Priests and spellcasters get even!

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Would it be feasible to suggest a higher level map, specifically for mages and priests? That would mean, magic-using monsters like on the immense maps, ecxept much much stronger to stop melee-users from surviving (just like in immenses ).

This'd mean you can only really kill the monsters with avatar or spells, but the given exp would be equal or higher (probably equal though) to the brutal map monsters.
The reason i make this suggestion is that currently, the only way to level up in magic and prayer is to kill lords over and over and over. Lords are much less concentrated (and harder to kill with magic/prayer) than the monsters in maps, but it is practically impossible to kill bigworms with magic and avatar.
If we got a map that only magic users could do, it would enable priests and mages to catch up with the barbarians, and maybe we might see a few relics being obtained to level the plains some more....

Not an important thing since things are already completely out of kilter and too far gone to repair until a reset, but it would still be nice.

[wonderboysp2p]

Originally posted by Monkeyboy_McGee
[Bbut it is practically impossible to kill bigworms with magic and avatar. [/B]

it's possible with avatar but if you time it wrong then the bigworm freezy bug gets you and you cant move until you reconnect

just stand there and let the worm eat you and have your avatar walk back and foirth over you and the worm!

you kinda need good ac for that though :grin:

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Originally posted by wonderboysp2p



it's possible with avatar but if you time it wrong then the bigworm freezy bug gets you and you cant move until you reconnect

just stand there and let the worm eat you and have your avatar walk back and foirth over you and the worm!

you kinda need good ac for that though :grin:

Yeah, it is possible, but not through this method unless you're lucky. The reason i say this, is because when you get attacked by the bigworm, you automatically face down and so your avatar just walks south regardless of what you try X_X
The only way i've ever been able to kill one is by having another person in there with me on the map and steer my avatar while he gets attacked. Like you said though, this requires very high AC which most people don't have, especially not low-down priests/mages trying to get more powerful

[wonderboysp2p]

Originally posted by Monkeyboy_McGee
is because when you get attacked by the bigworm, you automatically face down

use your mouse to changhe directions

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Originally posted by wonderboysp2p


use your mouse to changhe directions

Genius! o_o

Still, you do need quite high AC for that, and it would still be nice to have mage&priest-specific maps that gave as much exp as the barbarian maps....

[graaliholic]

Originally posted by Monkeyboy_McGee
Lords are much less concentrated (and harder to kill with magic/prayer) than the monsters in maps, but it is practically impossible to kill bigworms with magic and avatar.

I kill tons of worms with avatar. Armour up, cast regeneration, and use myself as a decoy. When the worm hits me, my avatar walks downwards, slashes the worm, then i'm released right after and setup for the next attack. Works quite well actually, and even better if someone else is your decoy.

[MasterNuke]

I kill bigworms with detect monster and firebolt >.>

[UNPTWOPWINNER]

Does nobody know how to kill worms yet? You put a monster part on the ground, the worm will come up to eat that monster part, you flood it with spells.

I use forked lightning and it's easy.
:o

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Hmm, i see. Well, there's just one more thing wrong with the whole thing: time.

Where the melee users can just run around a brutal with their prepped hook and clear it in like 5 minutes, a mage/priest will be lucky if he can clear the final room (having ignored the first one) before the cave collapses
Not a major problem though, just a bit of a waste...

[HeartBeatOfTheEarth]

This does sound a bit nifty....

[Satrek2000]

How about this - add some speed+ to the common magic rings like RoM, RoAM, RoHM, RoA, RoM and RoE - the fighting rings have speed, hence the magic rings slow you down quite a bit, and seeing how you lose a spell when you get hit, speed is kinda important if you want to survive as a spellcaster.

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Originally posted by Satrek2000
How about this - add some speed+ to the common magic rings like RoM, RoAM, RoHM, RoA, RoM and RoE - the fighting rings have speed, hence the magic rings slow you down quite a bit, and seeing how you lose a spell when you get hit, speed is kinda important if you want to survive as a spellcaster.

This would help, i reckon, but i was talking about the fact that with, say, avatar, you have to cast it, then steer it around which is tricky (partly due to the delay in a response) and then of course the monsters start walking away or come towards you so you have to re-steer your avatar. I'm not saying you should be able to increase the speed of vatars, that would just be silly; i'd just like more time to fanny about with my clumsy ol' god o_o

[GryffonDurime]

Time for new spells

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Originally posted by GryffonDurime
Time for new spells

Well, we could do that, but...it wouldn't happen anytime soon *points to summon cult monsters and such*.

