You're my favorite and probably the best developer on Graal Online; I am more than grateful for your contributions and the amount of hope you have given me (and others) to believe that they can create a server using the out-dated development software.

Thanks D'

Why was this thread even made? No one asked for players to do anything. They were given the ability to develop their skills. That was their intention, for players to get a basis in what it takes to develop a game, from the scripting aspect to images, etc. The objective was to enhance your self, not to develop servers for people to actually play, that just happens to be a bi-product. Now a days we focus more on what the players would want, instead of actually improving our skills. This is why your servers "fail" they weren't meant for that purpose in the first place, so its simply not failing in the aspect of having terrible content, its just failing in the aspect of it not being used properly. You say that the managers of this game don't care, then why would they take their time to make us new developer tools? You see, the original purpose for the game was for kids to get a sense of what making a game is like. Nothing more nothing less. It seems you all missed that point. Then over the years they figured out that developers weren't interested in really enhancing their skills, so thats why they advertise "Make your own server!" because its just about the money now. Thanks for ruining it ;D

If what you're saying is true, which it is not, why did the ability to rent a server come after the ability to get your server hosted (through offline work and project inspection), which came after the release of servers to play on?

We have been asking for updated tools for YEARS. Stefan said it was a waste of time. The only reason tools got reevaluated was so they could provide something useful to all the new players they've gotten from iPhone and I guess the potential Facebook crowd. It's for them, not for us. If it wasn't for iPhone I imagine we still wouldn't have any new tools.

I'm talking about the game after Eurocenter released one of their own servers. They had to establish a player base first. Duhh, everyone knows that o.o

Haha yeah, that makes a lot of sense. My bad.

I cant remember since 1999 Graal ever saying work online to script but only to make your skills better on gs1, or gs2. And for what good would it be to learn gscript, especially gs1 back in the day, if its only to get better at it? Get better at it for what? Not to make a server even though you are getting better at it on a server?

Makes no sense in that aspect...

I don't know about you but my skills are a bi-product of developing for a server, not some selfish conquest for self-improvement that you make it out to be.

Also, just because they didn't ask us to do it doesn't change the fact that nearly all of the content on Graal was made by players. And I mean nearly ALL of it. Even Classic, before hosting, was mostly made by players. Zone was made by players before Stefan took it over and made it a Gold server. G2k1? A team of developers picked by Stefan worked on it, and I don't think they were paid. Same for New World(which most of the biggest changes to Graal came from, like the NPC Server and the NW format).

Doesn't mean that because we weren't asked to do it, that none of the people who worked their ass off deserves to be recognized for it.

Point proven. you want to know why Eurocenter stopped putting time in this game? Because of people like you who would develop for them. Where did that get you?

I've learned quite a bit in the GraalScript area purely because of the higher developers on Graal (Fowlplay, Dusty, Ziro, Chris, etc) and to say they don't deserve credit to anything is like saying every server in Graal should be completely remade by the Eurocenter team and themselves only. That obviously would make no sense.

On behalf of a player / [sort-of] developer, I thank you all for creating material on Graal and letting players and rising developers learn and enjoy the game more... For free.

PS: I was actually able to make a script for someone for $20.00 before... The guy quit Graal and still owes me $35.50. Let's just mug him

I think the iOS platform and other greedy ventures (http://games.eurocenter.fr/index.html) like that had more to do with Graal's lack of support not because we continued to develop.

Side note: Looks like they updated from the ugly blue thing it used to be, I guess they could afford better web developers now.

To say its our fault that Eurocenter stopped developing for pc graal and that we stepped to far when we develop on servers they offer us to do so on is asinine. If the company was willing to offer the opportunity to do so, that doesn't automatically excempt a service provider and product provider from keeping up with the products and service they still provide, and trying to make them better. It also, being it's pretty much a 2 man group there at Eurocenter, doesn't excuse them from giving a thank you to people who helped keep their product going for free. Not to say it can't happen and people don't do it, just saying we are not the reason; they just don't really care enough.

That's the problem.
When most if not all of these servers were created, we believed we were making our own game, our own world to enjoy and play, now it has been literally stolen from us through a weak clause in Terms of Service. Why should developers like Dustyshouri, cbk1994, WhiteDragon, MrOmega, taylor, fowlplay4, myself and many others be stripped of credit for their success?
It's unethical, and like sssssss- said, it's asinine to even think of such a ludicrous alibi for their behavior.

I forgot to mention that Eurocenter lucked out on one factor, If it wasn't for the fact that they had such loyal as hell players, they wouldn't have even made it past 2006.

It is more than a bit annoying to see them abandon us even more than before now that they have a chance of making substantial profit, but I know I'm not the only one who can say that Graal has had more influence over my life than almost anything else—my future career will likely involve programming on a regular basis, which is largely thanks to the experience I gained developing on Graal.

It's a complex issue. I don't know where I stand on it.