing graal with him (which no one with critical-thinking skills does apparently) or talking with him through RC, which is to say that members of the PWA took time out of their work on graal specifically to get to know xor so they could potentially hire him...i don't see that being done to anyone else, nor have i heard about that being done to anyone else, which suggests that xor might be friends with members of the PWA, and friend's in high places means you have connections to resources that others don't enjoy. it's still clear that those who applied couldn't hold a candle to what xor had to offer - and he didn't even need to apply

why didn't you guys go talk and get to know clockwork on his server so you could potentially hire him too? at least he took the time to write an application

[Unkownsoldier]

Hiro I don't think you get it. Look at Major League Baseball, at one time everyone starts out playing in the minors, which in this case are normal servers. Assume Rookie league is a newly bought server, A, is a under construction server, AA, is a hosted server, AAA, is a classic server. Xor worked his way all the way to AAA, because people saw how good he was. In this point in time, the managers (player world team) noticed that he could really help out, so they called him up, and got him to sign a major league contract. It doesn't take an application to be a major leaguer, all it takes is skill.

[BigBear3]

Originally Posted by Unkownsoldier

Hiro I don't think you get it. Look at Major League Baseball, at one time everyone starts out playing in the minors, which in this case are normal servers. Assume Rookie league is a newly bought server, A, is a under construction server, AA, is a hosted server, AAA, is a classic server. Xor worked his way all the way to AAA, because people saw how good he was. In this point in time, the managers (player world team) noticed that he could really help out, so they called him up, and got him to sign a major league contract. It doesn't take an application to be a major leaguer, all it takes is skill.

How much are we paying him a year?

[Skatertay]

jesus why does everyone like to complain.

[BigBear3]

Originally Posted by Skatertay

jesus why does everyone like to complain.

Welcome!

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by Unkownsoldier

Hiro I don't think you get it. Look at Major League Baseball, at one time everyone starts out playing in the minors, which in this case are normal servers. Assume Rookie league is a newly bought server, A, is a under construction server, AA, is a hosted server, AAA, is a classic server. Xor worked his way all the way to AAA, because people saw how good he was. In this point in time, the managers (player world team) noticed that he could really help out, so they called him up, and got him to sign a major league contract. It doesn't take an application to be a major leaguer, all it takes is skill.

Xor did not work his all the way to AAA. he started on it during its AAA.

[Skatertay]

As far as I put it, sure I like to complain once in a while but is it worth it to go on and on about it on the forums till the topic is closed? Yes I am complaining as I speak about those who flame the subject with stupid non-sense. Congratulate him and go on with your daily lives.

[Lyndzey]

Originally Posted by Hiro

i think you are trying to create a reason for PWA to hire people they like, rather than people who have applied

No, that's not what I am saying at all. I don't think that an application is the best way to go about choosing someone for a global staff position. If the PWA wanted to only hire people they like, I'm sure they could have them send in an application and hire them that way.

I have had input on who should be hired for global positions before, and I felt the staff members we chose from applications turned out to be a lot worse than the ones we picked based on their experience on a staff team and their interaction with the community. I saw the same problem when I was hiring GPs for Classic as GP Chief. I hired this one person who had a great looking application, but turned out to be a horrible GP. From my experiences, applications are not the way to go for this game.

Originally Posted by Hiro

applications should be used as a way for the PWA to know which people want into the PWA, like in real jobs where you apply to make it known that you want the job. it shouldn't be said that applications are useless or unnecessary, because they aren't. further, once the application is done, only then can you really look at the person (interview) and then make a rational decision based upon the credentials and the impression

I do agree with you somewhat. Perhaps a mix of an application and experience with the person is the best way to go (such as TSAdmin). However, it is not reasonable to hire someone based only on an application and interview for this game. You cannot predict how that person will act as global staff unless you have seen how that person interacts with other players before. I'm sure someone can write a great application with lots of <3s all over, and have a nice interview as well. The problem is that unless global staff knows that person well, they would have no way of knowing how he/she treated other players, or whether or not he/she is corrupt or power hungry. You really need to know the player well before entrusting them with a global position.

Originally Posted by Hiro

just deciding that someone is good enough because you "know them" or "have seen them at work" isn't as great as when someone applies, waits, shows themselves as competent, and then is hired. i could care less if xor is PWA or not - i don't know a single thing about him, nor a single thing about why he was hired, other than he worked on zodiac and was apparently helpful to players. i also know FAQs on UN that help players out - why don't you go and watch them?

I don't believe this is a case of Bell hiring Xor because she knows him. Xor was the Asst Manager of Zodiac, not a FAQ on UN. The two positions are incomparable. Look at the current PWAs: Bell (former Classic GP Asst Admin), TSAdmin (Former Admin at Era), Tig (GK Admin). They all held management positions that not only helped them gain skills that would be useful as a PWA member, but also gave them the opportunity to prove to the players and global staff that they would be a fair and respectful staff member.

