horrendous leveling

[Frankie]

I decided to take a look around the server to see what has changed and I've been very disappointed. I've noticed that the level design is awful and I wanted to voice my opinion. here are a few that stood out to me:


era grotto:
who thought it was a good idea to change this level? it looks like a jail cell. tinting the fountain green to make it look like it's shooting sewage is incredibly tacky. there was nothing wrong with the old level and I feel like someone changed it for the sake of changing it. unfortunately this change took a huge step backwards. just because it's underground doesn't mean it has to resemble the sewers.


era hotel:
just.. ugly. accurately represents the new style of leveling that has gotten really popular over the past few years. I have no idea why.

- gray scale color scheme with red as a desperate attempt to give this level color.
- gray carpets with red trimming.
- carpet squares scattered randomly with obnoxious red tinted lights conveniently placed over them as well as every seat and plant.
- the plants are black and white. this doesn't need any further explanation.
- overall everything I hate to see in a level.
- hotel or night club?

ammo mart:
the black benches outside foreshadow what will be seen inside. yet again, another gray scale color scheme.

- the safe in the ground underneath glass. obvious perspective error here and makes zero sense. never understood why this piece of detailing was ever created. I've seen it in the past.
- underground fish tank seen as a desperate attempt to make a boring level look interesting. clear perspective error considering the plants are placed at the bottom edge of the tank.
- rainbow flashing lights. no more needs to be said here.
- flooring is random and has no definite pattern. this has been a popular floor detailing technique for as long as I can remember, but I'm surprised it's still used. it looks tacky and unnecessary and also provides a lot of tedious work for the level artist.

example of what carpet design should look like: era_start.nw (auction house/gun shop)


fort knox armory:
another generic gray scale color scheme level. not much else to be said.


event house:
another generic gray scale color scheme level. tacky "ET" written in the floor. honestly the layout of this level has a very classic graal touch to it and is laid out very well. I just can't stand the repeated color scheme in all of these levels.


dairy hut:
for once the walls have color but the design of this level is ruined with ugly gray carpet. I understand these tiles have been on the era tileset for the longest time, but I think it's time something else is used. this level also succumbs to the phenomena of randomly placed carpet squares.

overall not a bad level but the flooring ruins it. pizza hut and dippin donuts share the same fate.


casino:
extremely well designed. perfect example of how levels should look like. creative, alive, and interesting.


bank:
another good example of what era levels should look like.


comic club:
a good example of where the gray scale color scheme with neon lights actually works.


I feel like a lot of these levels need to be redesigned. the server reminds me of what old era rip offs used to look like. the buildings are mundane and depressing compared to all of the colors on the gmap, with items, and even on our graal characters. if tile options are the problem then I'd like to see some improvement with that. any talented graphic artists shouldn't have a problem creating tiles with more color. it would be a very simple project in my opinion.


*this is all my opinion and you are free to disagree with me.

[-HateD-]

I feel like everything Mesh_P2P made is ****. During the Zach management era (even before with alf/tim) a lot of the levels were changed to the greyscale making it very cliche and boring.

[Scoper]

Originally Posted by Frankie

*this is all my opinion and you are free to disagree with me.

This, I suppose. Everyone's got their own -- I find I have complaints in common with yours, but other things that upset you, I find endearing.

Styles changed because of popular demand and also the introduction of different LATs, as it goes. Can't stay old forever

[natchez416]

Levels in general are fairly bad.
I would argue that the tiles are worse and perhaps a larger part of the problem.

I wouldn't say that levels are particularly worse than they used to be however. If anything they're probably slightly better in general.

Poor standards are probably related more to the lack of a monetary incentive than anything else.

[Kohola_KinG]

You are playing a 2D game, everything looks tacky to begin with.

Also don't understand somebody who doesn't play the game has to come on the forum and complain or give his 'opinion' about it. I'm not hating on you but it seems you just want something to whine about. If you don't like it then come back and change it yourself. Sorry that's my 'opinion'.

[Supaman771]

Noticed some related things today.

Joined an event of TS, and the lobby I made nice and sleek was turned completely black with some fill-in carpets.

Don't know why everyone wants everything to be black. Once upon a time, some guy decided to use a black table for a wall, and now no-one even knows those are table tiles. Between these overused tiles and those horrendous level shadows that they set to like .8 (a full 1 is completely black) and put everywhere, I need to switch to text display mode to be able to see anything.

