betflipping

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by supaman771

add more vs. Npc options for money, like betflipping. I remember making a sweet ass horse racing track on gg, and there was a similar pinecone race on era at one point. I'm not saying it all has to be gambling either, what happened to the gun range.. Someone could update that to be more relevant/fun (make it like a duck-hunting mini-game). Make an arcade... I remember seeing the locked building on the boardwalk for like 7 years and no one ever made it. Give the idlers at osl something to do, put those chess/checker boards on the tables and make them actually work (even simple things like tic-tac-toe/connect 4.. I remember playing/betting on that stuff with friends all the time). Finish the sr casino; moon had some really great looking outlines for blackjack and hold'em games that never got finished. Make the boxing in the gym work, and let players rent gloves/the ring to use; let other people even bet on it.

+1

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

I'm just gonna throw in that if there are going to be more types of NPC gambling, they should be completely fair, and not skewed in favor of the house, like the NPC tables at the casino are. (grossly, skewed, I might add. 70-30.)

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by Fiberwyre_P2P

I'm just gonna throw in that if there are going to be more types of NPC gambling, they should be completely fair, and not skewed in favor of the house, like the NPC tables at the casino are. (grossly, skewed, I might add. 70-30.)

The house can never be completely fair. They would never profit, so what would be the point? The house always wins. It's upto you to walk away with your winnings and not go back to it.

If it was 50/50 then the economy would get worse.

It would need to be 60 house/40 us. The idea is to take money out of the economy but giving people the chance to win money. If you lose you lose, if you win then it's down to you to do the right thing and walk away.

Majority of gamblers never win.. That's reality.

[bloodykiller]

We seem to be forgetting that people play era to PK. For example I still don't understand why we have so many non pk events and why ETs always host them.

[Supaman771]

Originally Posted by Godzilla

you can't get a fraction of a dollar, you would need to add cents or do a different conversion rate.

Impossible, Era uses default Graal Gralats, which only work in whole numbers, you'd need a custom money system.

Originally Posted by BlueMelon

No, just placed a bounty seems to be working.

We tried this the other day when I got you to add that Juggernaut Display; It took my money for the bounty but we were unable to accept the bounty and you put a block in-front of the cpu.

Originally Posted by Kohola_KinG

It would need to be 60 house/40 us. The idea is to take money out of the economy but giving people the chance to win money. If you lose you lose, if you win then it's down to you to do the right thing and walk away.

This, but you could always use a temporary 'holding-pond' of money that can be monitored, similar to how Stephen did his Lottery place. If players lose a lot then you can drain the pond, but if someone goes on a incredible win-streak they can't win more than X amount overall. (It would be even more controlled than digging shells or -any- other money inlet on the server at this point).

Originally Posted by bloodykiller

We seem to be forgetting that people play era to PK. For example I still don't understand why we have so many non pk events and why ETs always host them.

A lot of people don't though. Just because you do, and I do, doesn't mean everybody does. Some people work at businesses all the time, or mine all the time, or just log-in to chat with friends/play events, or to be Staff (a lot of staff weren't players as some people talk about commonly). Doing those small mini-projects that just add some different tastes to the game could keep some of these players online longer/more often. (Between PKing)

[bloodykiller]

How can Era grow if its focus isn't on PK? New players don't download and get addicted to era for the chatting or the working

[Zongui]

Originally Posted by bloodykiller

How can Era grow if its focus isn't on PK? New players don't download and get addicted to era for the chatting or the working

hahaha. that was funny. it made me think of players joining era just to mine or shovel. like that is the big focus of the game. I am gonna play era to mine in the caves all day because it is fun. whatever floats their boat though.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by Kohola_KinG

The house can never be completely fair. They would never profit, so what would be the point? The house always wins. It's upto you to walk away with your winnings and not go back to it.

If it was 50/50 then the economy would get worse.

It would need to be 60 house/40 us. The idea is to take money out of the economy but giving people the chance to win money. If you lose you lose, if you win then it's down to you to do the right thing and walk away.

Majority of gamblers never win.. That's reality.

The house doesn't need an unfair advantage to make a profit, it's already charging a fee to use the tables.

You're anthropomorphizing the house just a little bit. Why do you care if an NPC makes money? It doesn't affect you or anyone else.
The house doesn't need to make money to stay in business. It has no expenses. It doesn't pay its workers, it doesn't pay rent, or taxes, or anything else.
It's just a few lines of code, some levels, some graphics, and a database, probably.

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by Fiberwyre_P2P

The house doesn't need an unfair advantage to make a profit, it's already charging a fee to use the tables.

