New Manager

[MysticX2X]

Originally Posted by Rufus

Aside from what is mentioned in what I've quoted below, what does "the normal manager" do?

For starters, be active. Direction control of development. Handling input. Coming up with innovative content Watching over the Staff team. Storm may do that all from time to time, but if he isn't going to step down, then he should be active at the least.

2 UN Manager's have been removed in past 1-1 1/2 years for inactivity/lack of updating(One manager twice), though not as worse as Storm's case. It's only time before Storm faces the same treatment.

This may be the staff hierarchy of many servers, but it is not what happens on Classic and I'm not sure it ever has. The person in charge of the development leads the direction of the server development, not the manager. It is true that the manager should be discussing the direction of the server, but in the times that I've spoken to Storm about the server direction he seems to be aware of what the development teams have wanted to go in, which suggests he does do this.

Being aware isn't enough. I have doubts he even suggested any new development ideas at all. Anyone can approve an idea. Storm needs to be the person giving the ideas and assignments to the Dev Team where they handle it from then on. Not have the Dev team come up with ideas and have Storm give a nod. On top of all that, he doesn't even log on as often as a manager should. If he gets too busy that he can't even log on once a day (he logs on once or twice every few days), then It's clearly his time to go, and anyone will agree on that. Classic shouldn't be any different when other server managers have been removed for being exactly like how Storm has been.

@Ben: I don't know if he just wants to be in charge. If he did, he would of been doing what we have urged him to do. Maybe he just likes his tag and RC. Or maybe that's what just what wanting to be in charge is .

[xnervNATx]

Originally Posted by MysticX2X

If he gets too busy that he can't even log on once a day (he logs on once or twice every few days), then It's clearly his time to go, and anyone will agree on that. Classic shouldn't be any different when other server managers have been removed for being exactly like how Storm has been.

wow i so agree

[BlackSolider]

The problem with firing a current manager is that you need to have someone better ready AND willing to step in immediately. Do we have someone who wants to be manager of classic ready to step in if a move does occur? I don't know. I also don't know what the exact definition of a "manager" is, especially one on graal. What exactly does a manager do? Does he help with dev stuff by being hands-on and actually produce stuff himself? Does he talk to all the players and get their opinion in order to find the direction for the server? Does he make sure all the staff positions are doing their jobs appropriately and actively?

Obviously many of you might have an idea what a manager might/should do based on managers from other servers. But what does a Classic manager do exactly? I don't know if many of us can speak since all we've known is storm over the last 4 years. Perhaps a few of you were here before that.

Point is, what do we need our manager to do? If we need a hands-on manager who makes stuff himself, then yes DC or Thor would be a good choice. If we need a manager who constantly gets the opinion of the people and tries to accommodate them...well I really don't know exactly is friendly with the majority so I don't know who to list here. If we need a manager who just makes sure all the admins are in line, then perhaps a more active storm would be good enough.

Has storm done a great job moving the server forward in the last four years? No, not really. Could he be good enough if he was more active? Perhaps. It depends what you think classic's manager should do.

With all of that said, personally I think that a manager needs to commune with the players and get their opinions and wants. Then he/she needs to get together with the GC admin + Dev admin and talk about if/how they can implement those ideas. If they are acceptable, then a release should be made within a month (depends on scale of project). If not, then the manager needs to explain why not to the people and then try to find another solution.

Thats how I feel a classic manager should operate. Can a more active master storm do that? Possibly. Is he on good terms with enough of the players to get the majority's opinions/thoughts? Who knows. All I know is that if thor/DC get promoted, we'd have to find someone to replace their old spots, which won't be easy to do. Perhaps they can keep deving while getting the opinions of classicians. Who knows.

[MysticX2X]

Wow, Gladius. You sure like to type A LOT of novels.

That being said, the debate here is whether Storm is doing his job right or not. Not what constitutes a manager since we all have the general idea by now.Storm has the politeness of a manager, and the integrity to respond to every player PM, but he doesn't offer much more then that. At least not decision wise/idea wise, which a manager should be the proprietor of usually. That is the concern. Storm can't even log on properly. That being said, he knows he's reaching his limit.

DC is the best candidate so far for manager me thinks. He's usually pretty rational in regards to player input and gets things done gc-wise. Thor would be too but I heard something as if he did not want the position, but correct me if I'm wrong.

[maximus_asinus]

The ultimate purpose of this thread isn't 'who would be a better manager' nor is it really about 'is Storm qualified for the job'. We should be discussing what is best for Classic, and if a change in Manager really accomplishes anything. We all have varying definitions of what a Manager's job entails, we can't even agree on what Storm should be doing, let alone who could replace him.

Lets get our priorities in order before we go out trying to shoot anyone down, starting with a clearly defined definition and duties that the current Manager should be performing.

[xnervNATx]

listening to the players
having a clear idea of what will be made in the future
manage the DEV and support them
help at making classic a better place
having a good relation with the players
and being active (in my opinion this is what a manager need the most after doing something for the server)

[WhiteDragon]

In my opinion, a manager should not directly interfere with any departments unless intervention is necessary.

A manager should simply hire and keep track of the proper department heads that can help him achieve his view for the server.

