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  #1  
Old 12-30-2003, 07:38 AM
Amagius Amagius is offline
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The point of Graal?

What is the point of Graal Kingdom? Can anyone explain why it is so strenuous trying to discover this answer? Graal Kingdoms is in a state of psychosis, giving off the aura of blandness. I don’t want to consider yelling that Role-playing needs to revived, as it has been overstated.

It’s become a world where items dictate our time, and I, for one, believe that this is the only part of Graal that keeps people coming and is sad. What are we aiming for in this game? It’s a rat race with no ending, and I believe we need something more. Some people seem blind to the fact that, at this rate, we’ll just be playing to see one more point of damage on that sword. Most saddening is the fact that it’ll become saturated. Soon enough, people will have that armor they needed, and our point of playing will dwindle to an extremely low level. We will just have monsters.

It would be enjoyable if we had something more than static characters leading our quests, static monsters being killed, and nothing other than digging for dungeons. I really believe we should have a continuing storyline with people working on it at a large portion of time. I would love to help in writing development, but this is just for the air. Static airs are a main portion of what is detracting, I think. Activeness is needed, and that is why role-players cry. Role-playing is about activeness, and that’s what is hurting. Yes, the role-playing factor is important, but the vaguer subject of activeness should be addressed first.

I’m sure this has become a deprecated subject, to announce ideas for Graal Kingdoms, but how long does it take for someone to hear the words of plenty? It's just become a game to crave over having platinum, and having more event items than your brothers. In Stefan's signature, it has "*wind of change*." Stefan, please use your "winds of change" and help this.
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Old 12-30-2003, 12:36 PM
Satrek2000 Satrek2000 is offline
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Kingdoms is about roleplaying. It's as easy as that. The whole thing gets messed up if you add players to it. Some don't feel like roleplaying, some don't know how to do it. And while a portion does, those who don't usually get the publicity - scammers and pkers. Items won't make you rp, admins won't make you rp, the system won't make you rp. You have to want it by yourself, and you can encourage others.
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Old 12-30-2003, 12:53 PM
GoZelda GoZelda is offline
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rawr 1337 pwnage is da purpsoe fof gRal!
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Old 12-30-2003, 03:15 PM
Amagius Amagius is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Satrek2000
Kingdoms is about roleplaying. It's as easy as that. The whole thing gets messed up if you add players to it. Some don't feel like roleplaying, some don't know how to do it. And while a portion does, those who don't usually get the publicity - scammers and pkers. Items won't make you rp, admins won't make you rp, the system won't make you rp. You have to want it by yourself, and you can encourage others.
You make a strong statement, but you said it yourself. “The whole thing gets messed up if you add players to it;” that should not be so, and your treading on the aged subject that is not at fault. You can blame it on everyone there, but it’s just not that easy to patent that thought.

See, Graal Kingdoms is made as a materialistic world, and is viewed as such. When you ask us to RP on it, we need the system to work with us, because it makes the exhilaration to play; and with the things that have been brought to Graal Kingdoms are features that will NOT be used because it takes more time than it is necessary. Some people may not want to Role-play, but you cannot place that as the twisting fate of Role-playing’s downfall.

It’s been made easier to just go around doing the things this server bountifully provides: killing monsters. Graal 2001 was light-hearted and was easy to role-play in. Diplomacy ruled its sovereign gates. Why? Graal Kingdoms is not fun without using this power we’ve worked hours to gain, and everyone ha different stats.

Another brooding problem is the fact that classes aren’t here anymore. You can make yourself to be 20/20/20/20/20/20…so that it doesn’t matter. The walls of classes have been brought down, leaving us with “what books can we start off with.” We would have more of a united server, if partying was needed for a lot more than just a Lord, but since everyone has Piety, Melee scrolls, and Woodlore, you don’t need to party. You heal yourself, attack the monster, and ID your items.

You can put idealistic things like, “We just need the role-players to get together,” but you can’t blame it for everything.
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Old 12-30-2003, 06:22 PM
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Yes, it's very easy to just say "we need the roleplayers to roleplay" and say that'll fix everything, but it won't.