You're anthropomorphizing the house just a little bit. Why do you care if an NPC makes money? It doesn't affect you or anyone else.
The house doesn't need to make money to stay in business. It has no expenses. It doesn't pay its workers, it doesn't pay rent, or taxes, or anything else.
It's just a few lines of code, some levels, some graphics, and a database, probably.

$100 fee & the house could lose $25000 $50000 and so on if on 50/50. You're running the risk of millions being pumped into the economy. Can you really not see that?

It's only a sinkhole for the player vs player tables as they make a profit each time a player plays on the table, they get the fees. Different story when it's player vs NPC..

Using this as an example from NPC $25,000 table. Fee is $300. If you take the fee into consideration you now have a chance to win.. $24,700.

So the house loses everything?

A player grabs the table and wins $25,000 of the house. Do you think because the house has a fee of $300 that they're taking money out of the economy? Obviously not, the house just pumped $24,700 into the economy. Now with it being 50/50, there is an even chance he can win again. So he could now walk away with $49,400. He could go again and win. Hell he could do this 10 times and win all of them. It's even odds remember. This is to much of a risky sinkhole that could potentially mess things up even more.

You're anthropomorphizing the house just a little bit. Why do you care if an NPC makes money? It doesn't affect you or anyone else.
The house doesn't need to make money to stay in business. It has no expenses. It doesn't pay its workers, it doesn't pay rent, or taxes, or anything else.
It's just a few lines of code, some levels, some graphics, and a database, probably.

You don't get it, do you? By the NPC making money takes money out of the economy. Simply put, there is to much money out there. These systems are put in place to take money out. "NOT EVERYBODY IS SUPPOSE TO BE A WINNER." Gambling is luck. Do you really think casinos and betting systems irl are 50/50, hell no!? It cant be... It cant and doesn't work like that, it just cant?

Same applies to this game.. It's a sinkhole.. Nothing more, nothing less. Gambling is fun... You might lose more than you win, hell you are going to lose more than you win but it's the losing part that makes you chase the money, sometimes you win it back, sometimes you win more than you put in.. Sometimes you lose it all but it's fun.

That's gambling.

Now... If you wanna talk about systems that player vs player then it can be 50/50. The house can still benefit from fees as nobody is competing against the "house".

60house/40player. The house benefits more and then it becomes more realistic gambling.

[Tim_Rocks]

We should disable Pking, it's technically a gamble whether or not you live. Whose with me!?

[shrimps]

YEAH! I don't use PK mode anyway!

[Jhinsavage]

I agree just remove betflipping its terrible

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by Kohola_KinG

Spiel about some guy winning 10 times in a row

The odds of someone winning a 50/50 game 10 times in a row is about 1 in 1024.

You are just throwing numbers out to make a point, but that's not actually how it would go down.

If it's 50/50, you would statistically win about as much as you lose, and the house would be collecting fees the whole time. Either way, if you're up or down, you're losing more money than you're winning.

Not only that, but the buy-in could be a lot more than $300 if you're talking about a $25,000 table. Maybe it should just be an even 10% for every table.

If you charge a $2,500 fee for a $25k table, you would win $22.5k, but you would lose $27.5k.

Also, aren't you always one of those people who make fun of me or whoever else when they bring up realism in this game? **** off.

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by Fiberwyre_P2P

The odds of someone winning a 50/50 game 10 times in a row is about 1 in 1024.

You are just throwing numbers out to make a point, but that's not actually how it would go down.

If it's 50/50, you would statistically win about as much as you lose, and the house would be collecting fees the whole time. Either way, if you're up or down, you're losing more money than you're winning.

Not only that, but the buy-in could be a lot more than $300 if you're talking about a $25,000 table. Maybe it should just be an even 10% for every table.

If you charge a $2,500 fee for a $25k table, you would win $22.5k, but you would lose $27.5k.

Also, aren't you always one of those people who make fun of me or whoever else when they bring up realism in this game? **** off.

You could win about as much as you lose but that's not fact. 50/50 gives you the chance to win more than you lose. You aren't taking into the consideration of many people vs the NPC not just one. So what if 50 people are + on the house??

fees are only like $300? The amount of times you would need to flip $25,000 for the house to even get what they lost on 1 flip. So yet again, your fee talk is nonsense.

And a fee of $2,500 for $25,000. Wise up.

Also, aren't you always one of those people who make fun of me or whoever else when they bring up realism in this game? **** off.

