Graal dieing

[Skyld]

Originally Posted by TheJames

But, notice how everyone that is pretty stubborn about this (Malinko, Skyld) seem to have something going for them on Graal? Malink is GK Staff.. Pretty good thing to be. Skyld's a Developer on Era. That's also another good position.

Both I and Malinko have experience. It would also appear that experience allows us to see Graal in a different (ultimately more reasonable) way to you.
From your original post...

Originally Posted by TheJames

But, I won't harp on Era's downfall, but theres a majority of players gone down the drain! Alright so we have so many servers to play on *Yay*, yet only 3-4 seem fun. The rest have like 10 players and no one can log on. Sure, we can buy a playerworld! But all of the plan's/ideas get shot down like a duck trying to fly away in duck season. Nothings new. No one responds on the Support Tickets. The only active global staff are extremely ****y and/or never log on. Stefan's busy with whatever, You can never get ahold of him.

... You seriously appear to not know what you are talking about.

Originally Posted by TheJames

sure be jack ass's and deny it to hell.

I would say that you are the one denying important factors.

[maximus_asinus]

I think its a matter of which playerworlds should be on the hosted/classic tab, there is several servers that get more players that are hosted then the classic tab, and these servers should take there place.

Classic Rant
Classic barely deserves a spot on the Classic list. Its hardly what it used to be, and do to poor Management, nothing is changing. I complained all the time when I worked there, that I wasn't being assigned anything, and then they told me to redesign a piece of the overworld to keep me quiet. Exodus and I made a layout to a quest, and all we needed was a Baddy NPC scripted and a Boss, but no, it was too much for the Scripters to make, and our levels stayed in that temp folder for over two months now. All the LATs on that server either quit or became inactive because of the lack of help or assignments, and its because of Storm, and his choice in Admins (he chose to keep an inactive LAT Admin on, and luckily they are logging on a little more now).
Ventrue, the guild thats slowly taking over every staff position on Classic has their guildhouse updated and uploaded daily. I wish someone cared enough for the work we did to do this for us, but no, we were only LATs, and the mighty Ventrue's guildhouse needs constant updating. Its sad actually, a couple GPs and an FAQ have NC and Level rights, and the LAT team (other then GrowlZ of course) had nothing. Storm was handing out rights, left and right, except where he needed it most, with the staff who were actually trying to make things right on Classic.

[zim5354]

era is kinda sucking now and if you dont belive me rember the old playercount then look at what it is now.it is hard to start on some servers becuse the players are compleat jerks but what can you do they pay there fees just like everyone else and its not aginst the rules to be a jerk.then with the playerworlds people lose motivation they see that almost no new playerworlds get on the classic list so why try? and to the person without a playerworld it seems as if i pay them they host my server that i will never get on the classic list so :-/

[zokemon]

Graal has been dieing for years.

[zim5354]

well it seems to be taking its toll now.

[TheJames]

Skip the jibber jabber, the playerworld arguments, the fight to be right, and everything else.

I used to love Graal, I couldn't stop playing. I was addicted. But now I can't stand to be on it for 5 minutes, let alone any game. Maybe my "gaming years" are up.

The point of this. Graal's dieing. And that's something you can't argue. I guess that's how the cookie crumbles.

[Kaimetsu]

Originally Posted by TheJames

The point of this. Graal's dieing. And that's something you can't argue

Why would we need to? You haven't given anything but anecdotal evidence.

[TheJames]

Originally Posted by Kaimetsu

anecdotal evidence.

If I knew what the **** that meant, I could maybe reply.

[zokemon]

Originally Posted by TheJames

If I knew what the **** that meant, I could maybe reply.

That was why he said it.

[Chris]

Originally Posted by TheJames

If I knew what the **** that meant, I could maybe reply.