No amount of roleplaying will fix a system that is broken, or hide that fact from everyone involved.

There is a small storyline that is involved with GK, but not one that is very in depth. I know not the history of the Crescent Pirates, the struggles of the Zormite Republic, the greatness of the Dustari, the honor of the Samurai, nor the grace of the Forest peoples. These are things I would love to know about, but find very little of that information in the world.

The kingdom islands have very little use to the game besides for areas to have player housing. The mines in the kingdoms don't work, so there's no reason to really stick around except for some minor inner-kingdom roleplaying/goofing off, working on your player house, searching player 'shops', and using some of the NPC shops for food, manufacturable equipment, etc.

Anyway, I'd say bring some more use to player kingdoms. Perhaps dungeons for them as well that tie into the Kingdom's storyline. A special, holy eyepatch for the pirates, or a fine elven bow in the forest kingdom. Something along those lines. Also, having themed monsters in those areas, so they are different and unique.

The lore for this game is heavily lacking. Lore meaning, ingame fiction, stories, papers and such that tell the history of things, etc.

For example, a young man is in his room depressed. You're sent to speak with him, and he tells you how something came into his room and ate his homework, but no one believed him! He failed his assignment, but was told if he could make up the missing pages he would receiving a passing grade. He says the creature that entered his room ran northbound after it ate his homework. When you find the beast in a dungeon, and slay it, you find some chewed up homework. The homework is readable, and has some story about the history of graal. Part of that story has something to do with a legend, and it gives some clues about how to go about doing that. Returning the papers to the boy gives you some type of reward, whether monetary, equipment-wise, or perhaps information towards another quest.

I've mentioned it before, but I think the Kingdoms themselves need to have a bigger role. I think that a capture the flag type system would be great. Something where a region can be 'occupied' by enemies, and you have to capture and hold your own territories. Holding territories gives you bonuses. These territories don't have to be part of the existing continents, but actual separate maps that portals on kingdom islands send you to. There you are supposed to defend/capture areas, creating the need for 'raiding parties' and such. Specific NPC's could be located there, quests or dungeons related to it, and even NPC guards and defenses for when your group is not there to defend.

I think it would be great for some increased activity from the Gods as well. Perhaps have a week where the Gods take mortal form and walk amongst the mortals. During this week they go to war with their enemies, hordes of their minions walk the earth and cause mass chaos, or they give out special quests during that week where their followers can be rewarded for dedication and piety.

I also agree about the classless class system that is in place. Skill based systems are great, but there still needs to be restrictions. When you allow players to take on every role they wish, and have no restrictions based on choices, you have no need to depend on others while you play the game. So basicly, all the rest of the players are either your chatting buddies or your enemies when pk'ing. We have some people who auction off items they pick up, but big deal there. That's only the excess, which they use to increase their already existing wealth.

By having classes restricted in what they can learn, and what they are able to do, there becomes an inter-dependency with players. People who focus on mining would become the primary sources for the items that come from there. Although, those aren't the only sources as you can also get some of those items by killing bomy's and such. It's just much more plentiful to mine it, but you have to focus on mining (and crafting) to be any good at it.

I also think that equipment durability would lessen the situation where people get all the greatest equipment and then only work to kill monsters, other players, or get bored, etc. If there was item durability, players who focus on crafting would become much more useful, as they could repair this damaged equipment. Also, if players do not take care of their items, they can be at risk of destroying them, forcing them to find or quest for the item again.

Also, players shouldn't be able to raise their stats all the way to 20 in each sector. Either they need to have their access to the potions limited, or there needs to be class limits which can only be surpassed by use of equipment that is enchanted with stat bonuses.

I hope anything I've mentioned was helpful.
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  #6  
Old 12-30-2003, 07:01 PM
Amagius Amagius is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by narkotic
Yes, it's very easy to just say "we need the roleplayers to roleplay" and say that'll fix everything, but it won't.

No amount of roleplaying will fix a system that is broken, or hide that fact from everyone involved.

