Gun Statistics

[Godzilla]

People only want incentives for one reason; To keep them interested.

Not everyone is good at the same things, you're good at a game, some other kid on Era who is completely useless might be amazing at skateboarding, what is his purpose of playing Era now? He doesn't want to get 'better' at something when he knows that he won't reach the skill of others, so he asks for an incentive, something to keep him interested. Trading is an incentive, all of the non-pk related garbage on Era is an incentive to play.

You're so ill-minded, "Think outside of the box", what may cause you happiness isn't going to cause other peoples happiness.

Everyone has their own reason for playing, I'm sure there are people who ****ride you, there is another set of ****riders riding that skateboard kid at his own talent but that's your incentive, the ****riders are your motivation to stay at the level you are at.

I'm willing to bet if you surveyed everyone on Era and asked them "Why do you continue to play Era day in and day out" not a single one would say "To become the best, to get better at PKing".

Not everything needs to be revolved around the past, make a future, Era is in honesty the best position it can be in right now. You're just ill-minded and want things to go back to the way you liked. I was all for PKing, I was even deemed the "Best Lagger" at one point but that's just it, out of the nine years that I played Era, in the end the only thing that kept me playing was the few people I called friends, not the aspect of being "the best" because in reality, no one really cares about that anymore. It's time you realize that, without "Soul" you wouldn't play Era, without the buddies everyone has on Era, no one would play.

I guess what I'm trying to say is; Enjoy it how it is, don't try to change everything because you don't like them, adapt, play the game and have fun with your friends. You could be the best or you could be the worst but as long as you're having fun, that's all that really matters on a game like Era.

Your ego is already too big in-game, you don't need to come onto the forums and give everyone a lecture about how they need to 'stop sucking', that's just pathetic and big-headed. No one on Era actually cares about excelling, they just want to have fun. The sad reality is, not everyone is having fun anymore and that's why they come on the forums to "vent" about the "problems" they want "fixed".

[ilovegirlzz]

@godzilla talking to me or wil?

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by ilovegirlzz

@godzilla talking to me or wil?

Pretty sure he's talking to Wil since you guys seem to be in agreement.

[Venom_Fish]

Originally Posted by Godzilla

bla bla bla i think i was good at pk bla bla bla incentives bla

Uh, here's an incentive: Get good, you suck. If you get good, the guns won't matter cause you'll be good, but since you're not good, they do. You tried to be good, it failed, so now you want incentives. But I tell you, keep trying, you'll still suck even with incentives.

Moral of the story? Get good, stop sucking and all problems dissipate. D. End.

Other newb who keeps whining about guns, you suck... you can't raid with an uzi, you can't even raid wth. Get good, and guns won't matter. You're not good, so they do. Stop being not good so we can stop hearing you whine. D. End.

[Tim_Rocks]

I feel like if the hospital didn't exist there wouldn't be so much running. Should try it for a day where everyone revives at unstick at full HP.

[Godzilla]

It's not worth my time to try to convince someone so ill-minded and big-headed that they are wrong, you're incapable of comprehending such a thing. You'll realize one day that your skillful talent of Era PC really didn't do you much good, especially when you didn't be-friend anyone on the way, in-fact the complete opposite.

I don't think anyone is addressing the issue of guns anymore, yet you continue to dwell on the topic. We're talking about enjoyment now, get with the times William.

[-HateD-]

Not much about this game is enjoyable anymore. The PK scene is dumb (gun stats and player attitude are both ****) sparring is atrocious because of lag priority and getting money is too hard to be bothered with. Gangs have deteriorated into a lame war and who can run the best (Souls are probably the most guilty of this so "elite"). But hey it's not about the stats that's why every time mp5 navy becomes **** Wil begs for gun rights then changes it back to the best so he can get one and win again. The only fun part is my friends. Plain and simple.

[ilovegirlzz]

Originally Posted by Venom_Fish

Uh, here's an incentive: Get good, you suck. If you get good, the guns won't matter cause you'll be good, but since you're not good, they do. You tried to be good, it failed, so now you want incentives. But I tell you, keep trying, you'll still suck even with incentives.

