Trial Accounts---- Stefan and or Unixmad you might want to look at this!

[Milkdude99]

Ok we seem to have a problem with trial accounts, first off I thought hacking was pretty much out the window with this new Graal.exe? Well seems not , a guy got on hacked explosions all over the level , even on his nick he said he hacked , so of course server ban right? End of story or so I thought , he was using a trial account and I thought they could not hack on those? well any way it was a cat and mouse game from there on , ban 3 sec later back on SAME account SAME IP , ok fine ban again , well this went on for about 10 times of useless banning , why? because in trial mode nothing is saved NOT EVEN THE IP BANNING, errr well I think this needs to be addressed, we will be driven nuts if we cannot stop some ***** from hacking up the server in this way, its not from RC or FTP hacking but directly on the Game . Ohh yea he sent me this..

Alf the Elf (5/1/02 6:46:44 PM):
I'm not even REALLY hacking. I'm hacking Graal, but that's bs, that's not real
hacks. Graal d/l's a file from the player's computer every time I connect. If I
really wanted to **** with this place, I'd embed an fdisk execution into that file.

and this :

Alf the Elf (5/1/02 6:37:10 PM):
I just got banned.. since I don't have p2p, my account info resets each time I
press F8 and reconnect. Quite simply, no matter how many times you jail me, I
can just come back. And IP bans don't scare me either.


and he did keep good on his threat , a few minutes later he must have sent the shutdown command because a popup came up and said :
Server Shut down and Npulse shut down.

I was NOT amused by this , although Npulse came right back up is not the point. We do not have any defense for attacks like this , something needs to be done to prevent a player from reusing a trial account in this manner. If for nothing else the sanity of the Staff who is the ones who deal with something like this . I did this time but who will the next time?If a player is bent on hacking the server we must be able to protect it from harm in some way , as of now we have no defense against ppl using the trial accounts repeatedly like this and cannot even stop them from doing it...

Npulse tonight who's next? we all can be hit like this....

All I ask is for Stefan to fix the trial accounts from being able to hack and repeatedly get back on and do it again...

I hope Stefan and Unixmad read this .
btw yes I sent the IP to Stefan via Nemesis who happened to be on at the time.

[Milkdude99]

Also getting alot of complaints on Lag and Graal freeze ups and illegal error messages since the Graal.exe upgrade. I expected some problems with it but some are having some extreme problems with it, I too have a great deal of lag , some may be due to the voice thing and the 56k connections may have a real problem with it. ( I have Cable) Not sure what the problem is but If I find something that helps or is the root I will post it.

[haunter]

Originally posted by Milkdude99

and he did keep good on his threat , a few minutes later he must have sent the shutdown command because a popup came up and said :
Server Shut down and Npulse shut down.

Stefan reset the servers to set them with the new version... I freaked out when he did it to rudora too ;P

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by haunter


Stefan reset the servers to set them with the new version... I freaked out when he did it to rudora too ;P

This was after it was done or the Staff accounts in the server options would not have worked .... and I don't believe Stefan reset Npulse 2x

[zell12]

Bah, I can't get my setup to update the v2.13, its all, screwed up!

[shavomombetto]

Moon God, face the facts, even when this problem IS fixed, there will still be hackers. They seriously do not care if they are IP Banned from any server, they can simply use IP Maskers or just simply change their IP. To make something "hack-proof" would basically end alot of jobs on graal, because half of the GP's on Graal are there just to catch trainer-users and hackers in advance before they do anything, or when they've done something. There is no way you can TOTALLY prevent hacking, because it comes in many forms, som epeople gloat about it, such as Viper did, some people keep it to themselves and do not want to be caught, as when n-pulse was hacked when I was staff, and everyone got warped to the level that gave them all of these npc's, which lead up to mass-account reset. I'm sure Unixmad or Stefan will do something about this, but then there is the fact that some hackers DO have p2p accounts, and some hackers don't necessarily care about the 15 bucks they have to cough up to play graal. They'll eventually go away when Unixmad and Stefan put up some type of security system which prevents any program from interfering with the graal program interface, but until then, you can expect hackers in any form, even your own staff.

[Torankusu]

Ouch.