If it did happen a new spell could be that the player turn into his god's avatar, like, posession or something...that would be cool o_O

[HeartBeatOfTheEarth]

OR.. maybe fix unworking spells..... Brigids granted prayers do NOTHING as of yet, ((barring ironwood skin))

[GoZelda]

Originally posted by MasterNuke
I kill bigworms with detect monster and firebolt >.>

I run around until one gets me, walk 'out of range' and use magic bullet Although i usually do a brutal with other persons. Persons below level 100 ;o

Although i like the idea. Heck, it still can be hard to finish a normal lvl.3 or 2 map with magic

[graaliholic]

Originally posted by HeartBeatOfTheEarth
OR.. maybe fix unworking spells..... Brigids granted prayers do NOTHING as of yet, ((barring ironwood skin))

I bet peace works. (peace is every spellcaster's best friend)

[GryffonDurime]

Her highest level spells WOLNT work on 2k2. The two revive spells she grants at her highest levels only work on servers where permanent death is on. Perhaps they should be replaced? Also, I'd like to see some Teleportation spells implimented.

[graaliholic]

Originally posted by GryffonDurime
Her highest level spells WOLNT work on 2k2. The two revive spells she grants at her highest levels only work on servers where permanent death is on. Perhaps they should be replaced? Also, I'd like to see some Teleportation spells implimented.

They don't work on many CF servers either, since most are afraid of the perma death. And for teleportation spells, you mean like the three stefan took out? Dimension door, which would probably take you 1/4 the way across the GMAP, Town Portal, which you can create two points to use whenever (only the creator and his party can use the points, casting the spell once marks a point, second time opens a portal between the two places, 3 marks a new point and closes the old portals, 4 opens up a new portal, etc, and word of recall, which warps you back to the last "restart position saved") You would mean those spells, right?

[GryffonDurime]

Right- Especially Town Portal.

[Satrek2000]

Sounds like a nifty spell... and wold be useful as well as a nice addition. Make it a level 18 or 20 spell, so not everyone can use it, and maybe decrease the mana required with the number of people travelling - magic travel agencies, here I come

[GryffonDurime]

Originally posted by Satrek2000
Sounds like a nifty spell... and wold be useful as well as a nice addition. Make it a level 18 or 20 spell, so not everyone can use it, and maybe decrease the mana required with the number of people travelling - magic travel agencies, here I come

Yeha- Once more of the spells are implemented, mabey we can get some super high level 2k2 original spells to kind of reestablish classes. -_-. Sadly, we'd still be able to see an illiterate barbaraian cast Town Portal with the way it's set up.

[Satrek2000]

If I wasn't a warrior of birth and mage of calling, I'd say some spells should be locked to the class you chose - I think a better idea would be to link them to certain rank-groups, i.e. magic-users or priests... not kingdom-restricted spells, but rank-restricted spells...

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

I don't see a problem with teleportation spells since some people with like 6 speed or speedhacks just run across the whole map in 10 seconds anyway

And yeah, most things really should have been class-specific from the start, such as magic for mages, praying for priests, bows for barbs and uh, whatever the heck for the other classes XD
Pity it's too late now, the only time to make things class specific would probably be at the reset

[GoZelda]

Yes and Priests must be able to do everything, i'm a priest you see? No focourse you dpon't becuz u r stupid roflamo

[Satrek2000]

Stefan once suggested a different system himself: everyone can learn every skill, but while using the skill improves it by giving exp, not using it for a while reduces your abilities. It should be balanced in a way that you can be average in every skill, but only master one at the expense of the others, and need to train regularly to maintain that standard.
Maybe we could have a system that you gain exp as it is now, but the number used to calculate the level us retermined by multiplying the exp with some training-variable. Your class could give you a certain bonus to some abilities there.

[graaliholic]

Originally posted by Satrek2000
Stefan once suggested a different system himself: everyone can learn every skill, but while using the skill improves it by giving exp, not using it for a while reduces your abilities. It should be balanced in a way that you can be average in every skill, but only master one at the expense of the others, and need to train regularly to maintain that standard.
Maybe we could have a system that you gain exp as it is now, but the number used to calculate the level us retermined by multiplying the exp with some training-variable. Your class could give you a certain bonus to some abilities there.

