People actually like the classic tile sets. Alot of players dont want a new tile set they want the one they have. Look at the top two servers. Which tile set do they use? It is a nice tile set regardless of how much its used. If its made nicely then it doesnt matter. If the current tile set was so bad and shouldnt be used because it would make people not want to play. UN would not be averaging a 100+ people at peak times nor would classic be avering about the same at peak times. The servers with new tile sets how many players do they average? Era comes close but its player base is dropping slowly and its only averaging about 70 players at peak times that I've seen. So your logic of the classic tile set being crap and should not be allowed is greatly flawed as in this is graal these are graal servers that is the graal tile set. People like the graal look and feel. Not every one wants a server with everything brand new and non-graal.

have you ever took the time to actually hunt around in this community for excellent graphic artists? If you did or are, you're wasting your time because if there are any, they are taken.

For the terrain maps, Stefan and Unixmad want thing to be different. For the most part I believe it is so that 2k2 has its presence among high quality playerworlds using terrain as well. Heck, they paid someone to do thier graphics so why should they freely allow others to use them on other playerworlds?

Its very hard to find anyone with talent enough to go beyond the typical playerworld standards in not just graphics. Yes, its a plus if they do, but you shouldn't expect every single new PW to contain different graphics all the time albiet it may discourage those who do not put enough time and effort into making a half-way decent PW :p It is still possible to have a high quality playerworld that is rather small. Actually, its probably much easier to do that than to spend tons of time on an huge map because at some point you're just going to say to hell with it and skip doing a good job on the rest of the levels just to be done with it.

As true as that may be, most people will be turned off by the default stuff if they have never seen or heard of Graal before. I don't see anything absolutely wrong with using default so long as its done well, but that's like asking for the clouds to rain money ;)

To me, a playerworld is a product and I'm going to do my best within the abilities I am capable of to reach a level of excellence that I think will draw in customers. I want to make my product stand out from the rest. I want to give consumers a reason to "buy" my product over a generic brand. If all I do is make my product look and feel like the rest sitting on the shelf, what makes you think the average consumer is going to choose what I offer over something else that is similar? I'm pretty sure this is the same idea that Konidias is following to a degree. My focus is to bring in players that have never heard about Graal or the fence sitters that are curious but are not willing to take a risk in fear that it may not work out. Obviously, I won't please everyone but that's life.

Dont worry Genesis, youve already got 3 tilesets you dont use.

what are u mad cuz u can't make 1?

Okay do you see the "Originality" category I placed? This means that if people use nothing but the same stuff, then they would get points counted against them. You should not make a chart of how many points are taken away for each unoriginal feature on the playerworld. It is up to the reviewer to make that decision. Let's say a playerworld uses all the default systems and tileset, but has super original things on the server. They should be penalized and not pass because they used the old tileset?

You have no idea what pathgen is do you? It's not limited to what comes with the level editor. Players can modify the pathgen or make their own from scratch, that can make super detailed paths. I don't see how there is any difference in effort except you waste way more time laying the path tile by tile. Your opinion on straight paths being "retarded and unoriginal" is just that, an opinion. That doesn't mean people don't think straight paths are fine. You're penalizing playerworlds based on your opinion that straight paths are retarded? Hello?

Why can't you just admit that your ideas are completely ridiculous? Can you not get it through your thick skull that pw reviewers aren't going to pass these "2x2 level worlds" that you speak of? Lay off the crack pipe and open your bloodshot eyes, so you can see that playerworld reviewers are not blind and retarded, they know what is good and what isn't.

You know, getting angry and pissed off at something like this, usually means that you know you're wrong, but you're just too proud and hotheaded to admit it, so you flip out and yell at me to try and justify yourself.

