Patrolling Santa

[shrimps]

Using alchemy on items, actually gives lower value then what ever you alched. At least in my experience it has.

[Ziro_of_the_Turks]

Originally Posted by shrimps

Using alchemy on items, actually gives lower value then what ever you alched. At least in my experience it has.

I was referring to the past when it was possible to make millions of plats in minutes. This was probably 2004'ish. Not sure if it was exactly that year.
I actually had made a million plat in my high point. That was hard enough for me because I had crappy equipment.

I'm sure the RoW-wearers with leet gear would have easily made more.

[Draenin]

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

Wrong. It wouldn't be a bigger mistake. Maybe a mistake just as well. But definitely not bigger.
But if everyone has the same "advantage"... guess what? It's not an advantage anymore. Eventually everyone learns it and it becomes part of the game.

You're trying to justify the abuse of bugs, and it's hilarious.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

To be more clear, here's what's pissed me off in the past:
Years ago, alchemy equipment was done through the "random alchemy" process. I wasn't much into the game, so I still don't know how it was done. But apparently this was available for anyone to do. These items were constantly being made, and thus weren't too expensive (and would continue to drop in price).

Alchemy wasn't 'random' in the past. It's just that there weren't recipes, and almost all of it was guess-work. I hung out with Nayoko and Athealis lot back when I was in Samurai a long time ago, and they figured out how to do all the most important recipes before everyone else. Back then Mith and PMoP were high-end equipment, and people actually forked out a lot of money for them. It was mainly because only a few knew how to do alchemy without slagging.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

Then one day Stefan made it so you could no longer make these items.
Once that happened, if you had these kind of items, it was wise to just hold on to them and watch the prices sky-rocket.
It took years before they fixed this problem. TBH, I'm still not sure it was fixed. Aren't there some elite items that still exist from those days? Making them very expensive...
Either way, it was very annoying during the years that this was a problem.

There are very few items which still linger around as a result of the old alchemy system. One would be a version of Large Morningstar of Carman, which has magic +110 on it, and there are other things like non-dex Full Helmets of Might, Old Mith, Old PMoP, etc. What happened was the statistics for each of these items were altered when the new system came about, and the old items couldn't be made anymore. These items, of course, were not deleted off of accounts, so there's still a few floating around these days. Some are rare, (like Old FHoM) but most of them are not better than what we have today, statistically.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

The other option would be to remove all the items. But this would just be lazy and piss everyone off.

Yup, pretty much. Plus, trying to remove all of them from the server would be like going on a witch hunt through every player's account in search of them.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

What pissed me off in the more recent past is how many seemed to have reached unattainable levels (especially in physique) through the level-bug. Apparently these levels couldn't be realistically reached via the monsters existing in the game because after a while, the monsters give crap EXP. So it would take forever to get to those levels. The solution, I think, would be to make stronger monsters.

I was the one to bring the wisdom de-leveling bug to Stefan's attention. But I find it funny that this glitch irritated you when you said earlier that bugs should be exploited and accepted as 'just part of the game.' Seems contradictory.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

Or you could always penalize those for abusing such a bug.

But no one did. Thanks, Bjorn. Thanks, Sam.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

But it's hard to say what's bug abuse, and what's just an unknown feature.

No it's not. It's obvious when players have discovered loopholes in the system just by looking at what they're doing. Every day for months I watched Fr0 take his second account into brutals to power-level. Then once everyone started to catch on to what he was doing, they quickly followed suit to try and exploit the same bug. It was at that point I logged onto RC and told Stefan about it. Stefan fixed it, but Bjorn altogether refused to penalize Fr0 for it, even though I insisted on it. So for the longest time, Fr0 was perched at the very top of the high score list in multiple areas until he quit and was surpassed by others.

[BigBear3]

Originally Posted by FenixTheBanished

thats because Tig never really stated his existence on a large scale and never announced it on here, and also didnt say what the drops were like bjorn did last year. Not to mention, not that the drops arent good, but theyre easily 1/20th of the value that happened last year. Like 3 Darkflames, 2 Inferno Daggers, 2 Inferno Swords, 1 Sorc Hammer 1 Might 1 Agi, like 14 fids 28 ids, etc. So its not like there are a ton of things and the small "prizes" this year arent anywhere equal in value to the the year before, so once the good items (that are very limited in amount) are gone, theres no point.

Buzz Killington. Always.

[Ziro_of_the_Turks]

Originally Posted by Draenin

You're trying to justify the abuse of bugs, and it's hilarious.

Your inability to comprehend what I'm saying is hilarious.
If a bug is common knowledge, everyone equally benefits.
Unfortunately, the closest you can get to a bug as common knowledge is where "a lot of people" benefit from it. Then it's removed for "balancing issues". But the people retain whatever they gained from it. This where the imbalance actually begins.
Why is this so hard for you to understand?

