Stefan...Unixmad...

[Er1c]

Originally posted by konidias
Why the staff think it's okay to insult the management and tell them they aren't doing a good job, and then expect the management not to fire them is beyond me.

You don't go to work and tell your boss that you don't like the way he is doing things and expect him to say "oh gee, thanks for telling me how to do my job! want a raise? *pat on the back*". He would fire you or you can quit, or you just live with it. That is the only option. If you don't like how things are being run, don't go arguing about it, just leave.

People think they are the only people in the world that can do their job. Unixmad could easily hire new people in a heartbeat. There are others that are qualified to fill the job.

See, I would agree with you if we were getting paid to do our jobs, but we aren't. We are here to help, and sometimes helping doesn't just mean doing what we are told. The best thing people like Nemesis and Alkaren could have done to help, and their jobs were to help, was to speak out and help unixmad understand what he was doing... they weren't getting paid to do a certain job, they were given privilages in order to help Graal.

[AlexH]

Speaking out about the problems etc is fine but it's how they put them down that isn't.
I don't know how any of them got their opinions across because Alks thread was deleted before I got to read it and I don't think Nemesis thread deserved to get him fired.

[Milkdude99]

Ok cold hard facts :

1. The decision has already been made
2. It is Unixmad and Stefan's RIGHT to run Graal as they see fit
3. How you express an opinion makes all the difference in the world on how it will be percieved.
4. Accept what you cannot change
5.only time will tell if it was a wise decision or not but then again that responsiblity rest with Unixmad and Stefan , they are the ones who will benefit or suffer for their mistakes or triumphs.This "Game" supports them; it's their job and they have much at stake , you(the players) on the other hand just play it and it does not feed and house you as it does them.
6. They don't have to tell anyone anything , only what they want done.
7.Players and Staff alike do not need to know everything that is going on , just what is nessary for them to know.
8. Business is hard and cruel and plays no favorites
9. Friendship and business don't mix , only leads to bad business moves or being taken advantage of.
10. Work within what Unixmad wants or your fired (its strictly business)

If you want to be opininated and scream about things , then get a column in a newspaper .

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by AlexH
Speaking out about the problems etc is fine but it's how they put them down that isn't.
I don't know how any of them got their opinions across because Alks thread was deleted before I got to read it and I don't think Nemesis thread deserved to get him fired.

the thread didn't as you know there is always more to it, it was more like his arguing with Unixmad off the Game .

[Chronos]

Oh yes, they have every right to molest, improve, destroy, piss-and-burn-on the game they created. But theyr'e using it as a cash cow, and if the majority of the public is not happy, then that's less money they get. This is opinion and if not enforced, less players will keep upgrading. I certainly am not.

Remember, no matter what they want to do, the customer is always right. If they don't follow that, their business declines.

[Googi]

Originally posted by Er1c
Nope... they both got fired for having opinions

I distincly remember Alkaren saying "I quit" and making a big "I quit" thread where he continually trashed Unix and Stefan.

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by Chronos
Oh yes, they have every right to molest, improve, destroy, piss-and-burn-on the game they created. But theyr'e using it as a cash cow, and if the majority of the public is not happy, then that's less money they get. This is opinion and if not enforced, less players will keep upgrading. I certainly am not.

Remember, no matter what they want to do, the customer is always right. If they don't follow that, their business declines.

I see you have never been in a Customer related Business , the customer is always right only to a point , nobody in Business does whatever the customer says is right or they would go bankrupt. You think customers won't abuse that ?or try to? if you do then you are fooling only yourself and need to stay out of business.

[Tyhm]

Yeah, you think the customers wanted Graal to go P2P? There was actually a riot (paradoxically on Classic) of people who insisted that they'd sooner see Graal go offline permanently than ever pay one thin dime for a game this bad.

I think roughly 10% upgraded anyway. Maybe 30% got involved in short-lived Rival efforts to actually destroy Graal. Most just left.

OH WOW! I DON'T MISS THEM!

[unixmad]

Yes i agree with that, that's why i am preparing with Konidias a Newsletter we will send to all Graalians (Gold and No gold)

Also we need to put more information's on the Web site.

