Internet+PSP=Graal, OMFG

[Devil]

Still a bad idea in any case. Just leave it to the PC, it's not like it's going to be around forever anyway.

[zephirot]

Originally Posted by Devil

Still a bad idea in any case. Just leave it to the PC, it's not like it's going to be around forever anyway.

Who knows..

[Demisis_P2P]

Originally Posted by zephirot

Who knows..

Unixmad.
I'm pretty sure he won't want to post earnings reports or anything though.

[Admins]

There are several problem with ports to console/mobile:
- takes some development time which could be better spent on PC version improvements
- it's hard to find distributors for the game without losing the rights on the game or only getting a very small percentage of the income

Until those platforms are not really open (for developing and selling games) it will probably be hard to release a console version of Graal.

[Tyhm]

Last I heard (years and years ago), the theory went that if Graal is built as Kernel and Emulator, then Stefan has but to make a single stable Emulator on any platform he likes (including key-mapping, etc) then update the Kernel seperately and Voila, it'll be an update for all platforms at once.
Graal on the PC!
Graal on the Mac!
Graal on the TV!
Graal on the cellphone!
Graal on the microwave!
Graal on the toaster!

Trouble of course was that the Simple Emulator had to handle little things like How The Various Platforms Handle Image Processing, etc...which led to the long string of "This weird error only happens on Macs", which led to a lot of Case Selection on the Mac client, which may have scrapped the Multiplatform Graal Effort. Who knows? (Well, Stefan probably does, but he's so busy with G3D under the theory that All Graal Needs Is Another Good Project, not tools for players to build their own content and market their own servers and bring in their own playerbase, perish the thought...)

Awe man, what're the odds Stefan'd post a more definitive answer in the 7 minutes it took to type this? Ripoff...;-)

[Devil]

It's not popular enough for it to be ported.

Why waste time on updates to the client and game, for porting and other crap when they know it's not going to sell.

[Admins]

Originally Posted by Tyhm

Last I heard (years and years ago), the theory went that if Graal is built as Kernel and Emulator, ...

Graal is like that, that's why the Linux, Mac and Windows version share the same code except for displaying. This is not a technical question of being able to port, this is a question if it's worth the time spent when we know that it doesn't bring money. The time is better spent on improving the PC version and making the things that we already have better and easier to access.

[Matt]

Im sure it'd bring in money. The current players might buy, then they tell their friends, ect. Its all about promotion, i think.

[Infernix]

....PSP over the DS lol...I guess the PSP is built more for the internet but bleh. I wont waste my time on a system is a majority of bad games.

[Draenin]

Stick to development for PC. Porting Graal systems over to handheld didn't work too well in the past, and I'm doubtful it will now.

[Minoc]

Originally Posted by Infernix

....PSP over the DS lol...I guess the PSP is built more for the internet but bleh. I wont waste my time on a system is a majority of bad games.

Unless you are a platformer/RPG fan, the PSP is probably the better choice.

[konidias]

PSP is lame. Who owns one? I don't know anybody that has a PSP. Yay, 95% of the games are old playstation games and then if you want to watch movies you have to buy it in a new format which is just more wasted money.

$200 for the PSP
+ $ for accessories
+ having to buy all the games/movies over again....

You'd be better off buying a cheap laptop and watching your own dvds or burned videos on it. It might be bigger but it's still portable and can do far more than a PSP can.

Honestly I've been turned off to Sony and Microsoft X-Box ever since computers have been a better value. Which is pretty much when ps2/x-box arrived. They are just glorified computers disguised as consoles. Yet I've remained loyal to Nintendo because they are always coming out with innovative new ways to play games. Dual screen portable system with a touch screen, the nintendo wii with remote, etc. Sony/Microsoft don't have this in terms of gaming. (and no I don't think the little tilt detection in the ps3 controller counts for much)

Call me old fashioned, but I want to feel like I'm playing a videogame when I play a videogame... I don't want to feel like I'm playing a PC game with a gamepad.

