Graal's economic system

xenow · #1 09-25-2010, 07:21 PM

It is very noticeable that this game will most likely die within 2 years maybe less, it is actually already dead in some way,
it also seems that many people complain about this fact because of the fun there was in the past with this game and can't simply let go.

I haven't seen all the old posts here on this forum so I don't know if this idea was already suggested or not.

It seems that the system of graal, the way of paying (not get paid) to play a game that is very based on the player base,
what else was to expect if players can't find anything of interest anymore in this game?

Money is something essential in life, consumers cant simply spend it to create a better game for yourself along with the community,
while the company is getting profit from it. It is good for the time it had, but it wont last forever.

It won't work with the future generation that is used to newer games like cod:mw2 and better mmo's,
at some point in life you can't afford to play a game like this anymore becouse it is just simply not worth it when everyone leaves since it is based on players.
The lower the players> (slower development) > The lower the fun > The lower the amount buyers(profit)

A new way to attract people to start with this game is to give them insight of what is possible,
for example starting a server. But not just that, also to motivate them to keep developing for it.

The only way to start that is for people to make a little profit for the time they spend. For example,
if you let the subscription system fall and create a way for players to make profit,
but also let the company have a percentage of the profit: 25% for example. and the rest (75%) gets split with a system to the staff depending on the server owners configuration.

You can even lower the risks by making people pay more if they fail to achieve a certain amount of money with the projects.

Don't forget that people can use this income to promote the game for a bigger user-base so that income gets higher from both sides.

This will also allow staff to take work on servers more seriously and might even bring some professionals to this game because there is profit from it.

If there is any thought of risk in this system, let people pay for the servers and start making the server free with the 25% after the 100$ are earned,
for example. So there will be a lower amount of low quality servers, abuse of this system will also be easy to detect.

Sorry for bad grammar, my english is not perfect.

But I hope most of you get the idea. We (playerbase) end up doing most the work anyway

MattKan · #2 09-25-2010, 08:24 PM

I'm 100% in favor of everything that was just said.

salesman · #3 09-25-2010, 08:51 PM

Server makes PWA-approved Gelat shop.
Players buy Gelats from GraalOnline.
Players spend Gelats in server's Gelat shop.
Server manager gets percentage of Gelats from sales.
Server manager distributes Gelats to staff (if he/she wants).
Gelats are cashed in for real money through GraalOnline.
Everybody wins.

One downside to this system would be servers opening shops to get as much out of it as quickly as possible without considering the effects of the shop on the server's gameplay. i.e. "I need money, let me sell this really overpowered weapon to make a quick buck...whoops, I killed the server!"

Another potential problem would be with already running servers. Would it be fair to let current classic managers make money off of other's work?

Jiroxys7 · #4 09-25-2010, 09:09 PM

IF something like this was to be put into place, it should only really affect servers that are hosted or higher. for the sake of fairness. UC server owners should never be punished for not cranking out a server within 6-12 months, or even longer for that matter. This way, UC wont hurt nor benefit you, and the benefits of having a hosted server or higher would be a good motivator.

However, i do personally think punishment via increased costs are a very bad thing to begin with. It would surely end up crashing a few server projects due to not being worth it for the person renting the server. (because not everyone has the same income, you know.)

Also, lets say one of our main servers fell short of developers and had a lot of trouble hiring new ones, either due to new hires being hard to come by, or the majority being simply lazy. Causing the server in question to be forced to shell out more cash, and if they still cant get themselves out of the rut, no one's able to pay the huge subscription costs, causing the server to be closed indefinitely. Unholy Nation, Zodiac, and Era are our top servers pretty much. if any of the three got caught up in a bad position, and couldnt afford it anymore, this could cause a large chunk of players to quit graal. even before your idea really picks up steam. and could, in turn, be devastating to graal.

Or a high-quality UC server is getting close to opening, but for whatever reason, development screeches to a halt. perhaps a large chunk of their dev team leaves or whatever reason, or they run into a huge roadblock in which they need to redo 90% of their scripts due to a 'bad script' with functions that most of the other systems rely on. They're stuck working on it for a long time, and if it's a very complicated issue (or more than one bad script), their subscription costs go up because theyre not currently attracting players, and eventually the costs swell too much and theyre forced to give up on the whole project.

They're worst-case scenarios, but the penalties would be server killers regardless.

Admins · #5 09-25-2010, 09:16 PM

The Graal population more than trippled in the past year

We plan to more change Graal PC into a system like with GraalOnline Classic on iPhone/iPod/iPad although this will not go over night. Some servers already have less restrictions for trial accounts but introduced more Gelat items.

