Economy

[lTBSl]

We all talk about gangs, businesses and particularly cry about both of those systems, right? We also have players who complain about the economy. Instead of complaining why don't you put forth the effort to come up with a solution...Anyone with brain waves can complain about something, but it actually takes some sort of intelligence and problem solving to come up with a solution. So why don't we take this time to put Intelligent responses (I know its hard to do that) and put forth an effort to help the server and the staff team formulate a plan to fix the economy...Sad to say in 3-4 years the economy did quadruple, that is FACTS. Now the fact of the matter is we must work together and not against each other to formulate ideas on fixing this..

A RESET IS OUT OF THE QUESTION...IT CAN'T HAPPEN AND WILL NOT HAPPEN due to circumstances of the gralat shop...That does not mean it can't be fixed...but lets stop complaining and come up with solutions...

**My first suggestion would be to make an incentive to buy out of the shops..Guns, etc etc...Because lets be real, when you're buying from players and spending lets say 750,000 for a MP5 and buying it from the player, what are you doing? You are just circulating the money among the players and nothing is really coming out of the economy...On top of that I think there should be a fee that is paid by both players when completing a trade..No not something astronomical but like $50 or $100 dollars or it could be weighted on the items being traded.

**Second suggestion would be due to the increased popularity of betflipping make the tables cost more to use...if you go to the super high stakes room I believe it is and say :showmoney I believe it is to be some 19 million that was taken from table fees...Raise the table fees by a little and more money will come out of the economy.

**Third suggestion would be to tax businesses. If you actually see some of the gun businesses like Ammo Mart and Gun Point they make a hefty amount of money..I went and bought out Gun Point to see what it would cost and not even at full stock and I spent 40,000 on ammo alone..And if my numbers are not completely off Gun Point on a weekly basis easily makes 60k on a bad week and 100k+ on a good week.. Just yesterday their safe was at over 100k earnings....To my knowledge those businesses are no longer taxed on a sale...So say a box of ammo is 8 dollars they before would only get 6 of those 8 dollars. I don't think that is how it is anymore.

**Fourth Suggestion would be to create small islands that you would have to take a ferry too, these islands would have separate things on them. Mini games, unique quests, upscale housing, and what no..You would have to pay for the ferry and a one time access payment to the island.

These are just 4 of my ideas you can give me your feedback...Please don't flame any posts.

Nas Bloodvayne
-Era Player Relations and Levels Team

[Godzilla]

Release untradable guns that can only be bought from the store, teir3, 2 and 1, make those guns weigh nothing, I mean who wants to buy 5 untradable guns and be over-weight forever... (Maybe only release a select few, 5 to begin with then 1 every month or so)

I feel like the only way to take money out of the economy at this point would be solely novelty items/things.

Maybe scrap your idea of buying a "ferry" ticket to a novelty land but have items that act as novelty games, e.g the snake game, have rewards for the highest score per week e.g unlimited ammo box.

[bloodykiller]

Let's add prostitution and npc drug selling. Owning a pimping business wouldn't be bad.

[Scoper]

Originally Posted by lTBSl

A RESET IS OUT OF THE QUESTION...IT CAN'T HAPPEN AND WILL NOT HAPPEN due to circumstances of the gralat shop...That does not mean it can't be fixed...but lets stop complaining and come up with solutions...

Nas Bloodvayne
-Era Player Relations and Levels Team

The rest of the post was kind of more of the same, but what's up with this son? Who says that? Under what 'circumstances'?

People paid real money for gralat items. Cool.

1. Announce that after a certain date (give people plenty of time), potions will no longer be tradeable.
2. After this date, change the item names to 'antique ______ potion'
3. reset that day or close to it
4. post-reset, reintroduce normal potions that are buyable and tradeable. Old potions are still useable, just not tradeable.

There, now you can safely reset with potion preservation.

That being said, I think any major 'economic' restructuring would require a reset for optimal implementation. A lot of the methods people consider now just seem like pretty ways of punishing people for having more money than other people, or introducing useless items that nobody ends up buying anyway.

TK, those businesses you suggested aren't PKing. How could you?!

Edit: Of your four original ideas, They're all cool except the first one. If you impost a fee for trading, it's going to increase the amount of drop trade scamming for poor people looking to avoid those fees. If you make it so low that it's not noticeable, then you probably aren't doing much to the 'economy'

[Tim_Rocks]

Originally Posted by bloodykiller

Let's add prostitution and npc drug selling. Owning a pimping business wouldn't be bad.

I don't know about you guys, but I'm offended.

[shrimps]

There's always somebody to kill in the drug business.
Also as long as there's an "economy" there will always be people who are super rich or super poor, even if it's the best possible system, there will always be that gap, and the longer a server exists the further the gap will become. Seems that's what people hate, poor/rich, well then just get rid of the economy, make everything free, no working for anything and there wont be an economy problem.