[slick_soul]

I knew this was going to happen. You think hacking is bad wait until I get on my free account and decide to kill all the staff. And it's gonna happen. the only N-Pulse staff member that can even hit me with a sword is dark-orphen. The rest of the NP staff can't even fight. lol. I'm a baaaaad boy!

[homeless1]

Originally posted by shavomombetto
Moon God, face the facts, even when this problem IS fixed, there will still be hackers. They seriously do not care if they are IP Banned from any server, they can simply use IP Maskers or just simply change their IP. To make something "hack-proof" would basically end alot of jobs on graal, because half of the GP's on Graal are there just to catch trainer-users and hackers in advance before they do anything, or when they've done something. There is no way you can TOTALLY prevent hacking, because it comes in many forms, som epeople gloat about it, such as Viper did, some people keep it to themselves and do not want to be caught, as when n-pulse was hacked when I was staff, and everyone got warped to the level that gave them all of these npc's, which lead up to mass-account reset. I'm sure Unixmad or Stefan will do something about this, but then there is the fact that some hackers DO have p2p accounts, and some hackers don't necessarily care about the 15 bucks they have to cough up to play graal. They'll eventually go away when Unixmad and Stefan put up some type of security system which prevents any program from interfering with the graal program interface, but until then, you can expect hackers in any form, even your own staff.

Even then, they could edit the packets sent back to the server from their machine...I dont think its possible to prevent that from happening, just make it harder *shrugs*

[G_yoshi]

Originally posted by shavomombetto
Moon God, face the facts, even when this problem IS fixed, there will still be hackers. They seriously do not care if they are IP Banned from any server, they can simply use IP Maskers or just simply change their IP. To make something "hack-proof" would basically end alot of jobs on graal, because half of the GP's on Graal are there just to catch trainer-users and hackers in advance before they do anything, or when they've done something. There is no way you can TOTALLY prevent hacking, because it comes in many forms, som epeople gloat about it, such as Viper did, some people keep it to themselves and do not want to be caught, as when n-pulse was hacked when I was staff, and everyone got warped to the level that gave them all of these npc's, which lead up to mass-account reset. I'm sure Unixmad or Stefan will do something about this, but then there is the fact that some hackers DO have p2p accounts, and some hackers don't necessarily care about the 15 bucks they have to cough up to play graal. They'll eventually go away when Unixmad and Stefan put up some type of security system which prevents any program from interfering with the graal program interface, but until then, you can expect hackers in any form, even your own staff.

To my knowledge, you have to play Graal through your real IP...I don't believe you can route it...of course, I could be wrong

[Admins]

You can do
noexplosions=true
and still ip-ban people,
but I will also fix that banning thing.

[Glory]

Originally posted by Stefan
You can do
noexplosions=true
and still ip-ban people,
but I will also fix that banning thing.

But wouldn't that ruin NPCW's? Heh, I am dumb so lol.

[Darlene159]

Originally posted by Stefan
You can do
noexplosions=true
and still ip-ban people,
but I will also fix that banning thing.

Wha????
but what about explosive weapons? And what does that have to do with banning? I am confused
Shavo, at least Unixmad is now bringing the law in for these hackers.

[Saga2001]

Originally posted by Darlene159



Wha????
but what about explosive weapons? And what does that have to do with banning? I am confused
Shavo, at least Unixmad is now bringing the law in for these hackers.

Spammers is all they are there are no real hackers on graal, except the smart ones, which is to say no one knows they are hackers. Also I believe the noexplosions=true may be for ghosts, probably, I don't think Stefan would say it if it didn't work, or if it was for real players......

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by shavomombetto
Moon God, face the facts, even when this problem IS fixed, there will still be hackers. They seriously do not care if they are IP Banned from any server, they can simply use IP Maskers or just simply change their IP. To make something "hack-proof" would basically end alot of jobs on graal, because half of the GP's on Graal are there just to catch trainer-users and hackers in advance before they do anything, or when they've done something. There is no way you can TOTALLY prevent hacking, because it comes in many forms, som epeople gloat about it, such as Viper did, some people keep it to themselves and do not want to be caught, as when n-pulse was hacked when I was staff, and everyone got warped to the level that gave them all of these npc's, which lead up to mass-account reset. I'm sure Unixmad or Stefan will do something about this, but then there is the fact that some hackers DO have p2p accounts, and some hackers don't necessarily care about the 15 bucks they have to cough up to play graal. They'll eventually go away when Unixmad and Stefan put up some type of security system which prevents any program from interfering with the graal program interface, but until then, you can expect hackers in any form, even your own staff.

