Small update to RC

Nabru · #1 07-03-2009, 04:14 AM

I think all "Weapon/GUI-script" Updates should be localized, much like the /help function. On servers like Testbed it can become very difficult to see your scripts output amongst all the other peoples. I imagine it can't be too hard.

fowlplay4 · #2 07-03-2009, 04:24 AM

This would be nice.. but last i heard Stefan has said he wouldn't be updating the external tools and that everything was going in-game/client-based.

Nabru · #3 07-03-2009, 04:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fowlplay4

This would be nice.. but last i heard Stefan has said he wouldn't be updating the external tools and that everything was going in-game/client-based.

I think someone should make a third-party RC, Gani, and Level Editor.

Frankie · #4 07-03-2009, 04:47 AM

it shouldn't be forced though. an option for it would be better this way a manager or a high admin can see when their NATs are changing scripts. if it was forced locally, someone could get away with uploading a malicious weapon NPC and it wouldn't even display to NC.

DustyPorViva · #5 07-03-2009, 04:48 AM

Scripted RC has a major flaw with testbed -- panels are not adjustable. You can't even read most of the names of the weapons, making it pretty useless.

fowlplay4 · #6 07-03-2009, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nabru

I think someone should make a third-party RC, Gani, and Level Editor.

There's Gonstruct for Level Editors, but any attempt to make a third-party RC would probably result in a ban or something.

As long as the in-game tools don't feel like in-game tools then things might just be fine but until then I hope we don't get stuck with the crappy one we have now if new stuff ever comes out.

Crono · #7 07-03-2009, 06:05 AM

External tools ftw.

Skyld · #8 07-03-2009, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DustyPorViva

Scripted RC has a major flaw with testbed -- panels are not adjustable. You can't even read most of the names of the weapons, making it pretty useless.

I will update it to use an adjustable frame control when I get the time.

xXziroXx · #9 07-03-2009, 03:01 PM

I'm pretty sure someone was working on a third-party RC a while back, and was using it.

Cloven · #10 07-03-2009, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xXziroXx

I'm pretty sure someone was working on a third-party RC a while back, and was using it.

The only time I've ever heard about this somebody got themselves into trouble. *shrugs*

xXziroXx · #11 07-03-2009, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cloven

The only time I've ever heard about this somebody got themselves into trouble. *shrugs*

I remember some thread on these forums about someone who was making a multi-tool for Graal, and it included a third-party RemoteControl that he made. Maybe... 3 years ago?

DustyPorViva · #12 07-03-2009, 06:51 PM

Stefan would consider a third-party RC as a major security risk, and I remember someone trying to make one before and I think Stefan stopped them.

Crow · #13 07-03-2009, 07:02 PM

I'm pretty sure one could talk with Stefan about that. Show him the source so he can confirm it's clean and allow it to be used.

maximus_asinus · #14 07-03-2009, 07:40 PM

For some reason I think it might have been Mystical Dragon? I remember someone making an external RC for cellphones/PDAs and was banned for doing so.

DustyPorViva · #15 07-03-2009, 07:46 PM

Oh ya, that was it. I don't know if he was actually banned for it though.

Nabru · #16 07-03-2009, 07:57 PM

I think the fact none of these tools have seen updates in over 3 years, and hes trying to build everything into one program just shows laziness and being uninterested in graal in general.

If it's that much of a hassle why don't they just shut up shop?

Deas_Voice · #17 07-03-2009, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximus_asinus

For some reason I think it might have been Mystical Dragon? I remember someone making an external RC for cellphones/PDAs and was banned for doing so.

i want one >:0
go make 1 for us.
no1 tell stefan about it

Robin · #18 07-04-2009, 09:55 AM

Loriel made a third party RC, in GTK, with a Ruby codebase.

Then Stefan changed the compression algo again.

Would it be a security risk if Stefan released the information needed to make an RC?
Yes. Definately so.

But is it still a security risk because he hasn't?
Of course. It just takes longer for it to become an issue.