Moral of the story? Get good, stop sucking and all problems dissipate. D. End.

Other newb who keeps whining about guns, you suck... you can't raid with an uzi, you can't even raid wth. Get good, and guns won't matter. You're not good, so they do. Stop being not good so we can stop hearing you whine. D. End.

you completely miss the point over and over again..seriously kid take the time to understand what we're talking about.
yes i understand if someone spent countless hours pking theyll achieve greatness and .05 freeze guns and .2 freeze guns wouldnt matter.

but we're addressing the fact that GANGS get soo much utility that its completely unfair to other players regardless of skill level. (i.e m107 was deleted from era public but its able to be purchased as a gang weapon, SMGPK, owen45, ...etc) and the fact that these weapons are better than the guns that are similar to tier 1 weapons in shop is just sad.

what we, the people of era, want, is a balanced playing field not biased in any way in the favor of gangs. tbh gang weapons should not be better than tier 2 weapons with no less than .15 freeze and no more than 2 gang weapons.

that is all

[-HateD-]

To be honest Benny and I have spoken a lot about gang gun stats and none of them are as good statistically as tier 1 guns (or tier 3 idk which one is the top) but they're really close. Maybe a slower rate of fire or a smaller clip or high reload speed but in the chaos that is a successful raid those are pretty minuscule (apart from clip size). Anyways yeah gang guns are OP in my opinion but hey stats dont matter thats why mercenary always gets the best guns :afro:

[Godzilla]

In all honesty, William is a smart cookie due to his experience with the game but his big ego and his unbelievably stupid expectations are what make him so useless as a viable contribution. I mean honestly mate, get a better attitude towards people, It's cool that you're "the best" but why are you so egotistic because of it? In the end we're all just trying to get enjoyment out of the game again, something you're lacking as well, hence why you jump on the forums instigating arguments to prove your 2D dominance but what you lack is the skill to comprehend that we're all different and all want different things.

[ilovegirlzz]

but p2ks, some pl-9/spas mix, and mp5n clones are acceptable gang weapons..cmon now thats just stupid

BREAKING NEWS: STOKES GANG RECEIVE NEW GANG GUN AR-15.

seems pretty balanced if you ask me.

[-HateD-]

Wil if you thinks stats mean nothing then 1v1 me you can use mp5 navy i use flak but there's a wall in between. Stats dont matter right

[Frankie]

raiding isn't fun. pking isn't fun. sparring isn't fun. why? because of the weapons. there are too many lame weapons and too many weapons with stats that can clearly out gun any lower tiered weapon.

- get rid of the shoot-over-wall weapons.
- reduce the amount of weapons.
- the less weapons there are, the easier they are to balance, so balance them accordingly.
- make them easily accessible. take the focus off of the economy and money and make it game play.

I would even argue that every time you log on you should choose a certain load out of any 3 guns. completely get rid of the entire "gun economy." it won't matter if players have access to every gun because skill will now be the ultimate factor in success. different guns will only be preference of play style.

after the weapon situation is resolved, just pump out tons of game play content. quests, events, raid bonuses, whatever. the game would be so much more fun under these conditions.

put yourself into the shoes of a new player who logs onto the server for the first time ever. do you honestly think you'd bother to log onto the game ever again after a few hours, even minutes, of playing? probably not. the expectations of new players are so ridiculously high. you have to spend countless hours grinding tedious jobs in order to earn enough money to buy a some what decent gun, and then you're expected to just "get good" at the game. really? is that the best we can do here?

people can't buy cheap uzis and "get good" and stand a chance against those with a vast arsenal of weapons. that's not how it works anymore unfortunately. these players are just going to get **** on. they are at an extreme disadvantage. the learning curve on this server requires you to have good weapons. then you have to ask yourself, why should people learn how to pk and spar with cheap weapons when they can spend that time making more money to afford something better? basically they're better off spending the first few weeks of playing this game just grinding cash to afford something good before even beginning to practice and get good at the game.

realistically how will the server ever draw in a new player base under these conditions? it seems like the focus is to keep current players happy and make them not want to leave instead of bringing in new players. that's why the player count gets smaller and smaller. even "high" player counts these days consist of 20% idlers and 20% staff/RCs.

