You're welcome, Eurocenter

[Fulg0reSama]

Originally Posted by Demisis_P2P

I wish $700 a week was middle class. Cost of living is redic. here compared to how strong our dollar has been for the last few years

No kidding, with insurance as a diabetic, my blood check strips for my meter can cost 100 dollars by themselves and that's for 100 strips.

[DustyPorViva]

Originally Posted by Demisis_P2P

It's not impossible though. Look at the Apple app store and all of the people that made hundreds of thousands of dollars from single purchase apps.

The pay should definitely be a percentage to encourage servers to try and make as much money as possible. And if it's a decent percentage then there isn't any reason why somebody couldn't make a living off running a server across all platforms.

I wish $700 a week was middle class. Cost of living is redic. here compared to how strong our dollar has been for the last few years

Ya, if you make your own app maybe you'll rake in some money... but this is not the same situation.

[SlikRick]

Originally Posted by Demisis_P2P

I guess I'll wait for this to be implemented before I start working on my server then.

If I can earn even just $100 a day from Graal that'll probably be enough to get me to quit my current job and work on a server full time.

You are greatly mistaken if you think they are going to pay you while your server is UC. UC servers do not bring in players to the game and keep them there like the Gold, Classic and Hosted servers. The only revenue they bring in is the money you pay to get Gold Dev time, so you are better off starting on your server now in hopes of getting it completed and up on one of the tabs when/if this ever gets implemented.

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by SlikRick

You are greatly mistaken if you think they are going to pay you while your server is UC. UC servers do not bring in players to the game and keep them there like the Gold, Classic and Hosted servers. The only revenue they bring in is the money you pay to get Gold Dev time, so you are better off starting on your server now in hopes of getting it completed and up on one of the tabs when/if this ever gets implemented.

If his goal behind a server is making money, it doesn't make sense to create the server until you know you can actually make money off it eventually.

It would be like developing an iPhone app in a world where Apple hasn't yet said whether developers will receive a percentage of sales and yet still planning to make money off it. After all, you don't get paid during the development of the app!

[Vinka]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

If his goal behind a server is making money, it doesn't make sense to create the server until you know you can actually make money off it eventually.

It would be like developing an iPhone app in a world where Apple hasn't yet said whether developers will receive a percentage of sales and yet still planning to make money off it. After all, you don't get paid during the development of the app!

Well, that's just a risk you'd have to take.

If you don't enjoy the process of developing it, it would be pretty pointless however.

[SlikRick]

Originally Posted by Vinka

Well, that's just a risk you'd have to take.

If you don't enjoy the process of the developing it, it would be pretty pointless however.

Pretty much. If you don't enjoy what you're doing and are only doing it for money, you are going to end up with half assed content.

[Demisis_P2P]

Originally Posted by SlikRick

Pretty much. If you don't enjoy what you're doing and are only doing it for money, you are going to end up with half assed content.

Graal isn't the only 2D mmo client ever made in the history on the universe. If I had to choose between Graal and another engine with better support and features and the deciding factor is whether I could make money from Graal or not then yeah, I'd pick Graal, but otherwise I wouldn't waste my time.

I've already started making some engine agnostic content (mostly graphics) and they're not half assed, so cheers bro.

[SlikRick]

Originally Posted by Demisis_P2P

Graal isn't the only 2D mmo client ever made in the history on the universe.

OMG no way?

[Galdor]

Imagine a community with competent moderators that has a mind of their own as well beside the rulebook they keep under their pillow every night, but also sane rules that don't just exist to just piss people off, perhaps giving you the ability to criticize without being locked, closed and bananed (not even allowed to talk about that, like wtf not? so ridiculous) but don't get me wrong they do improve (sometimes) like remember when we wasn't even allowed to post youtube links in that popular music thread without asking for permission first... but then again it was moved to the lounge so that doesn't really count

Anyways, and administrators that listen and take part of their small but cuddly cute dying community, the one making all the rules don't post anything himself and have no clue what hes customers want and the other one takes like a half year to get a forum reply from and then only get a message that says "hmm what do you mean?".

A community where the developers are appreciated for making all the content, get good updates like easier and upgraded tools to work with and of course not having to pay to dev (server renting I can understand but developing... seriously?)

And like listen to the awesome ideas that people post, like my 3d terrain idea (yes it is awesome) also has layer tiles, premade scripts and stuff like that baked into it, and is from 2009! and still haven't even got a single care.

