Graal sucks because everyone can be Staff

[gravator]

I feel a big problem with graal sucking right now is the ammount of talented workers (or somewhat talented) gets spread out too much, sure it's a fantastic idea to let people buy and own a playerworld, but are these playerworld owners making enough progress? I figured within six months to a year you would see SOME kind of progress done to a playerworld, a quest or two, maybe fixing current problems or some useful content to attract more people to that particular server.


To me classic is lacking in anything good at all, the last thing i heard about classic was the guild system and trying to make baddies work and there's nothing else done for classic since then, it looks (only to me, i can't speak for anyone else) like classic doesn't have anyone activly working there anymore, the biggest update i know of is burger refuge was replaced by a skating rink and that's it, no sign of more levels added, no quests to do, nothing to fight but other players (your pick of about 25 that you find in there).



And something i would hope comes to an end is people trying their best to keep a playerworld from dying, the original owner may have had certain ideas, but then leaves, someone else that loved said playerwold doesn't want to let it go, so they take over......but this is where the problem starts, they have very different ideas and attempt to alter the playerworld, sometimes almost entirely and only gets halfway done, they give up and still a third person tries taking over and does the very same thing as the second guy did, remake some or nearly everything and on and on, to the point the playerworld just stinks since the very reason it got started was buried under multiple failed ideas. I'm pretty sure a few under construction servers have this happening now, and they may never reach the hosted tab if it keeps up.



Just take your talent and ideas to a server that's already hosted or is on the classic tab and don't worry about it, your so called "idea" will either make it to public eyes where it will be used later anyways, or it never makes it, and people that can't seem to work with each other for some odd reason or another, i would probably never understand, but dang just put that crap to the side and make a server for others to play in, it's very unlikely someone is going to look into why person A and person B can't seem to work together.

[TheJames]

I like the playerworld hosting. Its unqiue. Gives me a chance to make the game I've always dreamed of playing. Guns, free roam, vehicles, no annoying strict "Staff Members". GTA with an online community. Also lets beginners expand on their developing skills. I've seen many graal gat's/nats go onto bigger and better projects. Not saying a game is better then graal, but you know

[AlkarenHyralt]

Originally Posted by Googi

You enabled or at least allowed the police force to pretty much fall into Karakaze's pocket, didn't punish Karakaze members who had confessed on the forums to committing crimes, threatened to legalize rock stealing if private mines were created, as though this would somehow make rock stealing less of a theft, continually stuck up for Karakaze on issues ranging from mining to excluding them from staff positions even though they had on at least one occasion required that a person (Jap) commit a crime (scamming) in order to gain membership.

Oh really? I don't quite remember it that way but okay. Personally I thought I did rather good as police chief and gm. Guess that's just a manner of personal opinion though.

And legalize rock stealing? Why would I threaten such a thing? You'd just whine more if I did something like that.

I do rather miss how I looked in the police hat though. The look grew on me after a while. Oh well. That was then.

[PrinceDark]

Originally Posted by AlkarenHyralt

Blind hatred is undying I guess. Though aside from punking you on rock tags I can't really think of any reason you had/have to hate me still.

Not to mention I got rid of a lot of 'criminals' and such as both forum admin and on graal once i came to power. About those being on my Police...idk. I took pretty good care of who i selected I thought.

Though you are not exactly the most impartial person when it comes to my actions.

Coincidentally I was in a guild called Criminals for a short while on G2K1. We was a bunch of idiots that got axed eventually.

[Googi]

Originally Posted by AlkarenHyralt

And legalize rock stealing? Why would I threaten such a thing? You'd just whine more if I did something like that.

http://forums.graalonline.com/forums...6&postcount=86

[Akios]

Graal Online sucks because It's player run. It shouldn't be. It just leads to corruption.

I hate how corrupt UN is. It pisses me off so much when I'm close to winning an event and a staff abuses and the ET does nothing about. I wouldn't want to namedrop MYSTI or MADROX. No I wouldn't.

But anway. :] If Graal Online wasn't player run, It'd be ten times better. I think mostly for a Player Relation staff job anyway.

I'm down for a players making servers, and levels. GFX, that's what makes servers unique. But having players run non-dev jobs only asks for trouble. Think about it. If a GP's best friend starts hacking, and the GP catches his/her friend hacking, is s/he going to ban him? Probably not. If a GP catches some random person hacking who they've never met before, you bet they'd be banned in an instant.