First hand experience or a recount of past experience... Kinda

[iLLusioNofGranduer]

Graal IS becoming less popular, I agree, but that reason being there is not as many new members as there used to be. I think this is due to the age groups that play graal and the maturity level, or lack thereof. When the younger age groups try to play, the players that practically grew up with graal think they are hot stuff and treat new players like they are, well...., new players. These older players often times put new players down so much, that you have got to think to yourself... why on earth would they want to play a game that everybody just picks on them or says mean things to them and generally makes them feel unwelcomed. This is speaking on behalf of kids who actually find graal. My other opinion on why game members seem to be declining is Graal has practically little or NO advertisement anywhere. They should consider buying ads on the internet or possibly with this 3d project make a international advertisement when your done to salvage whatever you have left. Speaking of which, I think is a waste of time because why make something who's technological time has past, especially when there is already better ways to play the same gametype and probably a better game.If it would have come out like maybe 6 years ago it would have been acceptable. Its like the Playstation3 has been invented and what graal is doing is going to invent the atari to compete in the international video game market along with Microsoft, Nintendo, and other industries except they are figuring out how to make the little pixels move and respond to the little stick.

[Inverness]

Graal needs more advertising or something, we need more players

[Okilian]

Originally Posted by Inverness

Graal needs more advertising or something, we need more players

There are a bunch of online sites that have ratings of online games. One of the other games I play gives a small incentive if you vote for the game's site, thus attracting it to be higher on the list..thus few more clicks to visit graalonline.com.

[zim5354]

yes it does but it also needs some fixes moderating playerworlds, not to mention a incentive to make playerworlds.

[coreys]

I more see graal as an instrument. An instrument to make your own world. Your own game. And then to see and play the worlds and games that other people have made. Most of the good developers on graal most likely plan to be video game designers when the time comes. I know I do. I think more and more people are trying to do the staff thing, rather than play graal. Unfortunately most of them aren't good at it, and never will be. I honestly don't think graal is so much dying as it is becoming less of a playable experience. I often play graal, Maloria, to be precise. Extremely well done servers like that are where all the players go. If the good developers would spend their time on original, good servers like Maloria, or Aeon, or any other well done server then graal's popularity would most likely increase majorly. Unfortunately most of the servers that graal boasts about are not very well done in my opinion. Like N-Pulse, I think most of that server has extremely bad levels, and not much playability, or much to do. Many other server's are like that as well. You take a server like Maloria and there are a hundred different things to do at any on time, maybe even more.

[James]

I disapprove of your name.

[coreys]

Originally Posted by James

I disapprove of your name.

O.o?

[LordMatt]

Graal2001....

[Crono]

You know Graal's dying when n00bs begin to complain about it.

[Darlene159]

Originally Posted by Gerami

You know Graal's dying when n00bs begin to complain about it.

Not really...new people will sometimes copy older players to fit in, a lot of the people who complain about things seem to not even know what they are complaining about, which is sad....

[protagonist]

Yeah, Graal is dying.

The reasons?


As Spark said, lack of updates that everyone can appreciate. Let's be honest: most players don't really care about GScript2. They don't care if new functions are added, they want more functions that relate to them. They don't care how NPCs work, just as long as they work. If you want to interest players, put in more features that affect them directly and in an obvious way. A global messaging system for players, for example. Also, make an official server which has normal bodies, normal heads, and so on. In my opinion, the small, squat bodies of Graal appeal more to me than those of Kingdoms. Same with the tileset: use the old one and fix it up a little. I'm not saying keep it the same, but put it back to the original design and just improve the shading on those graphics. I liked it[the old tileset] far more because it encouraged that nice, clean feeling instead of the cluttery feeling that the new one has.

The normal bodies are more classic and if people really wanted super-advanced graphics they would look to other MMORPGs. Graal's aim should be to improve its playability and functionality from a player's perspective, not from a developer's. Occasional scripting updates are fine, but they shouldn't be the center point of updates. Also, most people can run Graal just fine; we don't need performance updates all of the time. What we need are, to put it frankly, more buttons to play with.

