Black outlines or no?

Ter13 · #1 02-07-2008, 09:28 PM

I'm fooling around with some player images, and I'm trying to decide if I should use black outlines, or pillow-shaded borders. I like how crisp the black outlines make the image look, but I don't care for the fact that it makes the skin seem paler than it really is.

I'm a big fan of the second for the fact that it ties the shading together, and seems to bring out the highlights and shadows, but I'm not a big fan of the fact that it makes the guy look a little chubbier than the ones in the black outline.

Preferences?

smirt362 · #2 02-07-2008, 10:04 PM

Sometimes they are good, depending on how you use them. But, that sprites kinda creepy...it's like a half man half woman thing.

xAzerothx · #3 02-07-2008, 10:09 PM

Black outline looks better.

Ter13 · #4 02-07-2008, 10:11 PM

Only reason it looks like that, is the jawline. If the jawline were squared out a bit more, it'd look alright. Unfortunately, I've only made one head for the bodies, and it just so happens to be the head for the female body...

The only reason I showed the male sprite, is because the female sprite was giving me problems while I was trying to make the border shaded, and I have to tweak the palette a little bit to make it look right.

Anyway, I think I prefer the shaded outline for the time being. Can you elabourate on your statement? I've never really used black outlines since I started programming games about six years ago. I know Graal uses a LOT of black outlines, and it looks good. I'm trying to define a tying visual style for my playerworld right now, so It'd be nice to know the community's feeling on black outlines.

Kirble · #5 02-07-2008, 10:27 PM

It would depend what it is used for. If you are using it on Graal and other stuff has black outlines, then go with the black outline. If the tiles etc. has no black outline go with no black.

I do prefer it without though.

Crow · #6 02-07-2008, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ter13

I'm fooling around with some player images, and I'm trying to decide if I should use black outlines, or pillow-shaded borders. I like how crisp the black outlines make the image look, but I don't care for the fact that it makes the skin seem paler than it really is.

I'm a big fan of the second for the fact that it ties the shading together, and seems to bring out the highlights and shadows, but I'm not a big fan of the fact that it makes the guy look a little chubbier than the ones in the black outline.

Preferences?

Pillow-shaded borders? I doubt you can pillow shade on one pixel width/height. Whats pillow shaded here is the whole rest of your sprite. That, and the anatomy is off. Same with the lighting.

If you would ask in general "black outlines or not", I would say it depends on what you are doing. I would use darker colored outlines for every char sprite, because they have to be readable against the backgrounds in every case.

cbk1994 · #7 02-07-2008, 11:10 PM

I like the black outline better; not exactly sure why.

Tigairius · #8 02-07-2008, 11:47 PM

NOOO I hate the black outline, black outline = BAD

Ter13 · #9 02-07-2008, 11:57 PM

Yeah, I'm feeling the darkened outline, and not the black. I'd tend to agree with you there Tigarius. I know the sprite really isn't "Graal style", but I'm not really trying for a "Graal" themed playerworld.

I'm really making MY playerworld MY way. I don't really like many of the current playerworlds, actually. I really enjoyed Classic back in 1.36, but I never cared for Zone, and most of the modern-themed playerworlds really turn me off. I just want this one to be quite a fair bit different, both style-wise and gameplay-wise.

Thanks for the input all, but Crow, care to elaborate on how my anatomy is off? I just want to see if you are going to point out the things I deliberately stylized, or if I genuinely am off. Thanks!

Xterminator · #10 02-08-2008, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xAzerothx

Black outline looks better.

I agree to i find it stand's out more :o

Ter13 · #11 02-08-2008, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xterminator

I agree to i find it stand's out more :o

I dunno, I don't see much of a need to have it "stand out more" when shown alone. I really should get some tile work done so that I can show you guys what it looks like when juxtaposed against the tileset. The more I think about it, the more I dislike the black outlines. Later on, once I finish some clothing sets and tile sets, I might drop some images into this thread again. For now, I'll keep a black outlined copy tucked away off the server, so that I can show you guys a comparison of what the map looks like with black outlines, and without. ;P

Crow · #12 02-08-2008, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ter13

Thanks for the input all, but Crow, care to elaborate on how my anatomy is off? I just want to see if you are going to point out the things I deliberately stylized, or if I genuinely am off. Thanks!

Thats where I fail. I can tell its off, but I dont know why. I suggest professional pixel help ;P Since I cant post any links, google for "Pixelation". The second entry should do it.
They help each other improving their pixel art.

Stephen · #13 02-08-2008, 02:28 AM

Depends. If you fade to black they're fine... but the idea here is that you're sticking with outlines when you don't actually have to.

If you give everything a dynamic range of lighting - which you will see in real life - you will find some things do in fact become hard to see in certain areas... but I think you'll find the same problem in real life as well.

Also, in reference to your user title, we're not allowed to discuss alcohol here. It's pretty much worse than 1970's Russia around here.

Ter13 · #14 02-08-2008, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen

Also, in reference to your user title, we're not allowed to discuss alcohol here. It's pretty much worse than 1970's Russia around here.

=/ I guess I'll change it. Even though 90% of the time I sit down to use forums, I'm either sloshed or hung over...

*Aside: Gah! Why can't Graal just like me for who I am!?*