I can't be the only one that realizes the current system isn't working anymore. it needs to be changed. try something new for ****s sake.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

I agree to a certain extent, but if you're going to change everything about the game, you might as well make a new game.

[Frankie]

Originally Posted by Fiberwyre_P2P

I agree to a certain extent, but if you're going to change everything about the game, you might as well make a new game.

the only thing that would be changing is how guns are distributed. that's it really. instead of making players grind jobs for money to buy guns, why not put everyone on an even playing field from the very beginning? the core structure of the game will still be the same with a focus on pking, but players will be able to jump right into the action.

in my opinion the economy takes away from the potential of the game to be fun.

there can still be an economy of rare items, collectibles, and maybe introduce novelty weapons that aren't as good as the main group of weapons. this way players can still have a sense of "I have this and you don't." there can even be weapon skins that are limited in availability but the skin doesn't affect the stats of the gun.

I understand players like to collect things. this type of economy wouldn't interfere with the core game play in any way though. there will be players who like to collect rare items but then there will be players who don't care about that sort of stuff but will still get to enjoy the game. you get the best of both worlds.

anyone who opposes this idea would probably just be bitter towards the fact that they would lose their fortune of good weapons. with that kind of attitude you're just going to have a fancy inventory on an empty server. there's no fun in that. I'm sure players who have a lot of weaponry can be compensated in some way as well. keep an open mind.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

So, assuming you have access to any weapon you want from the beginning, and all there is to do is kill people, what keeps people playing? I know I get bored just killing people. Without the aspect of accumulating wealth, what system or mechanic gives people a sense of progression?

[shrimps]

One point after the first reset wasn't there only a few guns? Handgun, Uzi, Shotgun, AK47 and Neo Rifle?

[Godzilla]

Your concept of completely shifting the game to a kill only concept is nothing but flawed.

I mean, let's put away the fact that 10% of Era nearly never die because they have played for 5+ years and have mastered the game to become an "Elite" and that's the only reason they keep playing (Because they excel against others) but let's say a new player joins, he faces off against people who aren't elite but play near every day, he will still have a very bad experience from dying over and over and will see the game as unbalanced and pointless but don't think I'm totally against it, I don't think Era could get any worse than it currently is from the pick-up and play aspect, right now it doesn't cater to the new players at all.

I could be wrong though, I mean I know when I first play a game and I'm not the best at it I try to advance and excel so maybe that might happen and we will see a large increase in player activity and subscriptions bought.

I love the idea of; Every time you log on, you switch to a set of 3 weapons you can use and they are all hotkeyed into; "Main, Secondary and Pistol/Third" but I think they should make it so you can switch this at any time during the game via a menu system or something.

I've said it a million times and I'll say it again; If you want to revolve the game around PKing and becoming a more PK related game, you need to delete over half the current guns. The range of weapons now is too large to cater to unique stats for every weapon/set of weapons If you were to go with the idea above from Frankie.

You would need to delete down to about 15-25 guns (3-5 for each slot) then give each gun a unique stat, e.g Mp5 Navy = 13 damage low freeze high fire-rate and low reload but AK47 = 20 damage, medium freeze, medium fire-rate and high reload etc.

Also going with Frankies idea will basically just make Era a 2D version of TF2 but without the "class" aspect of being able to do different things just using different guns and all having an equal playing field, which isn't totally a bad idea. I mean if people want to become a top-merchant etc they can still own novelty items, hats, etc.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

I'm just going to point out that TF2 has a lot more than 15-25 weapons, yet retains balance and uniqueness among them.

[Godzilla]

Originally Posted by Fiberwyre_P2P

I'm just going to point out that TF2 has a lot more than 15-25 weapons, yet retains balance and uniqueness among them.