Crono · #6 09-25-2010, 09:30 PM

stefan and co consider the iphone stuff to be part of "graal's population" which is funny but whatever.

there will be some change i just dont see the point tho

oo_jazz_oo · #7 09-25-2010, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crono

stefan and co consider the iphone stuff to be part of "graal's population" which is funny but whatever.

They are part of the population...they are still part of the graal family...

They are like...the mentally unstable cousin that you try to avoid at all costs.

fowlplay4 · #8 09-25-2010, 10:53 PM

Completely remove the ****ty observer mode system.

Enforce a 'Trial/Classic Playercount' limit on developing servers. This way you could have a certain of amount of Classic/Trial's log on and develop for the server without having to pay to develop. Obviously Hosted would up this cap as a benefit for wanting to reach that status. Classic/Gold status would completely remove this cap.

As for the payment thing.

I honestly doubt that there would be any payouts that would make it feel like developing a server was worth it anyway and unixmad would probably place ****ty rules on it as well being the greedy bastard that he is.

If you want to make money go make a App or get a job, I don't see Graal being anything more than a hobby platform to quickly prototype your multi-player ideas.

Demisis_P2P · #9 09-25-2010, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stefan

The Graal population more than trippled in the past year

We plan to more change Graal PC into a system like with GraalOnline Classic on iPhone/iPod/iPad although this will not go over night. Some servers already have less restrictions for trial accounts but introduced more Gelat items.

Cool. When do I get to play on the one server that accounts for 100% of that growth?

MattKan · #10 09-25-2010, 11:59 PM

I play/played iPhone, and I have to say that if you start charging for things on PC as much as often as things are charged for on iPhone, I may quit Graal. I'm sure other iPhone players agree with me on this. Hopefully this is not the path Graal will take.

Crono · #11 09-26-2010, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oo_jazz_oo

They are part of the population...they are still part of the graal family...

They are like...the mentally unstable cousin that you try to avoid at all costs.

they say nothing about the playercount on Graal aka "Graal PC" which is what this thread is about to begin with.

xenow · #12 09-26-2010, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiroxys7

IF something like this was to be put into place, it should only really affect servers that are hosted or higher. for the sake of fairness. UC server owners should never be punished for not cranking out a server within 6-12 months, or even longer for that matter. This way, UC wont hurt nor benefit you, and the benefits of having a hosted server or higher would be a good motivator.

However, i do personally think punishment via increased costs are a very bad thing to begin with. It would surely end up crashing a few server projects due to not being worth it for the person renting the server. (because not everyone has the same income, you know.)

Also, lets say one of our main servers fell short of developers and had a lot of trouble hiring new ones, either due to new hires being hard to come by, or the majority being simply lazy. Causing the server in question to be forced to shell out more cash, and if they still cant get themselves out of the rut, no one's able to pay the huge subscription costs, causing the server to be closed indefinitely. Unholy Nation, Zodiac, and Era are our top servers pretty much. if any of the three got caught up in a bad position, and couldnt afford it anymore, this could cause a large chunk of players to quit graal. even before your idea really picks up steam. and could, in turn, be devastating to graal.

Or a high-quality UC server is getting close to opening, but for whatever reason, development screeches to a halt. perhaps a large chunk of their dev team leaves or whatever reason, or they run into a huge roadblock in which they need to redo 90% of their scripts due to a 'bad script' with functions that most of the other systems rely on. They're stuck working on it for a long time, and if it's a very complicated issue (or more than one bad script), their subscription costs go up because theyre not currently attracting players, and eventually the costs swell too much and theyre forced to give up on the whole project.

They're worst-case scenarios, but the penalties would be server killers regardless.

Your not quite looking at the bigger picture, if there is money to be made there will be unexperienced people that make a server in 6-12 months to begin with.

Why would a large chunk of a dev team leave if they know they can get a % of the income from the server? They will work with joy since they find it fun and get $.
They will do their best to fix things as fast as possible for these reasons.
Also thinking about things that can go wrong, a 1 day longer wait is not quite the problem.

Also you are only looking at the negativity of what I'm trying to say,
you really have no idea how much people might pay for addicting things, mostly spoiled kids that spend 5x as much as a normal player.

You wonder why people are so hard to find for the job? Becouse they earn nothing from it. Time = Money, and fun will be less since the playerbase is getting lower and lower, feels like working for nothing.

Original content will bring the playerbase back up and give motivation for development,
the problem is that most original content leave graal because they think it is worth more for a project aside from graal.

You really think servers have to pull of a certain amount of money?
It wont be a problem if there are enough servers to begin with.

Huge subscription costs? only the people that are online give the real cost to the servers. If those people play on the servers and buy certain things for $, how do you think there will be loss that way?

For example, one likes just era alot and only wants to spend his money on that server since he only plays that one, and is willing to pay for exclusive functions on the server player housing for example.