[Kaimetsu]

Originally Posted by protagonist

As Spark said, lack of updates that everyone can appreciate. Let's be honest: most players don't really care about GScript2. They don't care if new functions are added

But they might care about the advances that it facilitates.

Let me guess: You don't know anything about them?

[Crono]

Originally Posted by Darlene159

Not really...new people will sometimes copy older players to fit in, a lot of the people who complain about things seem to not even know what they are complaining about, which is sad....

...what?

I said that you know that graal is dying when n00bies begin to complain about it. these n00bs never even played old graal or anything and yet they are STILL complaining which is pathetic because graal has been the same (kinda sucked) since late 2003.

[zim5354]

how would you know this just log on and look at the population compaired to what it was two years ago.

[Darlene159]

Originally Posted by zim5354

how would you know this just log on and look at the population compaired to what it was two years ago.

I have no idea who you are talking to since you didn't quote anyone

[DarkShadows_Legend]

He was referring to the thread topic, thats why he didn't quote anyone.

Comparing now to 2 years ago I wouldn't say the population has dropped dramatically. Players left, and new players replaced them.

4-5 years ago compared to now, yes, huge noticeable drop.

Still I doubt anyone here except a few is able to get the exact figures on the stats.

I want more people to blow up and pk. So yeah how do you people propose we get more players without making ridiculous changes you'll all whine about like last time?

[zim5354]

well the servers are the same i mean like some servers are there whitch shouldent be (classic in its condition) also there are some good privet servers that imho should be on the classic list but i doubt any new servers will be added or changed.

[KuJi]

I think I've seen graal hit 1300 before. But..yeah..graal was free then.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by KuJi

I think I've seen graal hit 1300 before. But..yeah..graal was free then.

The playercount can hit 700-800 at a time. That's still pretty good, and P2P is'nt the main factor of why the playercount is'nt atleast 1k i think, because most of the kids whom don't have a credit card asked their parents to upgrade their account. I think the reason Graal's playercount is'nt 1k or above is mainly due to the deduction of our current playerworlds quality.

[zim5354]

graal does have pay by cash though.

[Leasure-13]

What i dont understand about graal is that you have to pay to have a server... where it is helping graal out because it is bringing anouther world to the classic tab or hosted, and then you got to have peoeple work on it (dedicated time) and them people that are good workers are hard to come apon now days. But anyhow, i know that it cost some money to run the servers on there own computers... ok, but that is where the p2p comes in. Not only that being a factor of graal, it is just no fun anymore....all the old people where replaced with immature little kids.

[Kaimetsu]

Originally Posted by Leasure-13

What i dont understand about graal is that you have to pay to have a server... where it is helping graal out

Most servers don't bring in any real revenue, but they do use system resources.

[haro41]

maybe they can extend the waving of server fees to the hosted tab as well, since these projects are viewed as hopefuls.

[trans9o0111]

I understand that Graal needs to charge for server hosting, since it is consuming their servers' resources. However, it is ridiculous that people have to pay to develope on non-classic tab servers. It would be in Graal's best interest if they removed the hosted/private/gold tabs (or whatever they use now) and have only a gold and classic tab. What good would come of this? I believes it would result in better Player World quality, and also allow servers that are overlooked because they ar eon hosted tabs to tap into the UN-ERA markets, thus broadening Graals appeal to the "bored" people.

[haro41]

protagonist, would you rather have had graal stay as classic, expanding and evolving on itself, rather than changing graal into something new? In a sense, moving forward, not upward? Its interesting to think about what could have been. We could all still have been playing classic to this day.

[protagonist]

Originally Posted by Kaimetsu

But they might care about the advances that it facilitates.

Let me guess: You don't know anything about them?

You guess wrong, as usual. Just stick to the stuff you know.

