Global Development Team?

[Scary_Sock]

So when will hirings be held?

[Clockwork]

lol...

I'll stick to my #gdeveloper tag which means more or less the same thing.

[Gambet]

I'm not a fan of developers being even considered that have not shown active participation amongst the community throughout the years. Of the scripters you mentioned the only person that actively helps both on and off the forums with scripting questions is Jerret (fowlplay4), and although I've never personally seen Inverness while on client, he does help out on the forums every now and then.

You have still failed to convince me that this team is going to be worth it in the end, because if it takes a position in the GDT for people to decide that they actually give a crap about making the game better then you should really reevaluate the value of such a team.

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Gambet

You have still failed to convince me that this team is going to be worth it in the end, because if it takes a position in the GDT for people to decide that they actually give a crap about making the game better then you should really reevaluate the value of such a team.

This is another reason why Stefan's cooperation is important for the GDT. There are quite a few who are discouraged by a lack of attention to Graal and feel that it is just going downhill with no bottom in sight. This makes it more difficult for people to want to put effort into making the game better.

I know I might seem repetitive, but this is something I feel strongly about.

Originally Posted by Bell

lol, first showing of the male ego here.

There's more where that came from. But I will restrain myself if necessary. Though I hope you're not offended if I flex my ego in jest (all the damn time).

[pooper200000]

The best option is to forum PM Bell, Tig, TSA, and Xor. I'm sure if you wanted, you could send a message to just Bell and that would suffice. I'm not sure which members you are referring to, but if you want to elaborate on what you think you would post you can tell me in a forum PM if you want to know if it is appropriate for the forums. The best option is to forum PM Bell and the other PWA though. Usually we don't like to have big complaints posted about staff on a server, or globally because the forums are for discussing ideas and stuff, not for complaining about the staff. I don't think this is really the topic of the discussion though.

Congratulations to those who made the team, and I wish you the best of luck!

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by pooper200000

The best option is to forum PM Bell, Tig, TSA, and Xor. I'm sure if you wanted, you could send a message to just Bell and that would suffice. I'm not sure which members you are referring to, but if you want to elaborate on what you think you would post you can tell me in a forum PM if you want to know if it is appropriate for the forums. The best option is to forum PM Bell and the other PWA though. Usually we don't like to have big complaints posted about staff on a server, or globally because the forums are for discussing ideas and stuff, not for complaining about the staff. I don't think this is really the topic of the discussion though.

Congratulations to those who made the team, and I wish you the best of luck!

I think Cyan said this in a much easier way in the post before you.

Either way

1 Tigairius Graal Admin :As if he's not busy enough already, and whats with the title?
2 Xor Xor Playerworld Administration :uh...has he done anything except continue to work with zodiac?
3 Bell Bell Playerworld Administration :yay....owait you dunt develop.
4 TSAdmin TSAdmin Playerworld Administration oes he still play graal? Havent seen him in ever.
5 Vulcan Vulcan Advanced Development :doesnt really touch graal...really shady...
6 fowlplay4 fowlplay4 Scripting :very busy with zodiac, willing to bet he'll answer questions rather than dev.
7 Elk Elk Graphics :I'm 99.9% sure elk will make no contribution at all to anything unless paid.

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Clockwork

A whole guild for pooper to kiss ass to.


I think Cyan said this in a much easier way in the post before you.

Either way

1 Tigairius Graal Admin :As if he's not busy enough already, and whats with the title?
2 Xor Xor Playerworld Administration :uh...has he done anything except continue to work with zodiac?
3 Bell Bell Playerworld Administration :yay....owait you dunt develop.
4 TSAdmin TSAdmin Playerworld Administration oes he still play graal? Havent seen him in ever.
5 Vulcan Vulcan Advanced Development :doesnt really touch graal...really shady...
6 fowlplay4 fowlplay4 Scripting :very busy with zodiac, willing to bet he'll answer questions rather than dev.
7 Elk Elk Graphics :I'm 99.9 percent sure elk will make no contribution at all to anything unless paid.