Then people would have to level every once in a while. :o

I think the classes should have been what your character is. You could still get one random skill scroll at the start (for variation between players), but those would be the only skills you would have. Also the talismans would have to go, because it would make the wizardry skill useless. This way, there is some difference, and everyone isn't running around with a huge axe/sword while casting some spell. For more balance you could have everyone with the same number of points per skill to distribute, so you could sacrifice spell power for strength or dex, or vise versa.

[Satrek2000]

I'd say then you have everyone running arround with swords and no spellcasters - at least to a certain extend. Maybe if you alter the casting system so your spells don't get trashed with a single hit, and magic rings give some speed...

Besides, in the system I mentioned you wouldn't have to level - just use the skill. The higher your level, the better you'll be, and you wouldn't use exp for not using the skill.
Let's say you have 1000 exp. You use the skill every day, so your training modifier will be 2. It's a class skill, you get an addition of 1. In effect, the 1k would count as 3k.
If you don't use the spell and it's in your class, you would get only the clkass bonus, counting it as 1l.
If you don't use it, and it's not in your class, you will drop to a very basic level.

It's just an (unbalanced) draft here to point out what I mean - the numbers would have to be tweaked a bit, to something from 0.5 to 1.5 or so.

[graaliholic]

Originally posted by Satrek2000
I'd say then you have everyone running arround with swords and no spellcasters - at least to a certain extend. Maybe if you alter the casting system so your spells don't get trashed with a single hit, and magic rings give some speed...

Besides, in the system I mentioned you wouldn't have to level - just use the skill. The higher your level, the better you'll be, and you wouldn't use exp for not using the skill.
Let's say you have 1000 exp. You use the skill every day, so your training modifier will be 2. It's a class skill, you get an addition of 1. In effect, the 1k would count as 3k.
If you don't use the spell and it's in your class, you would get only the clkass bonus, counting it as 1l.
If you don't use it, and it's not in your class, you will drop to a very basic level.

It's just an (unbalanced) draft here to point out what I mean - the numbers would have to be tweaked a bit, to something from 0.5 to 1.5 or so.

Stats already affect how much exp you gain. :o

[Satrek2000]

Originally posted by graaliholic


Stats already affect how much exp you gain. :o

That's not what I mean - I mean you gain exp as it is now, but the level used to determin the strength of your spells and such is based on the experience you have multiplied with a training variable.

[graaliholic]

Originally posted by Satrek2000


That's not what I mean - I mean you gain exp as it is now

Which still depends on your stats.

[Satrek2000]

Originally posted by graaliholic
Which still depends on your stats.

I never said it didn't... then again, do you mean the basic stats or the skill levels? It never occured to me that your stats would affect the exp you get - skill levels on the other hand certainly do.

[Splke]

I could of sworn there was rumour about a bomb-omb type enemy that would blow up (massive damage) from phys attacks, so only prayers of magic could kill it... then again, I heard about Dragons 6 months ago... and nothings happened yet

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Originally posted by Splke
I could of sworn there was rumour about a bomb-omb type enemy that would blow up (massive damage) from phys attacks, so only prayers of magic could kill it... then again, I heard about Dragons 6 months ago... and nothings happened yet

Werd, these enemies would be sweet-ass...except they would be abused to hell. You'd have to make it so that it only kills the person who attacks it, otherwise a fast player can just run into a room when there are mages fighting them, kill everyone including himself, then quickly run back and pick up all the money.
And it would have to be One-hit KO 100% chance of killing, otherwise these people with like 65-70 AC would just kill them with phys anyway, or abuse it in the same way as stated above.

[Satrek2000]

Originally posted by Monkeyboy_McGee
And it would have to be One-hit KO 100% chance of killing, otherwise these people with like 65-70 AC would just kill them with phys anyway, or abuse it in the same way as stated above.

Have it deal strong death attacks, and only strike at those who physically attack it.

[Nidonemo]

You think if you're level was high enough you could CHARM the worms? Maybe not. Like You can't charm Lords...but anyway summon cult monsters, you think that would be summoning the monsters that could cast magic?

Cult - Term used usually referring to a bad group.

Bad groups - Usually considered to be using black magic.

Hmmm...

[Satrek2000]

I think cult monsters are rather monsters which are preferred by a godess - skeleton for bile would be obvious. I'd expect something similar to pet monsters, but with a set monster epending on your belief.