/ end rant

But yeah, to stay on topic... the only way Graal would work on a console is if it had online mode. Graal as an offline game is nowhere near comparable to the game it was based off of. It might make a decent minigame for a phone or something though.

[Minoc]

There are enough good PSP games.
Mortal Kombat Unchained, Tekken, Worms Open Warfare, Ridge Racer, MGS Portable Ops, Twisted Metal, GTA, just to name a few.

[Tyhm]

Originally Posted by Stefan

Graal is like that, that's why the Linux, Mac and Windows version share the same code except for displaying. This is not a technical question of being able to port, this is a question if it's worth the time spent when we know that it doesn't bring money. The time is better spent on improving the PC version and making the things that we already have better and easier to access.

Oh I very much agree - adding features like backup server, restore backup, load template, developing template servers with a host of ready-made tools so even people who aren't/don't have scripting geniuses can make decent servers (instead of everyone painstakingly building the same exact system NPC and retiring), a hubworld to encourage playerworld cooperation, a neutral website to act as a web-hub for all the PWs equally (so we can start treating Graal like a dev environment instead of Kingdoms With Player-built Mods)...

But then, if RC's going Scripted, these are all Kernel tasks. When scripted-RC gets Backup Server, it gets Backup Server for all platforms...when Graal gets Hubworld, it gets Hubworld for all platforms.

But then, I don't set priorities, for all I know there's some horrible drawing bug looming on the mac version or something.

[konidias]

Originally Posted by Minoc

There are enough good PSP games.
Mortal Kombat Unchained, Tekken, Worms Open Warfare, Ridge Racer, MGS Portable Ops, Twisted Metal, GTA, just to name a few.

All of which are basically ports of old Playstation games... I remember playing Twisted Metal when I was like 13... which was 11 years ago.

I mean I'm not trying to say that it's not a fun game... but it's not a title you should need to be listing as one of the good games for a new portable system... Even though nintendo DS has old versions of mario and such, they still have the new super mario bros game.

[Minoc]

Originally Posted by konidias

All of which are basically ports of old Playstation games... I remember playing Twisted Metal when I was like 13... which was 11 years ago.

I mean I'm not trying to say that it's not a fun game... but it's not a title you should need to be listing as one of the good games for a new portable system... Even though nintendo DS has old versions of mario and such, they still have the new super mario bros game.

Mortal Kombat Unchained is an improved version of Deception.
Tekken: Dark Resurrection - an improved Tekken 5.
Worms Open Warfare - a new 2d Worms (it has a DS port as well, which is considered inferior)
Ridge Racers, MGS Portable Ops and Twisted Metal - brand new games.
GTA - modified versions of GTA3 and Vice City (although PS2 ports have been released as well)

[Draenin]

I've thought about getting a PSP to throw emulators and roms onto, but I'd wait for the price to go down first. From what I understand, it's a ton easier to run emulators flawlessly on PSP than on DS. I could always put the GB rom for Graal on it. ;p

[Crono]

Originally Posted by konidias

Yet I've remained loyal to Nintendo because they are always coming out with innovative new ways to play games. Dual screen portable system with a touch screen, the nintendo wii with remote, etc.

Always? Apart from the obvious Wii and DS which you already mentioned, what else have they done?

[Demisis_P2P]

Originally Posted by Gerami

Always? Apart from the obvious Wii and DS which you already mentioned, what else have they done?

Rumble pack.
Power glove.
Light gun.
Analogue stick.
AND POKEmOAN SILVER!!!

[konidias]

There was also the power pad (which idea is now used heavily with DDR) and the virtual boy... and while that didn't work out too well, it was at least a lot different than what everyone else was doing.

Also the original gameboy... which pretty much set the stage for every handheld to follow.