I don't know about Vulcan, but Bell said the PWA were added by default because they are administrating the team.

[Scary_Sock]

Originally Posted by Inverness

I don't know about Vulcan, but Bell said the PWA were added by default because they are administrating the team.

I also have to disagree when Clockwork says Elk won't do work. If Elk charges, then I am pretty sure Elk would not be a good addition to the team. Elk does some good GFX though.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Clockwork

5 Vulcan Vulcan Advanced Development :doesnt really touch graal...really shady...

I tend to stick to my dev server.

Originally Posted by Inverness

I don't know about Vulcan, but Bell said the PWA were added by default because they are administrating the team.

I'm not a member of the PWA, but I have been actively participating in the planning of the team for a few weeks now.

[Clockwork]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

I'm not a member of the PWA, but I have been actively participating in the planning of the team for a few weeks now.

That sounds like strenuous work! ;p I know that sounds mean, but does that really deserve a special title, for planning, while the people who actually do what this guild is for probably just get a thank you?

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by Clockwork

I think Cyan said this in a much easier way in the post before you.

Either way

1 Tigairius Graal Admin :As if he's not busy enough already, and whats with the title?
2 Xor Xor Playerworld Administration :uh...has he done anything except continue to work with zodiac?
3 Bell Bell Playerworld Administration :yay....owait you dunt develop.
4 TSAdmin TSAdmin Playerworld Administration oes he still play graal? Havent seen him in ever.

Well, as far as the "Graal Admin" rank goes, if you notice all other global teams there is a "Graal Admin" rank, which is the default leader rank. That is just there for the sake of consistency and should be taken loosely and not so literally. The global staff team is not a group of people battling to be a higher rank, technically we are all "Graal Admins," it doesn't really matter.

Xor has been doing extensive work as a PWA, including handling tickets for Zodiac, but resigned his position on Zodiac so he can focus more on PWA-related duties. How he spends his time on Graal not answering tickets is his decision and shouldn't be held against him.

Bell doesn't need to develop to manage the team because she is helping to manage the team. You don't need development skills to recognize skill and talent and that is something that she is definitely able to do in her several years of service and experience on Graal.

TSAdmin still reads tickets and responds as much as he can and works hard to help support the PWA team and the represent the rest of the players.


---- In response to expressed concerns about some members of the team: it is as simple as this-- if you are useless then you will be removed. If you expect servers to pay you for your work, and you do not go through us (the PWA), you will be removed. And most importantly, if you abuse your tag in order to gain access to things to which you do not need, then you will also be warned/removed from the team. Abuse won't be tolerated, and if you are using your tag to threaten people into doing things, or using it to scam in any way, you will be removed without reservation and possibly globally banned for the behavior.
If you get banned while being a member of the team then a review over your behavior and work habits will be done and depending on the situation you will not be in the team very long.

All this aside, it should be a fairly relaxed atmosphere, and you should try to enjoy the position more than anything, just don't abuse the responsibility and don't ignore it.

[LoneAngelIbesu]

/me is waiting for these application forms.

[WhiteDragon]

Just wondering, is Skyld really not going to be involved in this?

[Gambet]

Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Just wondering, is Skyld really not going to be involved in this?

Not many top-tier developers are active anymore. Tig starts college this semester so I would expect his priorities to be elsewhere, and Skyld hasn't been very active since rejoining the global team. I understand their situatons so I'm not going to complain about it, they have their own lives to worry about.

[salesman]

Am I the only one who doesn't like that it's left to unpaid volunteers to do the work that should have already been done by Graal Online? I know we now consider Graal a development platform, but that doesn't mean paying developers should need to write their own documentation and tutorials -- that's the kind of stuff our money should be going toward.

I like what you guys are doing, and I'm definitely not trying to stop you...I think it's really nice that someone is finally taking the initiative to get these things done, but in my honest opinion, this team is the kind of thing that needed to be done for us, not by us.