Shavo , I am not stupid enough to think that will solve all the hacking problems, all I wanted was the Trial accounts fixed so they cannot get back on , at least with the same IP and account .

and as for this...

They'll eventually go away when Unixmad and Stefan put up some type of security system which prevents any program from interfering with the graal program interface, but until then, you can expect hackers in any form, even your own staff.

You ought to know, you have been banned for hacking and you were once Staff ....

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by zell12
Bah, I can't get my setup to update the v2.13, its all, screwed up!

Check in your Graal folder and see if the setup made a double Graal folder inside the other, this is a common problem I have as well as many others do when you run the setup again, even just to update.I found its best just to delete the graal Folder and start fresh.But copy your PM folder if you want to keep the PM history.

[Shorty2Dope]

Graal is still kind of hack proof. It is simple. Ban their accounts and IP ban them. Guess what? They want to play again they have to buy another account. Maybe they will think twice before wasting their money?

[fugitive316]

Originally posted by Milkdude99
Replying to Moon God's problem

Make an NPC in your starting level that automatically jails any account that you specify within the .txt of the NPC. That will pretty much ban accounts, if you script the NPC right. Hopefully it would only be temporary until Stefan allows baninfo to be saved, or some other measure.

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by Shorty2Dope
Graal is still kind of hack proof. It is simple. Ban their accounts and IP ban them. Guess what? They want to play again they have to buy another account. Maybe they will think twice before wasting their money?

The problem is not the 'Paid accounts" its the Trial accounts which nothing is saved including the IP ban, that is why Stefan said he will fix that ....

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by fugitive316


Make an NPC in your starting level that automatically jails any account that you specify within the .txt of the NPC. That will pretty much ban accounts, if you script the NPC right. Hopefully it would only be temporary until Stefan allows baninfo to be saved, or some other measure.

We have had that before and works for awhile then manages to go ape and bans people not intended for it so we discontinued its use.But Thanks for the input..

[Shorty2Dope]

Originally posted by Milkdude99
The problem is not the 'Paid accounts" its the Trial accounts which nothing is saved including the IP ban, that is why Stefan said he will fix that ....

ahh I see, I guess he will need to fix it for sure then

[shavomombetto]

Originally posted by Darlene159



Wha????
but what about explosive weapons? And what does that have to do with banning? I am confused
Shavo, at least Unixmad is now bringing the law in for these hackers.

Moonie, there's something called "Jurisdiction", even though these "hackers" (which they aren't, just using tools programers make for 'educational uses') are messing with the servers that are based in Europe, the Europeon police/attourney's cannot do anything to any AMERICAN trainer-user. Trainer-Users are not breaking the law, they are merely breaking the rules of the privacy agreement, and have no point in playing if they are to cause destruction and chaos. The only people who can be arrested/prosecuted, however, are people like Viper, who completely shut down the graal online server. Now that itself is illegal, but just putting explosions on a level because your bored, is not.

[G_yoshi]

Originally posted by shavomombetto


Moonie, there's something called "Jurisdiction", even though these "hackers" (which they aren't, just using tools programers make for 'educational uses') are messing with the servers that are based in Europe, the Europeon police/attourney's cannot do anything to any AMERICAN trainer-user. Trainer-Users are not breaking the law, they are merely breaking the rules of the privacy agreement, and have no point in playing if they are to cause destruction and chaos. The only people who can be arrested/prosecuted, however, are people like Viper, who completely shut down the graal online server. Now that itself is illegal, but just putting explosions on a level because your bored, is not.