Unix.

Originally posted by Milkdude99
I agree , There are others who do play the game who are well quailfied to help "manage" the Game . The only thing I would like to see , is better communication among not only Staff but Staff to players . Its good to post things here and I applaude those efforts to get things out , but it doesn't do any good for those players who play Classic Servers who do not have Gold accounts and there are many of such players and are many times left in the Dark as to what is going on. In an effort to improve this on Npulse I post important things from Unixmad in the Npulse Forums so they can get these important messages. But we are only one PW and many players don't get the info because they play other PWs and don't use our Forums.

[Chronos]

Makes no sense Tyhm, they're not customer when they don't pay :P

I mean now, being governed by a council of people who will most likely abuse their powers to players who paid for their game.

People quit and quit and quit, when I first started again Graal Classic had 120 players on heavy times, now we're around the 90's. G2k2 became popular fo ra while due to haunted house but more and more people are leaving that as well.

Sure, milkdude, you can take the stubborn side if you want, but just remember this is making people leave, and when you lose so many players, you can't properly fund the game anymore. Doing what they want is their business, but listening to the public is their best way to keeping the game alive.

Believe it or not, even my own staff are insisting that they're leaving the game if they have to listen to council members etc. And you can badmouth my staff if you want, but they're some of the best damn people on the game.

I've already seen the effect of poor management and lack of respect for the public...when will you? Sigh, someday...

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by unixmad
Yes i agree with that, that's why i am preparing with Konidias a Newsletter we will send to all Graalians (Gold and No gold)

Also we need to put more information's on the Web site.

Unix.

This is the best news I have heard in a long time!

[Chronos]

Not effective. A lot of accounts dont' even have correct e-mails or out of date e-mails. Just because you tell everybody what's going on doesn't meanthey'll like it either.

Tell me you're not defending the council to get on Unixmad's good side. I dare you.

Bans will take a week to get done due to all the council having to agree on it, Hell Raven, Da Cheheta, and anyone else can run rampant while the GP's who have worked anywhere up to four years get their rights removed because the council is meant to be more efficient.

The council will hardly agree on anything important, such as removing servers with a maximum of 10 players in the past six months, removal of staff, etc. because everyone is not 30 years old, mature, and able to judge correctly. With the current configuration and the method of hiring of the council, you will have 13 year olds, or possibly even younger, running Graal. Popular vote you say? We were discussing the popular vote portion of the council creation, and guess what everyone on RC chat said would get hired? Yaksha. At the same time. Storm and I were laughing like crazy, but it will happen.

You may or may not know who Yaksha is, but he's not capable of being fair in council. Nor are the players who will be voting be mature enough to choose someone who would.

Removing rights of staff who did nothing wrong to pave the way for RC level 4, maybe even 5, "council" members who possibly might not even have been staff before, is ludicrous to think about. The system's fine now, things are done and they're done right...changing is just making a lot of people mad.

Defend it if you want, but it's just illogical.

[konidias]

The phrase "the customer is always right" is a joke. How is the customer always right, yet people make mistakes? Customers are people, and their judgment might not be the best, and what they think is right isn't always right.

[konidias]

Originally posted by Chronos
Not effective. A lot of accounts dont' even have correct e-mails or out of date e-mails. Just because you tell everybody what's going on doesn't meanthey'll like it either.

The newsletter would be seperate from Graal accounts... for one, it will be optional, meaning if you want to recieve it, you put your email in it and sign up, and two, it will be open to everyone, just like the Graal website news.

Also, your views on what is going on aren't even accurate, as some of the stuff you talk about isn't even right. You say all level 4 RC's were removed so the council could replace them. This is not true. You are making up your own ideas of what is happening in your head, without actually knowing the facts.

[Googi]

Originally posted by konidias
The phrase "the customer is always right" is a joke. How is the customer always right, yet people make mistakes? Customers are people, and their judgment might not be the best, and what they think is right isn't always right.

I think he meant treat them like they're right and they'll be happy...or something.