So basically what you're saying, is that in order for a playerworld to even be considered acceptable, it needs an entirely new tileset, character design, inventory, battle system, status system, and 100 employees from Squaresoft working 24 hours a day on it? I want to raise the bar as well, but you're setting too many specifics. If the pw reviewers raise the bar on what they think is acceptable, then no bad playerworlds will be put online.

yes Genesis, im [sarcasm]very[/sarcasm] mad because I cannot make a tileset.. I suppose my lack of GFX landed me Graphics Administration on Era? (For the *****s (aka. Genesis) .. Im talking about GFX Admin)

if 4 points fail a playerworld, theres more probelsm than just that

im NOT saying they need to have all that to pass
but if you want a PERFECT score yuo need all of it.

If you get a perfect score.. then your special.

There's no such thing as a perfect score. If all you need is the stuff that you mentioned, the playerworld wouldn't be perfect, it would just be meeting the requirements.

RATING SYSTEM:

Gameplay: Is it fun? Will it continue to be fun for a long time?
Total: 100 points

Grand Total: 100 points




OBVIOUSLY there are extra parts. If the scripting is bad then it will most likely not be fun and it will fail. If it is okay but inefficient/full of security flaws then send them away until they fix it. Same for other things like stolen graphics. Segmenting the reviewing method just leads to unbalanced reviews. There's no need to overcomplicate this.

AND TREVOR: My scripting style is the best IN THE WORLD.

Agreed. An overall grade of how valuable the server might be to Graal would allow more freedom to the PW makers (i.e. removing all incentives to create needless storylines where they really do not fit) and make the job of the PWA folks easier.


Also agreed on scripting syle. :)

Yes I agree with you on that. I'm just saying if the levels are done proffessionally then it shouldnt matter wether its the old tile set or not. It should be based on skills of the levels not on if its a new tile set or old tile set. You can have old tile set and very nice levls and you can have the old tile set and still have crap levels. :) Ruling one out just because its the default is just pure stupidity. Allowing both offers something to both sides. People who like the old tile set. People who want new tile sets. It doesnt hurt anything if they want the old tile set. If people dont play because they're using it then it will be taken down. Nothing to be lost only gained. :)

What if the tileset looks really leet so all levels look skilled? O_o

yes i know
levels can look amazing with old tileset

but we have TOO many servers that look EXACTLY the same.
its a big turn off for new players I know that because my friends wont play it:

#1 theres no storyline, or plot
#2 everything looks repetative
#3 players are out of control

Okay. We've all reached this same conclusion. What are you going to do about it? Sitting there and arguing with us does no good, we knew long ago what the problems were and we're actually doing something about it! Can you believe it!? You are complaining about these things yet I see you taking no action to solve them. Just because you may already have a PW up doesn't mean you can't change it or that you should be excused from appended rules and policies governing playerworlds. Especially these silly new restrictions you are suggesting. If that is what you think a PW needs in order to be "good" then why don't you take the time to do that for your own PW, hmm?

Because it would include harsh labour involving mouse movement and typing? :p

<blatantly_uneducated_opinion>
Playablilty is everything.

New graphics help so the new world doesn't remind you of all the horribly boring places you've wasted time on in other playerworlds. Graphics are a good hook to get curiousity up, and give a feel of professionalism. Good graphics inspire hope in new arrivals that the rest of the world may have the same attention to detail. But, it's still mostly marketing - the proof is in *if* the rest was done professionally too.

As for a 'score', I think it should always be 'pass', 'fix this' or 'fail'.

The 'score' will end up being it's overall survival and popularity a year later.

</blatantly_uneducated_opinion>

I think I know what he meant..

SOmething about GFX sort of hooking players towards servers.. o.O

Graphics are only good for 2 things

Getting players to get on initially, and secondly just give eye candy the real hook is the scripting and fun factor from the idea.. so really it just boils down to the idea.. is the idea a good one or a bad one and thats where it is. That is my opinion.

*wants dancing carrots back*

I miss teh carr0ts :(

HOW COULD YOU YOSHI!?
I thin its time you resign from the Spelling Police!

Just stick with the current one but add "Extra Points" or something.
This is pretty much for anything that the reviewer thinks stands out as being really good. Were not talking above average, were talking great.