It is doubtful that they care about the advances it facilitates to the point where they are drooling over (or even care about) every single update released, which is almost always based on fixing something in GS2. In fact, I bet they don't even pay attention to GS2 stuff or know about it (probably don't read newfeatures) It's too bad you're not quite as intelligent as some people (including yourself) might think you are. Take your attitude somewhere else, parrot. I'm tired of your repetitious arrogance.

Originally Posted by haro41

protagonist, would you rather have had graal stay as classic, expanding and evolving on itself, rather than changing graal into something new? In a sense, moving forward, not upward? Its interesting to think about what could have been. We could all still have been playing classic to this day.

I had more fun in the classic days. True, it might have worn itself out, but before P2P there were people who were alot nicer. Not everyone was, but there seemed to be a greater number of just plain nice people. Also, the "classic" gaming feel was why I started playing. Not because Graal was the most graphically advanced game on the market, but because it was Zelda-like.

[Kaimetsu]

Originally Posted by protagonist

You guess wrong, as usual

And you offer no contrary evidence, as usual.

It is doubtful that they care about the advances it facilitates to the point where they are drooling over (or even care about) every single update released, which is almost always based on fixing something in GS2. In fact, I bet they don't even pay attention to GS2 stuff or know about it

Where did you learn to read? I didn't say they cared about the language. I said that they will care about the advances it facilitates.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=facilitate

It's too bad you're not quite as intelligent as some people (including yourself) might think you are

Hahaha. Y'know, this whole BAD BOY VT act isn't so much intimidating as it is endearing. It's like watching a four-year-old rebelliously scowling after a stern admonishment.

[protagonist]

Originally Posted by Kaimetsu

And you offer no contrary evidence, as usual.

I thought we were to assume the negative if no proof for the positive was given? It is laughable that you change your standards just so that it suits your argument. Of course you'll try to talk your way out of this. Go ahead, straw man yourself.

Originally Posted by Kaimetsu

Where did you learn to read? I didn't say they cared about the language. I said that they will care about the advances it facilitates.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=facilitate

Where did you learn to read? I didn't say they didn't care about the advances it facilitates, I said they didn't care enough to actually make them feel better about the game. The only possible things that the average player would appreciate is a fix to a bug, not the addition of hidden(to them, anyway) functions. Bug fixes are not that common, and most of the time it seems updates are designed to give developers an easier time rather than adding things that players might enjoy directly.

Originally Posted by Kaimetsu

Hahaha. Y'know, this whole BAD BOY VT act isn't so much intimidating as it is endearing. It's like watching a four-year-old rebelliously scowling after a stern admonishment.

Dude, you use snob appeal to make people think they want these updates. You just tried to tell me that I must not understand the updates if I don't think they're so great. The fact is I read the newfeatures, and I'm regularly unimpressed in doing so. "Rebellious four-year-old" is just about as solid as "self-important snob".

[Kaimetsu]

Originally Posted by protagonist

I thought we were to assume the negative if no proof for the positive was given?

No, I said that we were to assume the default. Most non-scripters don't know anything about GS2, and you're most definitely not a scripter. The default assumption is that you're completely ignorant of what it brings, and you've given us no reason to move away from that default.

Where did you learn to read? I didn't say they didn't care about the advances it facilitates

No, your counterargument was that the players "don't even pay attention to GS2 stuff or know about it". That's great, but I never claimed that they do.

The point is that they don't need to be aware of something in order to benefit from it.

Dude, you use snob appeal to make people think they want these updates

I do? When was the last time I mentioned them, outside of this thread? Or are you basing this solely on the fact that I admonished you for speaking about something you don't understand?

You just tried to tell me that I must not understand the updates if I don't think they're so great. The fact is I read the newfeatures

Haha. Congratulations on being literate, but you're not really proving anything. What makes you think everything is in newfeatures? Graal's undergoing an apotheosis at the moment, what with the standardisation of GS2 and the advances in V4. It's a long process, but the end result is that developers will be able to make grander, richer systems than before, and they'll be able to do it twice as quickly.

[Nitkizi]

Graal3D is dead?