There is a small storyline that is involved with GK, but not one that is very in depth. I know not the history of the Crescent Pirates, the struggles of the Zormite Republic, the greatness of the Dustari, the honor of the Samurai, nor the grace of the Forest peoples. These are things I would love to know about, but find very little of that information in the world.

The kingdom islands have very little use to the game besides for areas to have player housing. The mines in the kingdoms don't work, so there's no reason to really stick around except for some minor inner-kingdom roleplaying/goofing off, working on your player house, searching player 'shops', and using some of the NPC shops for food, manufacturable equipment, etc.

Anyway, I'd say bring some more use to player kingdoms. Perhaps dungeons for them as well that tie into the Kingdom's storyline. A special, holy eyepatch for the pirates, or a fine elven bow in the forest kingdom. Something along those lines. Also, having themed monsters in those areas, so they are different and unique.

The lore for this game is heavily lacking. Lore meaning, ingame fiction, stories, papers and such that tell the history of things, etc.

For example, a young man is in his room depressed. You're sent to speak with him, and he tells you how something came into his room and ate his homework, but no one believed him! He failed his assignment, but was told if he could make up the missing pages he would receiving a passing grade. He says the creature that entered his room ran northbound after it ate his homework. When you find the beast in a dungeon, and slay it, you find some chewed up homework. The homework is readable, and has some story about the history of graal. Part of that story has something to do with a legend, and it gives some clues about how to go about doing that. Returning the papers to the boy gives you some type of reward, whether monetary, equipment-wise, or perhaps information towards another quest.

I've mentioned it before, but I think the Kingdoms themselves need to have a bigger role. I think that a capture the flag type system would be great. Something where a region can be 'occupied' by enemies, and you have to capture and hold your own territories. Holding territories gives you bonuses. These territories don't have to be part of the existing continents, but actual separate maps that portals on kingdom islands send you to. There you are supposed to defend/capture areas, creating the need for 'raiding parties' and such. Specific NPC's could be located there, quests or dungeons related to it, and even NPC guards and defenses for when your group is not there to defend.

I think it would be great for some increased activity from the Gods as well. Perhaps have a week where the Gods take mortal form and walk amongst the mortals. During this week they go to war with their enemies, hordes of their minions walk the earth and cause mass chaos, or they give out special quests during that week where their followers can be rewarded for dedication and piety.

I also agree about the classless class system that is in place. Skill based systems are great, but there still needs to be restrictions. When you allow players to take on every role they wish, and have no restrictions based on choices, you have no need to depend on others while you play the game. So basicly, all the rest of the players are either your chatting buddies or your enemies when pk'ing. We have some people who auction off items they pick up, but big deal there. That's only the excess, which they use to increase their already existing wealth.

By having classes restricted in what they can learn, and what they are able to do, there becomes an inter-dependency with players. People who focus on mining would become the primary sources for the items that come from there. Although, those aren't the only sources as you can also get some of those items by killing bomy's and such. It's just much more plentiful to mine it, but you have to focus on mining (and crafting) to be any good at it.

I also think that equipment durability would lessen the situation where people get all the greatest equipment and then only work to kill monsters, other players, or get bored, etc. If there was item durability, players who focus on crafting would become much more useful, as they could repair this damaged equipment. Also, if players do not take care of their items, they can be at risk of destroying them, forcing them to find or quest for the item again.

Also, players shouldn't be able to raise their stats all the way to 20 in each sector. Either they need to have their access to the potions limited, or there needs to be class limits which can only be surpassed by use of equipment that is enchanted with stat bonuses.

I hope anything I've mentioned was helpful.
Agreed. Also, Mailboxes are great ideas, but finding houses and traveling to someone's house is more time-consuming than waiting for them to come on-line, so pratically no one does. Has ANYONE sent more than two letters?
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Old 12-30-2003, 08:48 PM
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If Graal Kingdoms is spose to be a MMORPG,right? It is suppose to have this, and I have been complaining about this for ages to Stefan in PM.