The examples you listed are (or were) player businesses, thus they have been modified and ****ed with every which way by the random nubs who get ownership every 2 weeks. That or the GBA's who don't have any ideals for the business side and make things colorful, also every 2 weeks or so. I still laugh when I go into player modified levels (homes/businesses) and each room is a different color.

The examples of good levels you listed are levels which were created, and for the most part, either completely unused or not accessible to players/lesser staff to modify.

If you want to see the worst, get access to some player houses.

To TK's point, the original Era tiles are pretty bad. But some of the newer ones are much nicer. An issue here could be that all these private player edits are being done without the updated tiles. Though I think it's just that they all seem to have a taste for black + purple/red/blue.

[TSAdmin]

I've never been a fan of the darker/duller tiles unless they specifically complimented the rest of the level (As you said, Comic Club). For this reason, I often declined levels submitted by community submitters such as Mesh_P2P2 whose style it was to create such levels.

I've not really taken a big look around Era for nearly 2 years so I can't speak on most of the things you've mentioned here, but it does seem like we are of the same opinion regarding what a level shouldn't be.

[Tim_Rocks]

Originally Posted by Frankie

bank:
another good example of what era levels should look like.

I've always thought this was the best level I ever made on Era. Thanks for the compliment; I agree with everything you've stated. Aside from that, Era Hotel should be reverted back to it's original level. I have the backups.

[Scoper]

Originally Posted by TSAdmin

such as Mesh_P2P2 .

Originally Posted by -HateD-

Mesh_P2P .

forgot to point this out
it was a dark couple of months

[Frankie]

Originally Posted by Scoper

Styles changed because of popular demand and also the introduction of different LATs, as it goes. Can't stay old forever

newer doesn't necessarily mean better. there is nothing detrimental about expanding graphical content and adjusting leveling styles accordingly.

Originally Posted by Kohola_KinG

You are playing a 2D game, everything looks tacky to begin with.

I used tacky as a term to describe something that is in bad taste. 2d games are perfectly capable of looking nice.

Also don't understand somebody who doesn't play the game has to come on the forum and complain or give his 'opinion' about it. I'm not hating on you but it seems you just want something to whine about. If you don't like it then come back and change it yourself. Sorry that's my 'opinion'.

just because I'm not always active doesn't make my point less valid considering people seem to agree with me. I see a lot of potential in era and I think it's a shame that nobody is willing to take advantage of that potential. if I could change it myself, I would in a heart beat. unfortunately I do not have much time to allocate towards graal. that doesn't mean someone else can't. you shouldn't dismiss my argument by ignoring other alternatives.

Originally Posted by "Supaman771

The examples you listed are (or were) player businesses, thus they have been modified and ****ed with every which way by the random nubs who get ownership every 2 weeks.

admins are still responsible for what gets uploaded onto the live server. there definitely needs to be higher standards put in place with player made levels.

[Elk]

agreed

[Tim_Rocks]

Originally Posted by Frankie

just because I'm not always active doesn't make my point less valid considering people seem to agree with me. I see a lot of potential in era and I think it's a shame that nobody is willing to take advantage of that potential. if I could change it myself, I would in a heart beat. unfortunately I do not have much time to allocate towards graal. that doesn't mean someone else can't. you shouldn't dismiss my argument by ignoring other alternatives.

Frankie's points are always valid. When I was trying to improve the graphics on Era (road tiles for example), I mostly got a lot of complaints from players. Other problems I had was I couldn't ever have any consistency with tiles sense every graphics artist had their own style. And no one wants to do all that work for free either.

Originally Posted by Frankie

admins are still responsible for what gets uploaded onto the live server. there definitely needs to be higher standards put in place with player made levels.

Not sure how many houses you've seen lately or in the past. But a lot of the worst levels are in player houses. Since a lot of players would pay to have their level uploaded to Era, admins didn't seem to care as long as they were getting paid to do it. That's what happened with Era Hotel. The current owner at the time made his own level and paid to have it uploaded. I'm sure there's more levels on Era with the same outcome.

[Frankie]

I think we can let player houses slide because they aren't really accessible to the general public. although houses were never meant to be customized 100% to begin with. changing wall tiles, floor tiles, and adding furniture and lights is one thing. allowing players to design housing levels completely on their own was a mistake. it got to a point where it was expected of admins to upload player made levels which makes it hard to change how houses are customized.

[Crow]

Originally Posted by -HateD-

I feel like everything Mesh_P2P made is ****.

That's a given.

[bloodykiller]

who cares about leveling design, the only important "leveling" is making gang bases functional for an offensive pk without having huge levels, easy ways to run+shoot backwards and especially furniture everywhere