Scamming

[Limelight Panda]

Scamming should be outlawed. There are many people out there who are with me that think, Scamming should get you banned temporarily, or maybe a jail for them to be in, and the item they scammed taken away.

It's just not right, that you get items you worked for taken away. Then we can't do anything. We should try to get it taken care of! Please people please, try to do something.

Post
YES
OR
NO

[Spark910]

YES

[Myomoto]

You can hardly be scammed if your using the tables so NO, if people get scammed it's their problem!

[Dehitay]

Scamming should be illegal
and if you look at Graal's Code of Conduct, I believe it is illegal

[Limelight Panda]

Originally posted by Myomoto
You can hardly be scammed if your using the tables so NO, if people get scammed it's their problem!

Oh, so its okay for "friends" to scam you? You probably don't feel the way most do, because you might not have anything of value. Or you have been ignored when you were scammed.

We have to do something, or this will be just get worse and worse. People leave because they get scammed, then wouldn't it be better if they could get their items back?

If someone scammed, they should be sent to something like a jail, and the item they scammed returned.

[Nidonemo]

I totally agree, I mean part of it is because of stupidity but most of it is just cruelty and greed. Since the human population isn't getting any smarter, let's go the other way.

[tc_topcat]

YES it should be illegal....it is horrible when people take advantage of newbies and scam them their diamonds =/

[HoudiniMan]

YES

but

It's unenforcable.

Anybody could "claim" somebody scammed or even have all their friends claim it with them. As it stands, the only way would be if a passing admin witnessed it.

[ZEROBEAT]

ummm, why shouldnt scamming be outlawed? doesnt scamming just ruin the game? x.x

[Sky]

YES! It should be! I got scammed twice already...

[skyler87]

Scamming should be outlawed, but it's much more difficult to do than you're making it seem. There would also have to be some kind of way to prove that you were scammed...how do you do that?

Person1: he r scammed my shield
Person2: no i didn't ;[

How do you take it any further than that?

[thesaiyan]

I can understand why some think scamming is 'legal' and the people that are scammed is their own faults.. I see that. But what most have to understand is, that some of those idiots actually pay USD for items on GK.. I'm not talking chump change either. They waste all that money for things on a game.. Gah, how stupid can you get?

[Sky]

Originally posted by HoudiniMan
YES

but

It's unenforcable.

Anybody could "claim" somebody scammed or even have all their friends claim it with them. As it stands, the only way would be if a passing admin witnessed it.

I think there should be some kind of staff people that look over trades and what not... like people PM them and ask them to watch there trades... :o

[Myomoto]

Originally posted by Limelight Panda


Oh, so its okay for "friends" to scam you? You probably don't feel the way most do, because you might not have anything of value. Or you have been ignored when you were scammed.

We have to do something, or this will be just get worse and worse. People leave because they get scammed, then wouldn't it be better if they could get their items back?

If someone scammed, they should be sent to something like a jail, and the item they scammed returned.

I havn't been scammed simply because I don't trust any of those *****s that go up and say "Yo!!! Is taht nagi blesed?!?" and then offers you difrent rings and weapons when you tell them it is blessed. And I don't feel sorry for those people who get scammed it's their own fault for not using the areas used for trading. And even if it were a "freind" who scammed you and a person you trusted, i don't really give a **** about it. Sorry.

[air_archmage]

I got scammed out of all my stuff. I got new items and 2 of my old ones back.. but I still didnt get my ID back :'(

[WanDaMan]

The tables are logged, so it will tell us who traded with whom and which weapon was traded.
I don't agree with this, eventhough alot of you hate it, it's apart of the game and you should be aware of it..

[air_archmage]

Scamming sould be illegal though!

[skyler87]

Originally posted by WanDaMan
The tables are logged, so it will tell us who traded with whom and which weapon was traded.

person1: he r scammed my shield ;[
person2: but he said i could have it!
person1: nuh uh i r said u could borrow

[Limelight Panda]

Originally posted by skyler87

person1: he r scammed my shield ;[
person2: but he said i could have it!
person1: nuh uh i r said u could borrow

Aren't pm's like logged?
So the person could pm us not to scam us or something, and we promise not to bear a false witness or something of that sort?

[WanDaMan]

You learned from your mistakes.. So what does it matter now, if you're dumb enough to get scammed twice though, lol x.x
Nothing really to say.. but if you got scammed, join the que.. everyone who plays gk has been scammed, but you have learned from it and have never been scammed again.. well if you have you're just dumb enough to fall for it again

[WanDaMan]

Originally posted by skyler87

person1: he r scammed my shield ;[
person2: but he said i could have it!
person1: nuh uh i r said u could borrow

don't let your friends hold any of your items, i wouldn't trust my brother with them let alone some one whom i have never met. if that has occurd, like it has with silent and bosh or ny (one of the two) well it's their fault for trusting him..

[skyler87]

Originally posted by WanDaMan

well it's their fault for trusting him..

But see, that's what they're trying to get outlawed...So there'd be no "it's your fault for trusting them" thing

[axman36]

I think it should in all the servers

[Monkeyboy_McGee]

Im not going to vote yes or no. There are a lot of things that shouldn't be the way they are, like PKers, and the kingdoms, and uh, the classes, and the spellcasting, and the bows, and the economy, and the etc, THINK ABOUT THE ETC, CHILDREN!!