No. I rarely talk to you because you're the type that's always right, never wrong. Mr know it all. Then if people don't agree you

That quote summons it up really.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by Kohola_KinG

You could win about as much as you lose but that's not fact. 50/50 gives you the chance to win more than you lose. You aren't taking into the consideration of many people vs the NPC not just one. So what if 50 people are + on the house??

fees are only like $300? The amount of times you would need to flip $25,000 for the house to even get what they lost on 1 flip. So yet again, your fee talk is nonsense.

And a fee of $2,500 for $25,000. Wise up.



No. I rarely talk to you because you're the type that's always right, never wrong. Mr know it all. Then if people don't agree you

That quote summons it up really.

I'll just start by saying that you're a prime example of someone who is always right. Anytime you're wrong, you just accuse the person you're arguing with of always being right.

I'll follow that up by saying that you clearly don't grasp the concept of probability.
You have exactly the same chance to win as you do to lose.

If 50 people are up, 50 people are more than likely down. The more rolls the are, the closer to 50/50 the results will be.

You say the fees are too low, but when I propose raising them, you tell me to wise up?

[BlueMelon]

I really don't see this discussion going anywhere, it's replies like these that spams the thread and hides the good ideas.

Obviously the system is biased to the house and the formula for the system is a simple variable. This can definitely be improved though, benefiting the player and making it seem like there is a better chance at winning. The idea of a 'holding-pond' is a model used in other games/gambling system which could work on era. (I forget where the holding-pond post was, it got lost among the spam)

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by BlueMelon

I really don't see this discussion going anywhere, it's replies like these that spams the thread and hides the good ideas.

Obviously the system is biased to the house and the formula for the system is a simple variable. This can definitely be improved though, benefiting the player and making it seem like there is a better chance at winning. The idea of a 'holding-pond' is a model used in other games/gambling system which could work on era. (I forget where the holding-pond post was, it got lost among the spam)

The jackpot ("holding pond") should have a rate of decay. This will both encourage more betting and protect the economy a little better.

[Godzilla]

A while ago we were working on "The sword in the stone" there are ganis and images somewhere, you could just make a fee of say $10-$50, the 100,000 person to attempt to grab the sword out of the stone actually gets it, the sword is basically a melee weapon like the bamboo or another item, it's pretty cool.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Godzilla

A while ago we were working on "The sword in the stone" there are ganis and images somewhere, you could just make a fee of say $10-$50, the 100,000 person to attempt to grab the sword out of the stone actually gets it, the sword is basically a melee weapon like the bamboo or another item, it's pretty cool.

If people know they won't win until the 100,000 attempt it could discourage a lot of people from trying. Instead, you could try a 1/100,000 chance or probably more appropriately, a greater chance.

[bloodykiller]

Originally Posted by Stephen

encourage more betting.

Are you ****ing serious?

Loads of players quit when they lose all their money betflipping!! People become seriously addicted, we should focus on helping them stop betflipping not encourage more betflipping.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by bloodykiller

Are you ****ing serious?

Loads of players quit when they lose all their money betflipping!! People become seriously addicted, we should focus on helping them stop betflipping not encourage more betflipping.

Or reduce the total they can betflip in one bet. Also, looks like Era is cruising along just fine.

[bloodykiller]

1. Things could always go better.

2. Raids never occur, especially cuz era's gang population is spread out in too many gangs.

3. The statistics are relative since you used to get dced for afking and now that doesn't happen anymore.

[shrimps]

Yeah,I have to agree, the no disconnect really invalidates the activity statistics.

[Rave_J]

just make Rubles and replace the era dollar.
so make new guns cost like 300 Rubles
and not era dollars so all the billions of dollars is worth jack crap.
make jobs give u certain minerals to give u rubles and era money so the currency is slower
after awhile make a currency change over to rubles and remove old era money currency.

[shrimps]

HEY! Pull a page from Graal Kingdoms and add an item betflip table!

[Supaman771]

Originally Posted by shrimps

HEY! Pull a page from Graal Kingdoms and add an item betflip table!

We said this tons of times

[shrimps]

I mean get rid of betflipping!

[Demisis_P2P]

Originally Posted by Supaman771

I like the idea of scaling down, but it wouldn't work by just /10ing everything. You can't have .# of a dollar, and most base items/job payouts are like $2, 3, 5, 6, 11, someone would have to re-balance all the jobs. I'd do it cause it actually sounds like fun, but I'm not a staffer.

You can have .# of a dollar. You cant have .# of a gelat. All it would take is an interface change to make 105 gelats display as $10.50.
Jobs could stay the way they are. But this doesnt actually fix anything.