[kia345]

yeah but galdor, they're trying to make money, so any of the neglect and short ends of the stick we get are okay!! /blindjustification


I miss indy devs with big hearts, coding from their bed in their NY flat. Slapping shareware.txt files into their game .rars, or asking only that you get them a (root)beer if you ever see them in public as payment for the game.

[Crono]

very romantic kia

[Unkownsoldier]

Originally Posted by Galdor

Imagine a community with competent moderators that has a mind of their own as well beside the rulebook they keep under their pillow every night, but also sane rules that don't just exist to just piss people off, perhaps giving you the ability to criticize without being locked, closed and bananed (not even allowed to talk about that, like wtf not? so ridiculous) but don't get me wrong they do improve (sometimes) like remember when we wasn't even allowed to post youtube links in that popular music thread without asking for permission first... but then again it was moved to the lounge so that doesn't really count

Anyways, and administrators that listen and take part of their small but cuddly cute dying community, the one making all the rules don't post anything himself and have no clue what hes customers want and the other one takes like a half year to get a forum reply from and then only get a message that says "hmm what do you mean?".

A community where the developers are appreciated for making all the content, get good updates like easier and upgraded tools to work with and of course not having to pay to dev (server renting I can understand but developing... seriously?)

And like listen to the awesome ideas that people post, like my 3d terrain idea (yes it is awesome) also has layer tiles, premade scripts and stuff like that baked into it, and is from 2009! and still haven't even got a single care.

I understand that you would like to develop for "free" because it would help the game, draw new/old players in, and better your own skills which we assume Admins want.

Yet, truth be told being able to develop is a service they provide us. In return we must pay for this service, like most other companies require. For us to benefit off of their programs for free, would no longer make them a profitable company, but a charity. Take a look at it from this perspective, you want to learn self defense, so you take up a local martial arts class (costing you money.) It would be nice for them to teach you for free, because it would help protect you and others, which is a good thing. Yet, they like EuroCenter, is a business and they need profits for what they provide. What they provide benefits us, and they are kind enough to give us development tools (which a lot of games don't normally provide).

I know they have progressed from updating the computer client version and have moved on to mobile devices/facebook, so in all likeliness the new development tool updates they promised(?) would probably be the final developmental update for the game (other than scripting variables etc.) So it is just time for us players to accept that they aren't our friend, we are the customer they are the provider.

[Galdor]

Originally Posted by Unkownsoldier

Yet, truth be told being able to develop is a service they provide us. In return we must pay for this service, like most other companies require. For us to benefit off of their programs for free, would no longer make them a profitable company, but a charity. Take a look at it from this perspective, you want to learn self defense, so you take up a local martial arts class (costing you money.) It would be nice for them to teach you for free, because it would help protect you and others, which is a good thing. Yet, they like EuroCenter, is a business and they need profits for what they provide. What they provide benefits us, and they are kind enough to give us development tools (which a lot of games don't normally provide).

How is making content for them and at the same time paying money for that the same as paying for martial arts classes?

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Galdor

How is making content for them and at the same time paying money for that the same as paying for martial arts classes?

What? You've never taken a martial arts class that you've had to pay for and teach yourself?

[WhiteDragon]

Originally Posted by Unkownsoldier

I understand that you would like to develop for "free" because it would help the game, draw new/old players in, and better your own skills which we assume Admins want.

Yet, truth be told being able to develop is a service they provide us. In return we must pay for this service, like most other companies require. For us to benefit off of their programs for free, would no longer make them a profitable company, but a charity. Take a look at it from this perspective, you want to learn self defense, so you take up a local martial arts class (costing you money.) It would be nice for them to teach you for free, because it would help protect you and others, which is a good thing. Yet, they like EuroCenter, is a business and they need profits for what they provide. What they provide benefits us, and they are kind enough to give us development tools (which a lot of games don't normally provide).

I know they have progressed from updating the computer client version and have moved on to mobile devices/facebook, so in all likeliness the new development tool updates they promised(?) would probably be the final developmental update for the game (other than scripting variables etc.) So it is just time for us players to accept that they aren't our friend, we are the customer they are the provider.

Yes, they are the provider and we are the customers. However, what we are discussing is if they are a good provider.


Also, there is no need for an analogy. The situation is as simple as this:

We are paying to develop content for Graal. We get no money from the content we make.


Sure it's legal for them to do this, but it's hardly a good model. It means that all the skilled developers will leave because they aren't getting anything out of this deal. It also just generally annoys everyone because it smells like a scam. This isn't theoretical, it's really what happens (proof: look at the this thread and the dozens like it before, and then look at how fast staff disappear from servers after only short stays).