I've never been scammed. I try not to try to get things that are very valuable, i dont see the point in wasting that much time and effort just for one item, and if i do get halfway "good" items like the ID i have, i don't trade them away. If i did tho, i wouldnt be *****ic enough to fall for a scam. But there are some people who don't have the knowledge and experience to avoid being scammed and so, it probably should get stopped. Will it ever get stopped? Not bloody likely.

[air_archmage]

KILIK SCAMMED JOHN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOW JOHN IS QUITING!!!!!!!!

[ZER0_H0UR]

I agree, you do learn form your mistakes, but that doesn't mean the mistake should not go without punishment, if it was done knowingly by the other person, the Scammer. The items should be returned, the the scammed should be left to lick their wounds.

I can't imagine being scammed by my "friends" I guess I either have superb choice in choosing who I trust, or I'm incredabley lucky, so I think scamming should be illegal, as I thought it was before, but appearantly that's not so :|

[Limelight Panda]

Originally posted by air_archmage
KILIK SCAMMED JOHN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOW JOHN IS QUITING!!!!!!!!

im mad now. I go away for 3 hours, and worse things happen to him ;.; ...

[thesaiyan]

Originally posted by Limelight Panda


Aren't pm's like logged?
So the person could pm us not to scam us or something, and we promise not to bear a false witness or something of that sort?

PM's are logged on the person's computer. Staff have no 100% way of knowing if they are real or not. And this 'promising' crap doesn't apply when you have 12 year olds running around thinking they are gods on the internet because they are '1337.' They'll just lie to get their way..

[Limelight Panda]

I think they are, thats why when people say their secrets, or some glitch they abuse they go like "get on aim, I think you wouldn't want to have this logged" ect.

[Dehitay]

when they tell you to go on AIM, it might be because they're polite enough to avoid using Graal client on stuff Stefan said not to use it for
for example, you're not allowed to discuss trading items for USD on Graal's client
but you can use AIM for it

[zell12]

Stefan has said it many times that scamming is legal. As long as a person does not abuse a bug or glitch to scam another persons items.

[Dehitay]

Stefan says few things
and to think he said something many times, makes me sure it wasn't about scamming

Here's what Graal Online's Rules of Conduct read

"Exchanging Items & 'Scamming'
Character-owned items, such as tools, houses, and bomy pets, may be auctioned or traded within Graal's auction or trading features. If, due to bugs in the system, there are discrepancies between the buyer/seller terms and the actual result, GraalOnline will make all reasonable attempts to rectify the situation.

Any exchange of materials outside GraalOnline secured exchange locations, falls under the term 'caveat emptor', or 'buyer beware.' In other words, GraalOnline will not be responsible for rectifying broken promises, incomplete trades, etc. in such a setting. If trading outside Graal 'sanctioned' trading locations, trade only with players you can trust.

This 'caveat emptor' approach does not mean Scamming is legal, only that it is difficult to prove. If Graal Police witness a scam directly they may punish the offending player. The best way to avoid being scammed is to only trade within secure trading facilities in Graal. "


The important part would be the last paragraph. Scamming is not legal, but the problem would be proving it

[zell12]

Ugh you are retarded. Stefan is exempt from the rules.

[Dehitay]

.....something makes me think Stefan has never scammed anybody and never would
his being exempt from the rule doesn't really matter

[skyler87]

PMs are not logged.

[Satrek2000]

Originally posted by Dehitay
If, due to bugs in the system, there are discrepancies between the buyer/seller terms and the actual result, GraalOnline will make all reasonable attempts to rectify the situation.

This 'caveat emptor' approach does not mean Scamming is legal, only that it is difficult to prove. If Graal Police witness a scam directly they may punish the offending player. The best way to avoid being scammed is to only trade within secure trading facilities in Graal. "

The important part would be the last paragraph. Scamming is not legal, but the problem would be proving it

What this means is this: if someone abuses a bug to scam, it's illegal and will be take care of. The rest is up to the participants, they have to take care of their own goods - i.e. use safetrade and trading tables. If you drop something, or give someone an item to 'try it out', it is basically your fault. As far as admins are concerned, you can always ask them to supervise a trade, which should be the overall safest method.

[Muha_builder]

As far as admins are concerned, you can always ask them to supervise a trade, which should be the overall safest method.

lol.

[lordbosh]

Yes

Ive been trying to fight scammers almost since my first day on kingdoms. I've earned a fairly good rep from it too I think. Its hard to fight something that isnt officially illegal though, players can only do so much against scammers. And if scammers are on peaceful, they cant be touched, and get away with anything usually. It makes me sick, frustrated, and makes me want to leave again.

[Satrek2000]

Originally posted by Muha_builder
lol.

Loriel himself offered such supervision at some point in the past.

[BLOODY-SWORD]

Scamming shouldent be punishable, its your fault for being scammed usually, shouldent have trusted peaple so much, and besides, this is a Role Playing Game, if you choose to be an honest farmer or warrior thats your choice, others may choose to be thieves, its their choise and thats what makes a game more like a real world, if u look at the real world, thieves and "scammers" are everywhere, i think you just have to learn who to trust, if you dont ever want to be scammed then you should just play single player games, why dont you just say that PKing you should be punishable too just cause you dont want to lose money or dont like to be killed =/.

Now to make some things clear cause usually peaple dont understand me well when i say things like the above.
I dont scam myself and wouldent like to be scammed (but i never get scammed beaucause i dont trust anybody) and when i say "you" im not talkign to anybody specific, "you" is anybody who got scammed or is ever complaining about being scammed.