There's a problem though. We are reviewing these offline, and they have to work offline. We don't know how well they will work online until it IS online.

you could get a leet scripter to because the PWSA (Playerworld Script Admin) and they could look over playerworlds scripts o.O

If they are to be reviewed, they must work offline.

k o.O
Wasnt Era mostly scripted offline? o.o I dont remember hearing they converted to NPC Server..

wait didnt they get up through stefan? o.o"

They did.

Well i think the reviews should be alot longer, Angel did a 4 page one in HTML, she should have let some of that into her review.

I think what you need to do as well as reviewing it, is tell us stats such as:

Quests: X
Outside Lvls: X

Also on the review maybe something like this, where you pick 4-5 examples and you break it down them summarise it.

EXAMPLE NPCS

NPC One - Hat System
Well guys this is great, not only have they not used ANY of the original hat images, they have made a new viewing method which works very well and gives even more excitment to collecting hats with their new features.

NPC Two - Train
Okay like alot of PWs online they have the usual stuff which seems to be on every PW :(. But one thing almost all don't have is a working train, from what I can see this looks bug free and wont lag the players at all, nice one.

NPC Three - Farming Job
This is also great, they have made a job where you don't need key bashing, is fun, and gives you a worth while pay. I won't spoil it, wait until its online ;)

NPC Four - GUI
Not so good here im affraid, the GUI didn't work and so it spoilt it as I couldn't see what weapon I had selected nor could I see my stats which are vital to be visable. I hope you can get this fixed before you open and maybe something to switch back to normal graal GUI.

NPCs Overall
Well as you can see from them four the quality of scripting is high, although I don't quite know what happened with the GUI, as its not as complicated as a train, anyroad, good good guys, I hope to see alot of nice script updated to your PW.

Score: 8.5/10



--See that ^ !? Not only has it given us a more detailed break down, the reviews are longer, as after all some can make it for 2 years with hundreds of levels,scripts,gfx and manhours put into the project and only get about 600-800words said about it.

Also by explaning it more, it will give us a more detailed look at what the PW may be like. And this way we can be more excited for the NPCs/Levels that got a high score.

Also the players would have to stop asking about the review for about a week so the PWA can do a nice long review.

I like :megaeek:

Just an Idea, Just an Idea!
Well as you can see that would increase the length of the review by up to 200/300% atleast.

But then it would take the reviewers more time o.O

Time is money! And if your wasting money well the your just sick!

Thats the problem, everyone expects a review in Hours. Yes it can be done, but offical reviews of things like films take ages, they may look over it for along time. I think they should be given atleast a week to review it, if they want a week. It would be alot better.

I dont want it to take 3 weeks for my PW to be entirely reviewed :(

I agree that there should be some stats included for the number of npc's, completed levels, and quests.

Hmm.. yea.. I suppose NPC Count is important

I hope you guys like to read because if I ever post a review on a PW, it will be long and detailed. Some people complain my posts are too long and a review will look like a textbook with a commentary at the end with my opinion overall.

Haha...the outline for a review of the average PW would be -

-Levels: - 4
You must be kidding. Please, make a new tileset because this is horrid (especially for Era x_x).

-NPCs: - 1
Is this a joke? Go find a good script and fix this. Now.

-Story: - 2
.....................................(the silence should explain).

-Creativy: - 1
Gahahahaha

Total - 8
Complete Failure. Please, shoot yourself now.

*whistles* Doubt a single PW would get past me, as there is not a single PW which I have seen as great. The standards are so low, bad PWs rate like 40...Most should get at MOST 10...for the benefit of all of graal, a PW needs to come out with professional attributes, with quality and fullness. *cough*

Anywho. Some PWs don't count, such as the classics and the GO ran ones.

In your opinion the best player world that would get the highest rating from you is?

I would also be like Moongod, I feel the reviews are too under-rated and short. And okay not 3 weeks. But you should have to wait a week atleast. Things take TIME and to get your self the best review you need to allow the PWA to have time and not bother people 24/7 of AIM asking how the review is.