We need a REAL story, every month there should be a big event, where a ((ex. a gigantic bomy and spaceships land in bomy area, and they attack everyone, and you gotta kill them all, etc))

So it follows along, and maybe we can have a very important NPC human, that get's captured, maybe the mayor of harmonia.
Then next month you get the chance to save the mayor, but only once, and if the world fails, he dies.
This would also take alot of people to help do it.
Not a 1 person quest.
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Old 12-30-2003, 09:20 PM
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Aye, you're thinking of global events that dynamically impact the world. Those are very cool, but often require quite a bit of scripting in order to accomplish. It also requires a team of content creators, who'd basically be doing it full-time. I'm unaware who is involved with Graal Kingdom's specifically, since I haven't been here for very long, but I have been involved with games in the past and played pretty much every MMO actively in the market.

The monthly update (done perfectly by Asheron's Call), which continues the evolving storyline for the game is pretty much a must for something to be considered a serious mmorpg. This would bring a lot more support and involvement from the player base, and more than likely bring a whole slew of new players who are drawn like moths to a flame to this new storyline.

Of course, something like this takes a lot of time and effort, and there would be paying players who would not be pleased with how things go. So, it would be a decision to be made by the creators and maintainers of this particular game world.

I think there's still a helluva lot of potential with Graal. The fact that it's played by a wide range of player ages is one thing that makes it interesting. Anything suggested or included should go with that spirit.
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Old 12-31-2003, 11:31 AM
MasterNuke MasterNuke is offline
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Yea... someone kicked the bucket of Graal beans and spilled them all over the floor...

This is my story...

The point of Graal as I remembered it... Graal was an adventure game... a fun one where you hung out with friends... went out and did whackey quests that sometimes made no sense... and later grew into a larger community of players who added on to that adventure...

The day that the fun waned was the release of Graal2001... which started the begining of people endlessly working instead of doing whackey adventures... face it... you hated hammering that stupid durby with that wooden hammer... I turned back to playerworlds...

The day that Graal2002Alpha came out... everyone was like ooo... ahhh... ohhh... it seemed like this would be a new horizon... a new change to look forward to. I got on, got a bunch of cool stuff in less than a day. For such a long time everyone waited for the adventures... it didn't come for months...

When it did come... I was shocked... an RPG system? O.o this is new... so I played... and adventured, farther than most... after the Underground dungeon.... the adventures stopped coming... and the fun slowly turned to boring and tedious work...

Graal Kingdoms is the shame of Graal history... to think we paid for this...

Is it possible to fix this? Here's a few ideas...
1. Junk the mudlib... go back to the old way... it was funner and simpler... (quote this if you want reasons why)
2. With the obnoxious and complicated mudlib out of the way... It should be easier to make things... less numbers and complicated function calls to fiddle with, less bugs/exploits too... dump loads of content into the game... make it an adventure again... don't forget the whackyness
3. Fun > Work... if someone has to work for something, keep it out... this is a game... no one wants to work in a game...
4. Separate the main game qualitys from the optional side qualitys... main part is the adventure... the fact that theres Kingdoms is a setting, not a requirement. If someone wants to RP... they can go fun with that on the side...
5. There is no #5... (quote this if you want me to rant more ideas)
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Old 12-31-2003, 11:47 AM
MarkB MarkB is offline
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I remember when Graal used to be fun...like really fun. Back when I was in like 8th grade, I couldnt wait to get home and play it. Now it is like the opposite.

I am not saying that I loathe graal or anything, and I am not trying to be one of those people that say things like "omg i hate graal" and do nothing but negatively criticize it. All I am saying is that what used to be there, is gone, and it would be very hard to surface it.

Kingdoms is screwed. Me and Stefan have talked about this over and over again. I think kingdoms should be reset...Random Alchemy destroyed everything...it really did. The point of the Alpha server was to test things, and then later be reset. It never was. It was converted directly to the main server. What was the point of the alpha server?

The way kingdoms should be...is where people have to actually work to get what they have...I remember when farming was something you did because you had to. Now no one farms or mines. I mean, honestly, Ed, when was the last time you saw anyone with extensive hours actually mining? Never. No one does it anymore. And with the random alchemy, no one wears gold armor or anything that was intended to be worn.