Not at all, I only recently started playing TF2 again after first trying it when there was no additional weapons and I can easily say that there is a big disadvantage to the original weapons compared to the additional but that's a whole different game and a whole different topic. The weapons are all based off of the original guns and are replaceable not extra-usable. Which is why they are so balanced, you can't use 2 of the same class, e.g 2 ak47s and 1 glock or something of the same, with Frankies class system it would be; 1 ak47, 1 pbp and 1 glock, so if there is any balanced format in TF2 (Which I'm still yet to find from replaying the game) its based off of the principle of only getting to replace guns and not use 2 of the same type.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by Godzilla

Not at all, I only recently started playing TF2 again after first trying it when there was no additional weapons and I can easily say that there is a big disadvantage to the original weapons compared to the additional but that's a whole different game and a whole different topic. The weapons are all based off of the original guns and are replaceable not extra-usable. Which is why they are so balanced, you can't use 2 of the same class, e.g 2 ak47s and 1 glock or something of the same, with Frankies class system it would be; 1 ak47, 1 pbp and 1 glock, so if there is any balanced format in TF2 (Which I'm still yet to find from replaying the game) its based off of the principle of only getting to replace guns and not use 2 of the same type.

I'm not talking about the starting guns. Those are the equivalent of an Ak47 or Uzi on Era. I'm talking about the other guns. Those are all pretty much balanced with each other. But yeah, that's a different kind of game.

All I'm saying is you don't have to sacrifice variety.

I do agree, though, that having more realistic gun archetypes would be cool. Like SMGs being fast, innaccurate, and weak, assault rifles being medium fire rate, more accurate, and stronger, etc.
Right now, stats don't line up with how guns are in real life at all. An AK47 should do significantly more damage than an MP5.
But you know how people are. The second you mention the word "realistic", people immediately dismiss whatever you're saying with "lol you dodge bullets and respawn when you die."

One thing that has been a part of shooters for a while now, but has never found its way into Era, is moving at different speeds based on what weapon you're using. Like using an LMG would make you run slower than using an Assault Rifle, and an SMG would make you run faster than using either of those, etc. That would be cool to see and would probably do more to differentiate guns than a lot of other stat changes.

(and just saying, I'd much rather play a 2D TF2 than a 2D CoD or CS:GO. I love class-based shooters because classes add an extra layer of strategy by making you consider the different interclass dynamics. Like you would handle a pyro differently based on if you're a medic, heavy, sniper etc.)

[shrimps]

I have 6 hotkey slots though. 6 gun types please.

[ilovegirlzz]

not going to read all of that but frankie you had a nice idea but a few tweaks.
killing other players would give each player money, we will keep the bounty system except everyone has an automatic $75 bounty on their head, when they kill another player this will increase. in pk events this will be disabled of course sort of like zone which would still be alive today if it hadnt been for players not wanting to pay for the game.

i dont agree with the gun loadout idea, guns should still be purchased just not tradeable only pawnable but the only thing that would be bought is food, ammo, instruments, etc

needing ecs to buy instruments was always a dumb idea anyway..

since guns wont be tradeable or sellable, and the only way to obtain money is through pking, we will see who has the most skill by who has the biggest bounty, wallet, and best weapons. no more grinding those first few weeks unless you want to keep the jobs so people could buy misc items.


just a few thoughts

[Tim_Rocks]

I like the idea of bounties increasing with kills, but I feel like that would cause some problems. A) wil would get too much money. B) players would run more to avoid losing their bounty.

[shrimps]

S> Bounty for half the cost.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks

I like the idea of bounties increasing with kills, but I feel like that would cause some problems. A) wil would get too much money. B) players would run more to avoid losing their bounty.