[Edit]: I'm sorry for turning this into an argument, it was not my intention. I just wanted to attempt to explain why applications are not always used in the hiring process of globals. This thread really should be about congratulating Xor, and wishing him luck with his new position.

[Hiro]

Originally Posted by Clockwork

Xor did not work his all the way to AAA. he started on it during its AAA.

i don't particularly care where or how a person got involved with staff, and i'm not trying to make a point that insult's xor or the fact he was hired. from the way he's being defended, it sounds as if he can be of help to people. but at least i've heard of people before they were hired, along with most of the active community

and also i wanted to just defend the people who tried and applied to be globals. it just doesn't seem fair that all of those people didn't make it, which is obvious from the current hire. so let me get this right: from what i'm being told, the correct way to get noticed by a global and invited to join the PWA is:

1) get a high ranking position on any server (chief, admin, manager)
2) don't swear and help players with their problems
3) know how to do something development-wise (LAT, GFX, scripting, SFX, ganis, etc.)

then just be patient? does the PWA regularly go onto RC to learn about people with these positions and judge them on their helpfulness and what they could add to the team, discussing it and then proceeding to either hire or not-hire? or was someone like xor a miracle happening; a rare discovery to be added to PWA?

[Skatertay]

Originally Posted by Lyndzey

No, that's not what I am saying at all. I don't think that an application is the best way to go about choosing someone for a global staff position. If the PWA wanted to only hire people they like, I'm sure they could have them send in an application and hire them that way.

I have had input on who should be hired for global positions before, and I felt the staff members we chose from applications turned out to be a lot worse than the ones we picked based on their experience on a staff team and their interaction with the community. I saw the same problem when I was hiring GPs for Classic as GP Chief. I hired this one person who had a great looking application, but turned out to be a horrible GP. From my experiences, applications are not the way to go for this game.



I do agree with you somewhat. Perhaps a mix of an application and experience with the person is the best way to go (such as TSAdmin). However, it is not reasonable to hire someone based only on an application and interview for this game. You cannot predict how that person will act as global staff unless you have seen how that person interacts with other players before. I'm sure someone can write a great application with lots of <3s all over, and have a nice interview as well. The problem is that unless global staff knows that person well, they would have no way of knowing how he/she treated other players, or whether or not he/she is corrupt or power hungry. You really need to know the player well before entrusting them with a global position.



I don't believe this is a case of Bell hiring Xor because she knows him. Xor was the Asst Manager of Zodiac, not a FAQ on UN. The two positions are incomparable. Look at the current PWAs: Bell (former Classic GP Asst Admin), TSAdmin (Former Admin at Era), Tig (GK Admin). They all held management positions that not only helped them gain skills that would be useful as a PWA member, but also gave them the opportunity to prove to the players and global staff that they would be a fair and respectful staff member.

[Edit]: I'm sorry for turning this into an argument, it was not my intention. I just wanted to attempt to explain why applications are not always used in the hiring process of globals. This thread really should be about congratulating Xor, and wishing him luck with his new position.

That so much is not an argument at least you got the point across of being positive on the person (Xor) that had gained PWA. It's all the negative connotation towards the subject that creates fuss.

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by Hiro

i don't particularly care where or how a person got involved with staff, and i'm not trying to make a point that insult's xor or the fact he was hired. from the way he's being defended, it sounds as if he can be of help to people. but at least i've heard of people before they were hired, along with most of the active community

and also i wanted to just defend the people who tried and applied to be globals. it just doesn't seem fair that all of those people didn't make it, which is obvious from the current hire. so let me get this right: from what i'm being told, the correct way to get noticed by a global and invited to join the PWA is:

1) get a high ranking position on any server (chief, admin, manager)
2) don't swear and help players with their problems
3) know how to do something development-wise (LAT, GFX, scripting, SFX, ganis, etc.)

then just be patient? does the PWA regularly go onto RC to learn about people with these positions and judge them on their helpfulness and what they could add to the team, discussing it and then proceeding to either hire or not-hire? or was someone like xor a miracle happening; a rare discovery to be added to PWA?

I think we're along the same lines of thinking here, and I agree with you about xor, Im not trying to insult him or anything, it just so happens that it's his hiring thats finally brought this up.

Also, just for the thoughts, you don't even apparently need to be development to be a pwa, seeing as bell was only a gp or pr for several years or something along those lines.

[Loriel]

The only reason you need to hire your pals instead of people who send in an application is that everybody here is at best a volunteer and consequently always less professional and disciplined than the people you are comparing them to in your funny job market/major sports leagues analogies. It is way more useful that you know someone to whatever extent than that they manage to fill out the application form without drooling all over it if you want to judge how they will perform in any given position.

The whole nepotism accusation is pretty much as easy to make as calling everybody *****ing in this thread whining freeloaders who cannot be bothered to actually contribute to Graal in any significant way and instead pine for the presumably easy glory of a global staff position.