There needs to be some MAJOR updates to all external tools. Gonstruct is nice, but as with all things Loriel is involved with, interest in further development is eventually lost.

Fry · #19 07-04-2009, 11:48 AM

Well you see, if the work involved in actively developing external tools (or tools at all) would be trivial, I'm sure someone externally would've created some already (there's of course no real excuse for why there are no proper official ones).
There are atleast two motiviations to spend time and effort developing these: money or dedication to Graal, and I'm sure anyone dedicated enugh capable of finishing such a project has much better things to do than develop tools for free.
Robin, your misinformation or lack of knowledge does not put away the fact that a RC is more than a chat window

. Also don't blame Loriel, the fact that nothing's getting done on Gonstruct anymore is probably more my fault, there's no driving force anymore since I really don't care about Graal enugh anymore to put much free time into it. A hope might be that it's open source, which is not possible for a RC since a certain someone is pretty paranoid about his game's security (reasonably..).

Crono · #20 07-04-2009, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin

There needs to be some MAJOR updates to all external tools. Gonstruct is nice, but as with all things Loriel is involved with, interest in further development is eventually lost.

Well he is working on it in his own time and it's not like Loriel and the other guys actually play Graal anymore.

Loriel · #21 07-04-2009, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin

Loriel made a third party RC, in GTK, with a Ruby codebase.

This is a bit of an exaggeration, I only really build those parts that I needed to hang out on RC chat. As someone said, actually making a third-party RC would get me banned, so I never did.

Quote:

There needs to be some MAJOR updates to all external tools. Gonstruct is nice, but as with all things Loriel is involved with, interest in further development is eventually lost.

Gonstruct is mostly fry's project, stop giving me all the praise!

I lost interest because it turns out I was not actually making any levels anymore, and also because I had hoped that once we had something usable, some other people might jump into the project and start getting their favourite features implemented.

Graal's external tools are not exactly rocket science. Stefan is pretty good at using easy-to-understand plaintext file formats, so it should not be a big deal for the community to get its **** together and program whatever it needs. The RC is obviously an exception, but eh, it is just the RC.

(I think CheeToS or someone started writing a gani editor ages ago, did anything become of that?)

An alternative would be to latch onto some third-party generic tile-based level editor project and add the bunch of magical objects that we need for levels, and then either add support for the .nw format or write a separate conversion script.

Personally I find it pretty hard to come up with the motivation to get into this anymore (sorry, Jess), but that is probably mostly due to my antipathy for entire development process of Graal.

Loriel · #22 07-04-2009, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nabru

I think the fact none of these tools have seen updates in over 3 years, and hes trying to build everything into one program just shows laziness and being uninterested in graal in general.

Stefan has good reasons for integrating everything into the Graal client. It would make maintenance easier because there would not be a need for three separate versions for linux/osx/windows versions and because scripters could easily contribute features or bugfixes to scripted tools without all the hassle of actual software development.

There might be good arguments against that strategy (my favourite one being that no one seems to be actively working on it), but I do not think that makes Stefan lazy.

Nabru · #23 07-09-2009, 06:34 PM

Bump for great justice!

CheeToS2 · #24 07-13-2009, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loriel

(I think CheeToS or someone started writing a gani editor ages ago, did anything become of that?)

It got pretty far, but I ended up scrapping it due to audio syncing and complexity issues. WPF also would have made things much nicer, but then it wouldn't have Mono compatibility. I'm no longer motivated to work on it.

Robin · #25 07-13-2009, 04:33 PM

I made a Gani viewer in flash, but it was very temperamental.

edit: and obviously didn't support scripts.

fowlplay4 · #26 07-13-2009, 05:04 PM

There's my scripted Gani Editor, which tends to bug up when switching between single dir modes, and the reverse option. It could be redone using GUI controls though.

http://forums.graalonline.com/forums...ad.php?t=79041

Admins · #27 07-14-2009, 12:57 AM

There is a gui version of the scripted gani editor already, based on that. It's currently on testbed server and zone debug.