That first problem is unavoidable if we're talking about moving to a skill-based economy rather than a work-based economy. Wil is always going to get the most money in that case.
I don't really see that as a problem, though. There's always going to be someone making the most money, so why not Wil, rather than Seth? XD

[ilovegirlzz]

Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks

I like the idea of bounties increasing with kills, but I feel like that would cause some problems. A) wil would get too much money. B) players would run more to avoid losing their bounty.

too much money cause a problem? noo noo Tim we avoid this problem because money is only used for buying things from NPCs. there will be no trading in the future because we want to base Era solely on skill.

more kills = more money
more money = more items


in order to stop people from running then we will provide no incentive for having a high bounty..well no i take that back highest bounty that day/week will recieve $$+ ec coins if you decide to keep them (btw nitros should be back in EC shop)

another way to stop running would be to make those who are at 7+ killstreaks pkable ANYWHERE. even the hospital, if youre that deadly then youll constantly have to be on guard and No idling except for EC house or gang place or lottery. Yes even in GP or AM you can get whacked.


i like this new idea and it was all impromptu.

[Tim_Rocks]

Actually A) was a joke lol. I like the idea.

[GanNing]

Aye keep that pking stuff outside of AM (unless you got that 5 sec count). Let the players buy ammo in peace.

[Godzilla]

I'm honestly in-love with the load-out idea Frankie suggested, although I doubt it will ever become a real thing, It would benefit the server a lot more and make it all revolve around PKing, you could add and take away guns from the load outs etc at any time, mess around with different combos of primaries and secondaries.

The only real reason people would be against it is if they have an accumulation of wealth that they don't want to get taken away.

This has been the longest time since Era has been reset, they used to reset the server every year/2 years and now everyone has a ridiculous amount of wealth for no reason because you can't really do anything with 10+ Million that people have.

I think the basis of Era was lost, no one was actually supposed to be able to own every item or have every gun, you were supposed to work up to the best weapon, hence why there is a visible path of weapons to own at each price etc.

My opinion;
Reset
Implement the load-out idea (5 Guns to chose from to put in each slot of 3 hotkeys.
Make novelty items the new rares/thing to get/show off.
If you start losing variety, replace guns with new guns
Make all the guns have unique stats.

[Tim_Rocks]

Stefan would never allow us to reset the server. We've been trying for years.

[Godzilla]

Originally Posted by Tim_Rocks

Stefan would never allow us to reset the server. We've been trying for years.

Well I guess you would have to delete all guns then impliment the system, completely eliminate a reset from the equation.

[ilovegirlzz]

yea load out is pro

hmmm how can we reset the server without actually resetting the server?
we cant implement the system without first making everyone poor because people that have 10+ million would be highly displeased and might quit.


BUT there might be a chance that they wouldnt care, think about it, the people who have that much money are the "elite" and surely wouldnt have a problem racking up a lot of kills in a short amount of time, i see the daily kills reach about 500 a day, that

500 x $75 = $37500/day
on top of that, the gang bounties and juggernaut so players can make $50k a day.
yea gonna have to nerf that

[Tim_Rocks]

Tk would still be upset. He's terrible at pking.

[ilovegirlzz]

Tk wasn't bad he had good guns to put him at an advantage

[Frankie]

I don't think a reset would be necessary. I just want to get rid of the gun economy and keep everything else. there are still items that people worked hard for to collect that aren't a problem (like hats for example) but expensive weapons that are impossible for the average player to obtain that are heaps better than the guns they are using are a problem.

basically the trading economy would have absolutely no affect on core gameplay. this means you can't buy your way to successful pking. we'll have two types of players: the people who don't care about collectibles and only want a fun and well balanced gameplay experience, and the people who want more out of the game and will seek unique items.

think of xbox games and achievements. you have the people who will just play the game and have fun, then you have the people who will play the game but also hunt for all the achievements for a higher achievement score.

rich players will still be rich but just in a different way that doesn't give them significant advantages.

[ilovegirlzz]

alright seems like we have this idea all mapped out..lets put it into action sorry wil.

[Godzilla]

Originally Posted by ilovegirlzz

alright seems like we have this idea all mapped out..lets put it into action sorry wil.

I'm sure William is all for this idea...

[Tim_Rocks]

Honestly before any of this can be done Era needs to have its servers fixed.. My ms should be 30 at best.

[-HateD-]

Hat economy has already been ****ed up. Thanks hat box