[Fiberwyre_P2P]

Originally Posted by shrimps

There's always somebody to kill in the drug business.
Also as long as there's an "economy" there will always be people who are super rich or super poor, even if it's the best possible system, there will always be that gap, and the longer a server exists the further the gap will become. Seems that's what people hate, poor/rich, well then just get rid of the economy, make everything free, no working for anything and there wont be an economy problem.

You don't need to make everything free to get rid of an economy.
You could go the WoW route and make like 85% of stuff untradeable.
I think it works pretty well.

[Supaman771]

Originally Posted by Fiberwyre_P2P

You could go the WoW route and make like 85% of stuff untradeable.
I think it works pretty well.

I always liked making the items I created untradable. Finally getting an item and knowing you earned it (like mvp guns, or golden shovel, etc.) gives you a sense of accomplishment and lets everyone who see's you know; "Hey that guy was a 20 time MVP!".

I honestly don't see why all weapons and items aren't this way. All items are available at set prices, and the pawnshop was added to let you dispose of the ones you don't want anymore. Merchanting doesn't exactly work to the same extent as when guns were # of a kind and had unchecked value parameters... why not just rid away with it.

If someone wants a gun, they know they need to earn X amount and can go get it at Y location. If they're bored of a gun, they know they can pawn it back for Z amount toward another one.

Simple and precise. And overall less grunt work for staff to monitor these things.

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by lTBSl

We all talk about gangs, businesses and particularly cry about both of those systems, right? We also have players who complain about the economy. Instead of complaining why don't you put forth the effort to come up with a solution...

Let me just stop you right there. I have seen many, many ideas and solutions proposed towards fixing the economy. I have never seen any effort in to put them into place. Good that we both can agree that the economy has blown out of proportion and needs to be brought under control.

Originally Posted by lTBSl

My first suggestion would be to make an incentive to buy out of the shops..Guns, etc etc...Because lets be real, when you're buying from players and spending lets say 750,000 for a MP5 and buying it from the player, what are you doing? You are just circulating the money among the players and nothing is really coming out of the economy...On top of that I think there should be a fee that is paid by both players when completing a trade..No not something astronomical but like $50 or $100 dollars or it could be weighted on the items being traded.

I disagree. This would only work if guns were un-tradeable. Why? Well, you're only going to get a select few buying the first few guns and then people just buy them of them for less than the shop and eventually people stop buying form the shop. This just goes back to what you said about circulating the money among the players. Also to mention that you're just putting more and more of the best guns into the game and it becomes a lame fest.

Now how could we solve this problem? It's pretty simple actually. If you're going to release a gun.. Auction a few, you will get much more than you will form the shop and not only do you stop there... We introduce an item trade fee. So each time a player trades weapons they will always have to pay a fee. In the long term this will be a good sinkhole for money, it will stop a massive increase in good weapons being pumped into the server and with the circulation of money between players is still taking some of it back into the economy from fees.

Originally Posted by lTBSl

Second suggestion would be due to the increased popularity of betflipping make the tables cost more to use...if you go to the super high stakes room I believe it is and say :showmoney I believe it is to be some 19 million that was taken from table fees...Raise the table fees by a little and more money will come out of the economy.

I agree that fees are slightly to low but you need to be careful in increasing them as they can also put players of using them, decreasing the amount of times they are being used causing less money being taken out of the economy. I would also say that the NPC winning rate is slightly to high, it should come down to 60/40.

Originally Posted by lTBSl

Third suggestion would be to tax businesses. If you actually see some of the gun businesses like Ammo Mart and Gun Point they make a hefty amount of money..I went and bought out Gun Point to see what it would cost and not even at full stock and I spent 40,000 on ammo alone..And if my numbers are not completely off Gun Point on a weekly basis easily makes 60k on a bad week and 100k+ on a good week.. Just yesterday their safe was at over 100k earnings....To my knowledge those businesses are no longer taxed on a sale...So say a box of ammo is 8 dollars they before would only get 6 of those 8 dollars. I don't think that is how it is anymore.

Businesses should be taxed. Not sure why that was ever removed? It should be put back in place. I'm actually against businesses being player run but i also understand that players only play for that purpose and it can bring a lot of enjoyment to them. I wouldn't like to ruin that for them but they must understand some sanctions must be put in place to better the economy.

Originally Posted by lTBSl

Fourth Suggestion would be to create small islands that you would have to take a ferry too, these islands would have separate things on them. Mini games, unique quests, upscale housing, and what no..You would have to pay for the ferry and a one time access payment to the island.

Not digging this idea at all. Just because the economy is blowing out of proportion doesn't mean everyone's millionaires and i just can't see how this would work.


I see a lot of discussion going on about how we can tax this, change that and create new sinkholes. I think a lot of people is missing the point here. Why are we looking so hard to find a solution when the solution lies elsewhere.