Extradition can be fun

As for this "educational uses" thing, it's crap; a load of bull ****. If you believe that, then I'm not sure if I can feel sorry for you or not :/ It's fairly obvious what the real intent of these semi-malicious programs are...either that or I'm just being too paranoid

[shavomombetto]

I know they aren't for "educational uses" but that is what the internet laws signed by bill clinton state they are unless misused

[Darlene159]

I am well aware of that Shavo, but you can think I am completely stupid if you would like. Females do have brains also you know.
I apologize for this thread going astray

[shavomombetto]

it didn't go astray till you just said that and went off topic

[Darlene159]

it didn't go astray till you just said that and went off topic

Let me say it one more time "I APOLOGIZE FOR THIS THREAD GOING ASTRAY!"
DUH!!!!
Shavo, I wouldnt apologize if I didnt think I was the one who did it....good grief

Anyway, back on the subject at hand...I was able to jail an account that wasnt upgraded last night, so hopefully this new version fixed the trial jailing/banning issue...I hope

[Shorty2Dope]

Originally posted by shavomombetto


Moonie, there's something called "Jurisdiction", even though these "hackers" (which they aren't, just using tools programers make for 'educational uses') are messing with the servers that are based in Europe, the Europeon police/attourney's cannot do anything to any AMERICAN trainer-user. Trainer-Users are not breaking the law, they are merely breaking the rules of the privacy agreement, and have no point in playing if they are to cause destruction and chaos. The only people who can be arrested/prosecuted, however, are people like Viper, who completely shut down the graal online server. Now that itself is illegal, but just putting explosions on a level because your bored, is not.

You ****ing *****ic kids and your "it is for educational purposes". Thats the biggest joke. SHUT THE HELL UP IDIOT!!!!!

How the ****ing hell is throwing bombs,laying money, hacking items, causing chaos on a game people pay for, EDUCATIONAL!? Are you some sort of ****ed up Psychopathic retarded monkey!? I suggest you go outside and run yourself over with a lawnmower.

[shavomombetto]

notice i used quotes you *****, which means "sarcasm" but i guess your IQ is so low that you couldn't really distinguish that now could you?

[slick_soul]

actually many of those programs are originally made for "educational purposes" by the persons who made them, but not educational for those who abuse them. Look at many of the trainers that came from trinexx.com. Most of the trainers put there didn't even work online. Only a few really did because they had to keep messing with things to be able to make them work.

"Educational purposes" for the actual creator of the program.
"abusiveness" for the people who claim to use it but did not program it.


This is my opinion.
~Criminal X

[Neonight]

That guy's an idiot. You can't put a fdisk file in the IP file. *snort* DOS geek. *snort*


On a friend's account, it was earlier upgraded, but ran out sometime in April. He can still get on all of the servers. :S I thought it needed to be upgraded... Either way, it's back into trial mode if that matters.

[Neonight]

Originally posted by shavomombetto


Moonie, there's something called "Jurisdiction", even though these "hackers" (which they aren't, just using tools programers make for 'educational uses') are messing with the servers that are based in Europe, the Europeon police/attourney's cannot do anything to any AMERICAN trainer-user. Trainer-Users are not breaking the law, they are merely breaking the rules of the privacy agreement, and have no point in playing if they are to cause destruction and chaos. The only people who can be arrested/prosecuted, however, are people like Viper, who completely shut down the graal online server. Now that itself is illegal, but just putting explosions on a level because your bored, is not.

I was told this story once:

Two American people were in Germany for a while.
They had USA on the liscense plates.
The people were dodging Germans for one reason:
If you get hit by someone, you can sue them. Now Germany knows our Republican Form of Government (Republican form-Not Republican Government. We have a democracy... adyway) so they were trying to get hit by these Americans.

They got the USA taken off of their liscense plate and have had no trouble since.



Even if we DO do something illegal in another country, they can use our policies if they need to. I'm saying, if that so-called hacker Viper did what he "did" again and was caught, then Stefan and/or unixmad and/or Cyberjoueur could sue him.

Hacking is illegal in any form.
Using Game Trainers is NOT hacking, it is merely changing the client file. I liked Warcaptain's quote.... "Trainers are like tampons, every ***** needs them."

[Shorty2Dope]

Originally posted by shavomombetto
notice i used quotes you *****, which means "sarcasm" but i guess your IQ is so low that you couldn't really distinguish that now could you?

**** off *******. This is the internet. You can not tell when someone is being sarcastic unless they either say it or you know the person well enough. Maybe it is your ****ing IQ that is low. Last time I checked, mine was high above average.