I felt compelled to say something after reading 13 pages of nobody acknowledging that it's disappointing that Graal's customers are left to do this for themselves.

I really hope that this team gets some support from Stefan or Skyld. Good luck to you.

[SwimChao]

Originally Posted by salesman

Am I the only one who doesn't like that it's left to unpaid volunteers to do the work that should have already been done by Graal Online? I know we now consider Graal a development platform, but that doesn't mean paying developers should need to write their own documentation and tutorials -- that's the kind of stuff our money should be going toward.

I like what you guys are doing, and I'm definitely not trying to stop you...I think it's really nice that someone is finally taking the initiative to get these things done, but in my honest opinion, this team is the kind of thing that needed to be done for us, not by us.

I felt compelled to say something after reading 13 pages of nobody acknowledging that it's disappointing that Graal's customers are left to do this for themselves.

I really hope that this team gets some support from Stefan or Skyld. Good luck to you.

I agree with this. There are some members of the community willing to do these sorts of things for no cost, because they enjoy them. It's either that, or they enjoy beneficial things being done for the game.

I think that money should have been put out to get this sort of stuff professionally done, but I don't see it happening.

Edit to avoid 2x posting: I also applied to join. It'd be an exciting change to be able to make some (hopefully) positive impact for the dev. aspect of the game.

[Hiro]

Originally Posted by salesman

Am I the only one who doesn't like that it's left to unpaid volunteers to do the work that should have already been done by Graal Online? I know we now consider Graal a development platform, but that doesn't mean paying developers should need to write their own documentation and tutorials -- that's the kind of stuff our money should be going toward.

I like what you guys are doing, and I'm definitely not trying to stop you...I think it's really nice that someone is finally taking the initiative to get these things done, but in my honest opinion, this team is the kind of thing that needed to be done for us, not by us.

I felt compelled to say something after reading 13 pages of nobody acknowledging that it's disappointing that Graal's customers are left to do this for themselves.

I really hope that this team gets some support from Stefan or Skyld. Good luck to you.

because we already had many threads about it, and still have some threads with that topic being at the core

it's one of those topics we can't actually discuss but we kind of fill it in here and there when it can be relevant

[Crono]

Originally Posted by salesman

I know we now consider Graal a development platform

No we don't. Also, some people are saying stuff like "IM GLAD 2 BE HELPING GRAAL OUT" when they could be equally helping out doing whatever dev work they were doing before. I think the biggest "problem" with the GDT is that it doesn't work like the old global development (GST, GGT) positions worked. Oh, and I disagree with some of the GDT member's ranks.

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Crono

I think the biggest "problem" with the GDT is that it doesn't work like the old global development (GST, GGT) positions worked.

Care to elaborate on that?

[Crono]

Originally Posted by Inverness

Care to elaborate on that?

Weren't ran by the PWA, were more free, and had more access.

[WhiteDragon]

Originally Posted by Crono

No we don't.

I believe Stefan considers it a Development Platform.

[Crono]

Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

I believe Stefan considers it a Development Platform.

I don't care, Graal is a game and has taken a fall ever since CJ began thinking it's a development platform when it's not. The sooner you people understand this the sooner we can improve our game, or just let it rot, your choice.

[Ronnie]

I'm willing to help,
Scripting
Gani
Gfx(A bit)
Leveling
SFX
And classic subscription.

[Seich]

I am glad I will be able to do my part to help graal. I already applied.

btw, My fields of choice would probably be GANIing and Scripting :] although I do perform other fields these are the ones I am more confident in or I enjoy the most.

[Deas_Voice]

i got gold and classic.

and i do scripting (among other things).

[Draenin]

I would be interested in hiring and project coordination, if the aim here is to work on community-benefit projects. Lately my interest has been on tools like in-client editors and such, which could definitely be worked into future RC client updates.

[Soala]

Just applied and got accepted
Cmon guys it's quite a nice way to improve graal.

[Chompy]

I've applied as well (:

[Bell]

Once again I will try to answer all your questions/concerns.