Why are we not looking at how the money got here in the first place, what is pumping it in and how we can stop it? We need to fix the problem and then put the suggested ideas into place as security measures to keep a healthy economy.

Now let's look at what's pumping money consistently into the economy. Amount of money you get per kill. This is extremely to high. You should not get any money for killing anyone. You aren't killing and robbing, you're just killing. Stop giving people money for a kill. If you disagree then please reduce the amount you're giving. It's to much. You aren't taking into consideration of gang points. Gang point is $50/x1 point. Say i get $40 a kill + a gang point. There is nearly $100 on just one kill? I don't think people is taking this into consideration.

Gang points is another problem. $50 per gang point, come on? This is extremely to high. Do something about this and i guarantee you that the money being pumped out their will decrease.

Like i said before. Not everybody is suppose to be rich and not everybody is suppose to be poor. It's how life works. The rich will try get richer and the poor will be trying to get rich.

It's better this way, it might sound harsh but it works better.

It's not a master plan on fixing the economy it's simple steps that could be taken could make the whole difference. You can't fix the enconomy overnight, that's impossible but with a few simple measures put in place then things will gradually get better.

Summary:

Auction new released weapons/items/w.e. Get the most possible you can for it. (You will get far more than you ever will putting it into shops) Also stops the amount of items being in the server.

Introduce an item trade and item lend fee.

Tax businesses

You could increase bet flipping fees but like i said be careful.

Change rate on NPC tables to 60/40 so more people play them.

Remove giving people money for a kill or reduce it to a few dollars.

Remove or reduce the amount of money given for gang points.

Also do more auctions.. Auctions need to happen a lot more often, it will keep taking money from the economy.

And then finally when money isn't always being pumped in to easy, you can start to focus on buffing making money systems that players always complained about, because you can afford to.

[TheLinkMan2002]

This debate is stupid, there is nothing wrong with the economy. As is there is little to no trading going on, and there is absolutely no reason to try to reduce the money around. Simple solution is more auctions. That is literally all you need. The only reason it seems like people have too much money is because of betflipping and our low player count. If there was so much money going around then guns wouldn't be selling for 100k over pawn price like most are now. And honestly most of that pk earned money goes to ammo/lightweight potions and skins for some people, it's really not alot with the state the server is in. Unless you pk all day (which i don't see even possible since no one even pks 80% of the time) You aren't making much of a net gain every day. BH PK is the only real issue when it comes to the money spawning..

[TheLinkMan2002]

Also the point of the pk money was so that people could make money by actually playing the game rather than spend every day in the mines. It's perfect the way it is. Someone who earned 10k pking in a day (if u exclude bh pk) would have easily made way more than that by mining the whole time.

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by TheLinkMan2002

This debate is stupid, there is nothing wrong with the economy. As is there is little to no trading going on, and there is absolutely no reason to try to reduce the money around. Simple solution is more auctions. That is literally all you need. The only reason it seems like people have too much money is because of betflipping and our low player count. If there was so much money going around then guns wouldn't be selling for 100k over pawn price like most are now. And honestly most of that pk earned money goes to ammo/lightweight potions and skins for some people, it's really not alot with the state the server is in. Unless you pk all day (which i don't see even possible since no one even pks 80% of the time) You aren't making much of a net gain every day. BH PK is the only real issue when it comes to the money spawning..

It's certainly not stupid, it's one of the most important things on era, period. We are faced with Hyper-inflation the way things are going. Your items will become useless as they won't have any real value.

Why do you think their is less trading going on? Because of this. Don't you get it? Everybody already has everything now because of the massive increase in money. Auctions aren't a simple solution. How can you rely on simply just auctions, are you crazy?

Betflipping actually takes money out of the economy, it doesn't put any in? It just moves money from one player to another while collecting fees from players every time they play the table. Betflipping is not an issue at all...

I can raid for half hour to an hour and have a few thousand $ from kills and that's not including the gang points at $50 a touch to.

Also the point of the pk money was so that people could make money by actually playing the game rather than spend every day in the mines. It's perfect the way it is. Someone who earned 10k pking in a day (if u exclude bh pk) would have easily made way more than that by mining the whole time.

10k a day? I could make 10k an hour and if gang ULMS was hosted, theres another 10k and then if bhpk was hosted theres another 10k/15k.

You got no idea how much money is being pumped into the economy.. All those 10ks add up.

It's not even funny how rich i could get if i could save. I spent over 20million in the casino, that just says it all.

Also look at Wils profile, you will see he has around 10k points. That's what, 500k? And he got those points in no time and he's barely even active.

[shrimps]

I thought the money from kills in ULMS was disabled?

[Kohola_KinG]

Originally Posted by shrimps

I thought the money from kills in ULMS was disabled?

No idea, nobody is talking about ULMS. I was talking about Gang ULMS.

[shrimps]

Oh Gang ULMS, my bad.