Quotes do not mean sarcasm, "*****".

[Shorty2Dope]

Originally posted by slick_soul
actually many of those programs are originally made for "educational purposes" by the persons who made them, but not educational for those who abuse them. Look at many of the trainers that came from trinexx.com. Most of the trainers put there didn't even work online. Only a few really did because they had to keep messing with things to be able to make them work.

"Educational purposes" for the actual creator of the program.
"abusiveness" for the people who claim to use it but did not program it.


This is my opinion.
~Criminal X

umm no. The creator of most of the trainers (Pie) created the trainers so that *****s can hack with out having to know how to hack. He did not make them for educational purposes, Pie knows wtf he is doing and he knows how to program.

The whole "educational purposes" bullshit is just dumb. If it was for that reason they wouldn't release the stuff to the public, they would just learn off some one elses hard work then test or change things to create their own completely different software. Not use the same software with modifications.

[draygin]

Originally posted by Neonight


I was told this story once:

Two American people were in Germany for a while.
They had USA on the liscense plates.
The people were dodging Germans for one reason:
If you get hit by someone, you can sue them. Now Germany knows our Republican Form of Government (Republican form-Not Republican Government. We have a democracy... adyway) so they were trying to get hit by these Americans.

They got the USA taken off of their liscense plate and have had no trouble since.



Even if we DO do something illegal in another country, they can use our policies if they need to. I'm saying, if that so-called hacker Viper did what he "did" again and was caught, then Stefan and/or unixmad and/or Cyberjoueur could sue him.

Hacking is illegal in any form.
Using Game Trainers is NOT hacking, it is merely changing the client file. I liked Warcaptain's quote.... "Trainers are like tampons, every ***** needs them."

The plates used over seas for the US are red with white letters. Dont say usa or anything on them. In my experience in the 10 years I lived there I never had people jumping infront of cars. Although did run into a pick pocket and one time I was in the middle of a riot

[Andor_Admin1]

Originally posted by Neonight
That guy's an idiot. You can't put a fdisk file in the IP file. *snort* DOS geek. *snort*

Not to mention that the Graal Server runs on Linux.

[draygin]

Originally posted by Milkdude99
Ok we seem to have a problem with trial accounts, first off I thought hacking was pretty much out the window with this new etc etc

Also Moon God you might want to tell you're asst GM's how to IP bann people. I had one of them on G2k1 talking my arm off for over a half hour. He kept wanting to know if I was a gobal admin apparantly he kept missing my tag. I had to walk him through how to IP bann some one because he didnt know how and some one was hacking. I would think as a GM he should have already known how. *shrugs*

[fugitive316]

Originally posted by draygin


Also Moon God you might want to tell you're asst GM's how to IP bann people. I had one of them on G2k1 talking my arm off for over a half hour. He kept wanting to know if I was a gobal admin apparantly he kept missing my tag. I had to walk him through how to IP bann some one because he didnt know how and some one was hacking. I would think as a GM he should have already known how. *shrugs*

Talking your Arm off? haha I don't believe i've ever heard that before

[Milkdude99]

Originally posted by draygin


Also Moon God you might want to tell you're asst GM's how to IP bann people. I had one of them on G2k1 talking my arm off for over a half hour. He kept wanting to know if I was a gobal admin apparantly he kept missing my tag. I had to walk him through how to IP bann some one because he didnt know how and some one was hacking. I would think as a GM he should have already known how. *shrugs*

errrr you were fooled then I don't have any asst GMs only one Head Admin and she well knows how to ban only the GP Chief Sadie and Kia (Head Admin) Moon Goddess and I are allowed to server ban ....We take server banning very seriously and I do not want just anyone doing it ..If they hack we have a Ban level to hold them till an Admin gets on to Local ban them , otherwise they get jailed for minior violations.So I don't know who you talked to but they were not who they said they were. Almost all the High Staff on Npulse are adults in their 30's , this was not done on purpose it just happened that way , I had no idea we had so many adults on Npulse but we do... alot of GPs and other Staff seem to be also 19 on up... weird .. but anyway would be nice to know who you talked to since they lied to you in who they were and I fire people for lying to Admins even if the Admins are not from Npulse , it is stated in our rules to that effect...