There should also be regular meetings with all the department heads to always make sure the departments are working with each other to achieve that same view.



I believe Storm is only doing the "staying out of the way of the innards of the departments", but not really helping them coordinate or dictating any policy that they should all follow.


At least this is how the hierarchal structure should work if we want to keep a manager and the department heads, otherwise everything will get messy if the manager tries to do GP duties, hire FAQ, and develop random weapons, because by "law" he would technically have the jurisdiction to do that, so none of the department heads could do anything about it even if he was actually interfering.

[Polo]

If this thread had been made a year ago, I would have full agreed with a lot of the things being said. I wasn't around enough, and I wasn't trying hard enough to get Classic out of the situation it was in. Recently however, I've had much more time to do things. I'm logging on for an hour or two most days, and that's slowly increasing. I try to average at least 14 hours a week (2 hours a day), double what the old staff rules expected. I'm also always contactable by forum PM if you do not catch me on player.

Logging on alone isn't enough though; it's pretty pointless logging on if I'm just sat there being idle. Firstly I've been making steps towards soring certain staff teams out, and have already seen an improvement here. Things are still far from perfect, but we're getting there. I also have a number of ideas for the server in the pipeline, some of which I've briefly run past people and others which are pretty new and still need a bit of thrashing out. There's a lot of things I dislike about Classic at the moment, and I'm trying to put together plans that will steer us back in the right direction.

Some of you have questioned what I actually spend my time doing whilst logged on to Classic. Firstly, my job is not a development one: that's what Thor and the team are there for, and I'm generally happy with the work they are doing. That said, I do help out both with bug fixing and as an advisory on things where needed. I will always get my hands dirty when there's a critical problem. As my free time has been increasing I've also been doing some new development stuff; one of my current projects is to vastly improve the base events system to bring some fresh team events to Classic. The vast majority of my time is spent resolving player complaints, and collating views and ideas for the server. Recently there have been a number of major complaints, particularly regarding the hit detection, and trying to address everyone's issues can take a lot of time. It's very easy to listen to a single player, determine their problem and fix it; taking all the problems from every player and trying to match these against each other and work out exactly what will be the best solution for the player base as a whole is a lot more tricky.

Some of you have also questioned why I have not been replying to the threads here on the Classic forums. I actually read the threads several times a day, and not responding has been intentional. The way the threads currently are has allowed a lot of discussion into the problems we have at Classic, and this has given me a lot of information on how we should move forwards. I'm pretty sure that if I'd started replying in the threads I would have quickly just become the target of conversation, and this would have derailed the thread from being useful.

I want, just as much as the rest of you, to get Classic back where it belongs. There's a pretty big mountain to climb before we can reach that point, but I'm confident that we can achieve it. I expect most people to read this post and simply think 'meh', and that's wholly understandable. I don't expect to change your opinions using words, I expect to climb a mountain with my actions.

[BlackSolider]

FOUR MORE YEARS!!!!

Rofl.

Seriously though, good post.

[xnervNATx]

Originally Posted by BlackSolider

FOUR MORE YEARS!!!!

Rofl.

Seriously though, good post.

was that supposed to be a joke?

by the way storm , i know that wasnt your idea but having serverside hd back is just like flying back in the past. nothing changed and got the old same hd. why not move it back in the us where everyone liked it. cant you do anything to fix that?

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Polo

Déjà Vu

Haven't you said this at least twice a year for the past 4 years?

[xnervNATx]

Originally Posted by Rufus

Haven't you said this at least twice a year for the past 4 years?

words words yet no actions.

[DarkCloud_PK]

Originally Posted by Polo

Some of you have also questioned why I have not been replying to the threads here on the Classic forums. I actually read the threads several times a day, and not responding has been intentional. The way the threads currently are has allowed a lot of discussion into the problems we have at Classic, and this has given me a lot of information on how we should move forwards. I'm pretty sure that if I'd started replying in the threads I would have quickly just become the target of conversation, and this would have derailed the thread from being useful.

I want, just as much as the rest of you, to get Classic back where it belongs. There's a pretty big mountain to climb before we can reach that point, but I'm confident that we can achieve it. I expect most people to read this post and simply think 'meh', and that's wholly understandable. I don't expect to change your opinions using words, I expect to climb a mountain with my actions.

The mountain isnt as big as you think it is.
As for replying on the forums, maybe if you posted more often and get immersed within the community, being a full part of it, forums and all, maybe you would quickly not become a target in threads. Maybe people might actually start to approve of you. That's my advice to you, not bashing you. The community wants you to be one with them, so you can more understand them.

[xnervNATx]

Originally Posted by DarkCloud_PK

The mountain isnt as big as you think it is.
As for replying on the forums, maybe if you posted more often and get immersed within the community, being a full part of it, forums and all, maybe you would quickly not become a target in threads. Maybe people might actually start to approve of you. That's my advice to you, not bashing you. The community wants you to be one with them, so you can more understand them.

he had .. like 4 years to overcome the mountain?

[DarkCloud_PK]

Originally Posted by xnervNATx

he had .. like 4 years to overcome the mountain?

Yes, I know, his reasoning is that hes back and ready to go now, and to forget the past because this is Storm 2.0.