Originally Posted by Deophite18

I would elaborate but I don't think the mods would approve of it being discussed here. Although I am sure Bell, Tig, & TSA all know what I am referring to.

This thread is not being heavily moderated. Valid points are being permitted since we are discussing forming a global team. Or, as Cyan said, you could send me a forum pm. I'd prefer not to assume whom all you're referring to since there are several people with questionable pasts in the list. By the way, I thought you were quitting for a year or so?

Originally Posted by Clockwork

1 Tigairius Graal Admin :As if he's not busy enough already, and whats with the title?
2 Xor Xor Playerworld Administration :uh...has he done anything except continue to work with zodiac?
3 Bell Bell Playerworld Administration :yay....owait you dunt develop.
4 TSAdmin TSAdmin Playerworld Administration oes he still play graal? Havent seen him in ever.
5 Vulcan Vulcan Advanced Development :doesnt really touch graal...really shady...
6 fowlplay4 fowlplay4 Scripting :very busy with zodiac, willing to bet he'll answer questions rather than dev.
7 Elk Elk Graphics :I'm 99.9% sure elk will make no contribution at all to anything unless paid.

Tig is the guilds admin and had to be the one to set it up in the first place. He answered your question on the title.

Xor is still helping with the transition of his replacement there. This has not interfered with his duties as a PWA and doesn't hurt the Playerworld by removing a high staff of theirs and leaving them high and dry.

Bell: You're right, I don't develop although I DID develop so I'm not entirely clueless to the process. My role here is purely to get it set up and rolling. After that I will back off and let the team run themselves.

TSA: He's Australian, chances are he's asleep when you're awake.

fowlplay4: Time will tell but there will be those that are willing to develop but abhor answering questions so regardless of his involvement it will still benefit Graal.

Vulcan: Advanced development will be the ranking (for lack of a better word) used for members that can add new members to the team and General development will be used for members that have multiple skills. These could actually be changed as we found to be necessary but the original setup was to help determine who did what so we could try to fill in the gaps on missing skills.

Originally Posted by LoneAngelIbesu

/me is waiting for these application forms.

Working on it. Just spending a lot of time trying to also respond to everyones concerns.

Originally Posted by Inverness

I don't know about Vulcan, but Bell said the PWA were added by default because they are administrating the team.

Thats correct. Since they will be a subdivision of the PWA it just made sense to have them included for the sake of continuity.

Originally Posted by Clockwork

That sounds like strenuous work! ;p I know that sounds mean, but does that really deserve a special title, for planning, while the people who actually do what this guild is for probably just get a thank you?

He's just the only one in that ranking right now. I think you're considering this as a rank like in a normal guild but the ranks themselves are just being converted into departments based on skills. All are of equal rank and rights with the exception of Advanced which can add members.

Originally Posted by WhiteDragon

Just wondering, is Skyld really not going to be involved in this?

He better be or I'll hunt him down and kill him. He got me into this in the first place.

Originally Posted by Crono

I think the biggest "problem" with the GDT is that it doesn't work like the old global development (GST, GGT) positions worked. Oh, and I disagree with some of the GDT member's ranks.

Why do you think I brought this to the forums in the first place for advice. I wasn't involved in any of the old teams so really have no idea how they worked. My intent although everyone has failed to remember was to ask for advice on setup and implementation of it.

Ranks can be changed, this was set up for organizational purposes. What do you feel isn't appropriate on them?

Originally Posted by Crono

Weren't ran by the PWA, were more free, and had more access.

When they can run themselves the PWA won't be running it. We will be a team cooperating with each other for the betterment of Graal. Past members of the former global teams are responsible for the rights reduction. Those rights will have to be earned back by the new team. It didn't hit just the GDT, it hit the PWA as well. In a former life I would of had a level 4 rc and lifetime everything, while I currently have a level 2 globally and get a year of gold at a time while I am still working. I live with it and do what I can with what I have and don't bother worrying about what was the past.

Originally Posted by Gothika

Because from what I know of him, his attitude is bad.