What hardware has sony or x-box invented that could change gameplay so much? (that a PC didn't do already)

edit: there was also...

gameboy camera (which I think was the first camera accessory for a portable game system)

broadcast satellaview (which was made for the SNES and allowed japanese players the ability to download games via satellite.... there was actually a version of link to the past for this)

and the gameboy printer

[Devil]

I thought we were talking about how much of a failure Graal would be if it were ported.

[Draenin]

I would see DS being better for gameplay, but I'd also imagine that code conversion and implementation for it would be much harder.

[konidias]

Originally Posted by Draenin

I would see DS being better for gameplay, but I'd also imagine that code conversion and implementation for it would be much harder.

But I think it would make it far easier to treat the stylus as a mouse.

[Draenin]

Precisely.

[Tyhm]

(And the ROB, Robotic Operating Buddy, for Gyromite and, well, pretty much just Gyromite...)

If the kernel's set up right you just have the GBA frontend say "Stylus=Mouse, A=A, B=S, Start=Q, Screen=Screen, go!" Then you have the PSP frontend say "Analog=Mouse, Triangle=A, Square=S, X=D, Circle=Q, Screen=Screen, go!" Then you have the cellphone frontend say "8=Up, 4=Left, 6=Right, 2=Down, 7=A, 9=S, 1=D, 5=Q, Display=Screen, go!" Then you have the toaster frontend say "Lever=S, go!", and you have a handy on-the-go mining interface. :-P

[Devil]

Booo.

The worst thing involved would be typing, talking to other players.

[konidias]

Originally Posted by Devil

Booo.

The worst thing involved would be typing, talking to other players.

Well... technically I think you could do voice chat or something... but who wants to hear a bunch of nerds whining about being peekayed or scammed? (or who wants to be the nerd whining about it to others)

[Devil]

I see your point.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Tyhm

Then you have the toaster frontend say "Lever=S, go!", and you have a handy on-the-go mining interface. :-P

PKing machine ]:

[Infernix]

Damn crono don't get yourself owned now cause your gaming history isnt as tight as others.

[smirt362]

Originally Posted by Devil

Booo.

The worst thing involved would be typing, talking to other players.

You could have a small keyboard at the bottom that you tap to type out stuff with.

[Demisis_P2P]

Originally Posted by smirt362

You could have a small keyboard at the bottom that you tap to type out stuff with.

[Devil]

I just still don't see it becoming big. I could be wrong though.

Would it be expensive to port over?

[Tyhm]

The expense would primarily be distribution: Getting a label with the influence to put it on the shelves of Gamestop to sell it. Sadly, they rarely want to risk taking a percentage of the sales from all I've seen.

[smirt362]

Originally Posted by Tyhm

The expense would primarily be distribution: Getting a label with the influence to put it on the shelves of Gamestop to sell it. Sadly, they rarely want to risk taking a percentage of the sales from all I've seen.

Gamestop doesn't make any money from selling new games, they make all of their money from selling used games.

[Tyhm]

Irrelevant: Gamestop nonetheless doesn't sell every New game that's made for every system ever, they only carry what they think they'll sell. Which means what their distributor convinces them will sell. Which means Graal would need a good distributor.
I don't know any. Shelf-Self-Publishing died out in the 80s when Expert Software drove it into the ground with their crap masquerading as products in the bargain bin.

[Devil]

Look it's not going to happen, so don't waste your energy typing posts.

It's hard enough around here to get something finished on time, or within 2-3 years of when they said it will be done. Let's concentrate on fixing THIS game before screwing around with anything else.

[MegaMasterX90875]

Originally Posted by Stefan

Next month we will work on porting v4 to mobile phone and PSP. The screen of the PSP is quite big, and with wireless LAN the internet connection speed should be quite high. You also have memory cards for saving files like heads, bodies etc.
The only problem might be typing chat text. You can connect some USB keyboard though, or you can buy a special small PSP keyboard, will be released in October I think, manufacturer Logic 3.

Stefan strikes again!

[kia345]

I might have to invest in a PSP now

[Tyhm]

So I just have to wait for october of 2006....

This is why I don't do press releases anymore. -_-