Originally Posted by Draenin

I hung out with Nayoko and Athealis lot back when I was in Samurai a long time ago, and they figured out how to do all the most important recipes before everyone else.

You mean when LoveableNalle (or whatever the hell) was leader of Kurenai Joukai? What I'm talking about was way before then. It has always been commonly referred to as "random alchemy". I remember a friend getting mithril chainmail of berwean for like 50 plat. And diamonds would sell for 10 plat (50 at most, but I doubt it because I wasn't running around with hundreds of plat, which would be easily to acquire from a couple diamonds worth 50). And then suddenly prices skyrocketed on these alchemy items.

Originally Posted by Draenin

Plus, trying to remove all of them from the server would be like going on a witch hunt through every player's account in search of them.

Not really. I don't know how this stuff works, but I know they managed to instantly remove "speed" bonuses on all alchemy items. I don't see why they couldn't at least remove all stats from the items and make them useless, if not have them deleted completely.

Originally Posted by Draenin

But I find it funny that this glitch irritated you when you said earlier that bugs should be exploited and accepted as 'just part of the game.' Seems contradictory.

I didn't say this bug irritated me. I'm saying I'm irritated by the way it was dealt with. I'd be 100% happy if random alchemy was never disabled, if they never made a legit alchemy system, and if the party-bug still existed and became common knowledge. In fact, I probably would have played GK more/longer if all this was so.

I'm not contradicting myself. Now you're just offending me.
I withdraw from the rest of this conversation.
Merry Christmas.
I've just been PK'ed off the forums by stupidity.
Feel free to loot my body.

[Draenin]

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

Your inability to comprehend what I'm saying is hilarious.
If a bug is common knowledge, everyone equally benefits.
Unfortunately, the closest you can get to a bug as common knowledge is where "a lot of people" benefit from it. Then it's removed for "balancing issues". But the people retain whatever they gained from it. This where the imbalance actually begins.
Why is this so hard for you to understand?

It isn't. I even agreed with you that not reprimanding players for their misdeeds fosters imbalance. You had worded it before like the widespread abuse of bugs was a good thing.

OH WAIT...

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

I'd be 100 percent happy if random alchemy was never disabled, if they never made a legit alchemy system, and if the party-bug still existed and became common knowledge.

Originally Posted by Ziro of the Turks

I'm not contradicting myself. Now you're just offending me.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by FenixTheBanished

thats because Tig

Originally Posted by FenixTheBanished

is not

Originally Posted by FenixTheBanished

bjorn

Originally Posted by FenixTheBanished

theyre easily 1/20th of the value that happened last year. Like 3 Darkflames, 2 Inferno Daggers, 2 Inferno Swords, 1 Sorc Hammer 1 Might 1 Agi, like 14 fids 28 ids, etc.

Consider for a moment how damaging that is to the already unbalanced economy.

There is no abstract or noble point here to make you angry. You're angry because, firstly, you did not know and therefor could not milk Santa Clause for all he's worth - spending every second you had available on Graal Kingdoms to increase your odds. And secondly because, despite the time you did spend obsessively stalking Santa, you now feel it was wasted.

Santa may not have been the most amazing or original event... but to reiterate my initial point - We're not Bjorn; We're going to release updates regularly.

[FenixTheBanished]

Stephen, you really arent paying attention to what I am responding to at all, which you clearly need to. I was responding to this:

Originally Posted by Crimson2005

Really? I've never seen him. Last year everyone was following him non-stop. This year there's hardly been talk of him.

In the context of how Bjorn used the drops that santa had in a way to actually market the event, which Tig didn't. So it had nothing to do with:

There is no abstract or noble point here to make you angry. You're angry because, firstly, you did not know and therefor could not milk Santa Clause for all he's worth - spending every second you had available on Graal Kingdoms to increase your odds. And secondly because, despite the time you did spend obsessively stalking Santa, you now feel it was wasted.

Santa may not have been the most amazing or original event... but to reiterate my initial point - We're not Bjorn; We're going to release updates regularly.

You're off on some selfcreated tanget about how you think I had a problem with the originality of the event or the odds of getting things. If you haven't noticed im not very bad off because of some long time friends quitting and giving me items and buying RoWs and such for diamonds from you and leveling my wisdom as a source of income. So really your whole argument about me wanting items really is null and void, because I wasn't even talking about that. The point was to say why Xaphan hadn't heard about it and why, when the items are gone, there is no longer a point in following santa. So please, read the context of the previous posts before you go off and make yourself look... well people will make their own opinions... and say something that is completely off base. And to be honest I had fun killing Nate and Essence while people swarmed Santa, so once again, your argument has no basis and you got us into ANOTHER needless argument over something you didnt take the time to research or know. Because if you did, you'd know last year i didnt get anything good, as with this year. So basically, you're wrong.