Duly noted, one thing this team will have to remember is to keep their ego's in check and their anger management issues outside of Graal. If they don't always get their way they are free to find a place to develop outside the global team.

Originally Posted by Draenin

I would be interested in hiring and project coordination, if the aim here is to work on community-benefit projects. Lately my interest has been on tools like in-client editors and such, which could definitely be worked into future RC client updates.

Project coordination would be especially helpful. I know there are a flood of ideas out there that would need someone to get all the right people together to get them moving and keep them moving.

[Deophite18]

Originally Posted by Bell

This thread is not being heavily moderated. Valid points are being permitted since we are discussing forming a global team. Or, as Cyan said, you could send me a forum pm. I'd prefer not to assume whom all you're referring to since there are several people with questionable pasts in the list.

Oh alright. Well even so, I really don't think there is anything I could tell you that your not already aware of. I can just simply remind you of it. I think Vulcan is a poor choice. Even if he has Dev skills that shouldn't outweigh his behavior and what he has done in the past.

I don't think he should have anymore chances really. He is a vindictive person and has a huge temper. On one hand you could say the same about Tig's past but he is a calm person who isn't controlled by their emotions, and the chances of him relapsing into his old ways are unlikely. Vulcan is the opposite and the chances of him causing problems on the team is an eventuality.

Originally Posted by Bell

By the way, I thought you were quitting for a year or so?

Yep, end of summer.

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Deophite18

Even if he has Dev skills that shouldn't outweigh his behavior and what he has done in the past.

Vulcan is the opposite and the chances of him causing problems on the team is an eventuality.

I'd like it if you could elaborate on what he has done in the past, and on what possible problems he can cause on the team. Considering the way the team is configured, I don't see many (or any) ways he could be causing problems.

[Deophite18]

Originally Posted by Inverness

I'd like it if you could elaborate on what he has done in the past, and on what possible problems he can cause on the team. Considering the way the team is configured, I don't see many (or any) ways he could be causing problems.

He is the reason HoudiniMan really quit. Although he left that out of his farewell thread. You can get the details from someone else. I don't want to start a flame war.

[Scary_Sock]

Originally Posted by Deophite18

He is the reason HoudiniMan really quit. Although he left that out of his farewell thread. You can get the details from someone else. I don't want to start a flame war.

Oh dear.

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Deophite18

He is the reason HoudiniMan really quit. Although he left that out of his farewell thread. You can get the details from someone else. I don't want to start a flame war.

If you're going to go making claims about somebody you sure as hell better provide details rather than leaving it up to someone else.

[Imperialistic]

I guess there isn't too many Level Artists interested in the GDT team.
So I guess I reckon' I might as well be.

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Imperialistic

I guess there isn't too many Level Artists interested in the GDT team.
So I guess I reckon' I might as well be.

I'm sure there is a great deal of people who still don't know about this new Global Development Team. I wouldn't want you to join just because not many level artists have joined yet.

[[email protected]]

Happy to help

[WanDaMan]

I can't wait to get started!!

[Loriel]

Originally Posted by WanDaMan

I can't wait to get started!!

What exactly are you waiting for?

[Bell]

List updated Imp, thank you for your support. We are still debating a levels department but as I've said before. I would prefer to not get into too many specifics of team duties and subdivisions needed until the team is formed and they can be involved in that process too.

As far as Vulcan goes, the prior drama with Houdini has actually already been discussed. For the record they used to both p*** me off on a regular basis. It was a personal problem between them and had been for years. I'm just unsure of how these actions would affect the GDT in the future.

There are very few members of the GDT team that aren't vindictive in their own right when pushed to a wall. If they can't keep their personal issues out of the GDT they will be removed and if they do decide that they are going to let loose and do something they shouldn't. The punishment will be severe. This is a global team and they will be expected to act like it.

If Houdini were to return and wanted to be involved in the team I would treat him the same as I do Vulcan. There was fault from both sides of the fence and both would bull headed and stubborn. Just like the majority of the Graalian population