[zokemon]

Originally Posted by Akios

I'm down for a players making servers, and levels. GFX, that's what makes servers unique. But having players run non-dev jobs only asks for trouble. Think about it. If a GP's best friend starts hacking, and the GP catches his/her friend hacking, is s/he going to ban him? Probably not. If a GP catches some random person hacking who they've never met before, you bet they'd be banned in an instant.

By the first part:
If players make a server and get it to the classic tab, you think it should just be taken over by Cyberjouers staff and the players who spent loads of time and money to make their server reap no rewards? I'm not saying corruption is a reward they should reap but being able to manage a project that you have been working on for a very long time is an immense reward for any developer.

By the second part:
So players should be development staff but not PR positions? Generally the PR positions are lower then the development staff. If Cyberjouers staff were to take up all the PR positions, you would have 13 year olds as developers (with way more power) looming over Police, FAQ and Events Team members that are way more mature.

All in all:
The problem I see that you have is not players being staff per-say but rather something else. You should look at the server you are talking about and the administration team for that server (specifically Management). Corruption, foul-play and lack of responsibility will always trickle downwards on any server. I really think there is the root of your problem.

But, I don't go on UN much at all so I'm only going based off of many stories I've heard, so don't take anything I say to be fact.

[Spark910]

A Philosopher once said we don't want what we want, we want the desire for what we want. Once we have it, we can no longer desire it, and it is no longer attractive to us. (or similar words).

Once we have it all, it becomes boring!

So I'd agree.

[Crono]

Originally Posted by Akios

But anway. :] If Graal Online wasn't player run, It'd be ten times better. I think mostly for a Player Relation staff job anyway.

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that an anarchist is suggesting players shouldn't be GP's and such, and that Graal Online as a company (we can think of it as "government" for fun) should step in on those roles?

[Codein]

Originally Posted by Gerami

Am I the only one who finds it ironic that an anarchist is suggesting players shouldn't be GP's and such, and that Graal Online as a company (we can think of it as "government" for fun) should step in on those roles?

I never took notice but now you look at it, it is quite funny.

Most GPs these days are basically those without talent who wish to have power. They have no productive skills so it seems like the sure fast way to having that edge over their follow players. When hired and working though, many find that this is not the case and the bad are washed away whilst the good remain.

However, if the bad stay in power, it's solely a management issue :P

[Infernix]

Graal lives off the basis that everyone can develop because a lot of its player base is mainly developing and buying servers in which they believe will succeed(and never do). Surely graal would take a huge hit in the bank account if everyone couldn't develop, because they certainly cant survive off gameplay.
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Originally Posted by Codein

I never took notice but now you look at it, it is quite funny.

Most GPs these days are basically those without talent who wish to have power. They have no productive skills so it seems like the sure fast way to having that edge over their follow players. When hired and working though, many find that this is not the case and the bad are washed away whilst the good remain.

However, if the bad stay in power, it's solely a management issue :P

Worse of all when these GPs stay for a long period of time they end up with more power as they make their way up to the Admin and Manager positions just because theyve held a job for so long and some people on the server like them. Just because someone likes you doesnt ever qualify for such positions in my opinion. You need to have some sort of skills. Im sure I could point out a few servers that have done this.
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Graal could have fixed its self though I believe. They survive solely off player development and and then 1 development "team" which consist of pretty much Stefan. Now if graal could form a paid development team of some sort of people who were qualified for the job they might be able to form a more well rounded server. Bringing in more profit eventually and then being able to increase the size of their development team even more, thus increasing the chance of creating more good servers/games. Graal could them come out of this stage if which it completely depends on players which at the same time continuing player development on the Classic list/ and UC list. But I think theyve already dug to deep in their pockets and are unable to get enough change to do this.

[Elk]

Originally Posted by Spark910

A Philosopher once said we don't want what we want, we want the desire for what we want. Once we have it, we can no longer desire it, and it is no longer attractive to us. (or similar words).

Once we have it all, it becomes boring!

So I'd agree.

Thats exactly the same what I said

To the "run-by-players" issue:

Do you really think cyberjouers would get paid staffs? Err...

[zokemon]

Originally Posted by Elk

Do you really think cyberjouers would get paid staffs? Err...

They have paid staff.

[Infernix]

Originally Posted by Elk

Thats exactly the same what I said

To the "run-by-players" issue:

Do you really think cyberjouers would get paid staffs? Err...

Im not being judgmental of them, thus I think of them as a normal business. So yea why the hell not. (Other than they are dead broke)

[Inverness]

Originally Posted by Darlene159

Please don't turn this into a discussion about bans, the thread is bad enough as it is....

We're not discussing Bans, we're discussing the Ban System, or rather lack of.