Another solution would be to bring back the supply/demand pricing in NPC shops. Not sure why it was ever removed, but it helped the NPC shop keep up with the ammo sales at Gun Point and Ammo Mart back in the day.
How it works, is if nobody buys an item from the NPC shop for a while the price slowly starts falling in the shop. Eventually shop prices should equalise with the real trading value of items and when people buy from the shop instead of a player the money is actually removed from circulation.
So MP5 is 900k in the shop atm, it trades among players for 750k. After nobody buying an MP5 for a few hours in the shop it drops in price by 1%, rinse and repeat. After a while it's <749k in the shop, so somebody buys it from there instead of from a player, and 749k is destroyed, then the price goes back up to 900k and the process starts again.
Ammo was slightly different because it was based on hourly sales I think, if it didnt sell more than a certain number of boxes of ammo in an hour the price dropped by $1 for the next whole hour.

[Stephen]

When I was trying to identify the problem last year, what I observed was that jobs paid way more than they should. The rationalization was that you should be able to buy something nice with one day of hard work.

I mentioned "balance" earlier. If you want to decrease the bloat at the top you have to reduce the trickle in at the bottom - like jobs. This won't have the same over night effect of intentionally manipulating the value of items by knocking off a few decimal places from the value but the long term effect is much more healthy and sustainable.

Era is like the proverbial horse; you can take it to water but you can't make it drink.

[lTBSl]

Originally Posted by Demisis_P2P

You can have .# of a dollar. You cant have .# of a gelat. All it would take is an interface change to make 105 gelats display as $10.50.
Jobs could stay the way they are. But this doesnt actually fix anything.

Another solution would be to bring back the supply/demand pricing in NPC shops. Not sure why it was ever removed, but it helped the NPC shop keep up with the ammo sales at Gun Point and Ammo Mart back in the day.
How it works, is if nobody buys an item from the NPC shop for a while the price slowly starts falling in the shop. Eventually shop prices should equalise with the real trading value of items and when people buy from the shop instead of a player the money is actually removed from circulation.
So MP5 is 900k in the shop atm, it trades among players for 750k. After nobody buying an MP5 for a few hours in the shop it drops in price by 1%, rinse and repeat. After a while it's <749k in the shop, so somebody buys it from there instead of from a player, and 749k is destroyed, then the price goes back up to 900k and the process starts again.
Ammo was slightly different because it was based on hourly sales I think, if it didnt sell more than a certain number of boxes of ammo in an hour the price dropped by $1 for the next whole hour.

I really, really like the idea of bringing this back..I do remember this years and years ago.

[Godzilla]

Originally Posted by lTBSl

I really, really like the idea of bringing this back..I do remember this years and years ago.

I need to stop talking to my brother about what I think should happen, he always posts them on the forums and gets love

[WillaWonka]

Lost a mil.

This game is boring anyways especially after owning all the guns ever available for purchase... whatevs.

[Supaman771]

Originally Posted by WillaWonka

Lost a mil.

This game is boring anyways especially after owning all the guns ever available for purchase... whatevs.

Lost a 1m betflip like a month ago.

But I won it all from betflipping anyway, save for the first 50k I got from pawning quest items.

[shrimps]

So....We keeping or removing bet flipping?
Lets put an end to this.

[Spikedude]

Originally Posted by shrimps

So....We keeping or removing bet flipping?
Lets put an end to this.

I don't see any reason to remove betflipping :o nobody is forcing players to participate, and I don't buy in to the premise that people are quitting over betflip. Everyone who I've heard say "I'm quitting Era because I lost everything in betflip" has been back online (and usually at the betflip table) within 24 hours.

I like a lot of the ideas that have come out in this thread. I see a "sword in the stone" type thing being very possible, and I will open some discussion about the possibility of having a demand-based npc shop again.

[k_killar]

if u dont got luck den u not gonna win noobs me and tre made 20m+ off bet flipping but we got perma banned for being too rich , broke admins love banning young rich nqqas

[Tim_Rocks]

Originally Posted by k_killar

if u dont got luck den u not gonna win noobs me and tre made 20m+ off bet flipping but we got perma banned for being too rich , broke admins love banning young rich nqqas

Darlene, this is racist.

[GanNing]

I tried it once. Did the 5k one. I won. Then I gave 5k back to the player that I beat. I just wanted to try it.

[bloodykiller]

Originally Posted by k_killar

if u dont got luck den u not gonna win noobs me and tre made 20m+ off bet flipping but we got perma banned for being too rich , broke admins love banning young rich nqqas

I never got banned for that, maybe they cross-checked IQ and wealth