RPing is in a state of chaos. People are in kingdoms...only to be ignorant. I mean, for christ's sake, CP is allowing people to enter knowing they are known scammers. People like that shouldnt even be allowed in kingdoms. Kingdoms should be something that you need. As in, you need the kingdom, not the kingdom needs you. Trading, Crafting, Leveling, should be centered around the kingdoms.

Kingdom leaders need replaced. Not all of them. Some of them. Samurai needs to be renamed from KJ to Samurai, and it needs a new leader. Samurai has had more names than <insert something here>. Some kingdoms are doing well though. Zormite and Dustari are doing fairly well. Forest is dead, CP is corrupt as hell, and KJ only wants members, no RPing. I think Stefan and Unixmad need to take a week or something and reshape kingdoms, do a reset, re-elect the mentioned kingdom leaders, remove old alchemy stuff, and make the game fun again.

Classes are in bad shape. Who do you know that is a thief? No one. It is barb all the way with most people. They can learn all the skills fairly easily(with the rarety of plat). So of course most people are going to be barbs. Sorcerors should only be able magic, and no melee, Priests--->Prayers/Praying, and Thieving needs fixed. That would make the classes more balanced. The spell damage needs brought back as well. People complained about it and now the damage from spells is weak...very weak. I cannot even hold an event on kindoms for sorcerors because they are in the ring doing no damage to each other.

What do you think the most common area leveled is? The physical area, because it is the easiest to gain exp.

More updates and things to do need to be added to kindoms. Not just events, but things new players can benefit from. Most events are centered around the players that have played for quite some time.

Those are some of my suggestions.
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I am tired to wake up the morning to see the forum going each day worst and worst because of a few people trying to ruin this forums. If you don't play any more Graal neither like the managment then what are you doing there ? I will not let anyone ruin the friendship of the community, we are there to have fun and not to have stress ! If you have bad energy to spend against something, then take a punching ball. This is the Third time i warn to not continue this way, so the next step will be to put out of the community trouble makers. -Unixmad

My point of view is your tooth are not big enough to hit me because if it were you will have eaten me since a while. Personaly i will never eat you because it will really taste bad. -Unixmad
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Old 12-31-2003, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GTXOO
If Graal Kingdoms is spose to be a MMORPG,right? It is suppose to have this, and I have been complaining about this for ages to Stefan in PM.

We need a REAL story, every month there should be a big event, where a ((ex. a gigantic bomy and spaceships land in bomy area, and they attack everyone, and you gotta kill them all, etc))

So it follows along, and maybe we can have a very important NPC human, that get's captured, maybe the mayor of harmonia.
Then next month you get the chance to save the mayor, but only once, and if the world fails, he dies.
This would also take alot of people to help do it.
Not a 1 person quest.
Yes, [MMORPG Reference Removed -L] has events every month, balls with roleplaying and formal clothes, big events like a goddess spreading plagues upon the world, or things like that.
It also has churches, churches is what keeps the roleplaying going, with priestesses who get power, and the unique class system, and the events, all that keeps it going.
Churches, events, and things like that are good for roleplaying.

I agree with mark, a reset is needed. And a few changes too, and the old farming system, i mean where you dug up corn seeds, not corn. perhaps a more unique level system, where one can advance in classes, and more skills too. Also, again i say that more things with priests and churches should be done, with an advanced class system a priest could become a very well trained one, and run a church and people come there to get healed of diseases, to get married, and perhaps have sermons and such.

Last edited by Lance; 01-01-2004 at 10:09 PM..
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Old 01-01-2004, 01:35 PM
Borgie Borgie is offline
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I agree with the mmorpg stuff...
but im against reset and im sure stefan will not reset GK just because too many people would be hell of pissed and quit...
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Old 01-01-2004, 04:08 PM
Satrek2000 Satrek2000 is offline
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Also, a reset would not help - the system wouldn't be changed, people who don't want to rp won't due to a reset, and those who rp will feel punished for those who didn't.
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*Stefan: is it ok when i leave?
*Stefan: i guess unixmad will not hack the cisco config tonight anymore
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Old 01-01-2004, 05:08 PM
GoZelda GoZelda is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Satrek2000
Also, a reset would not help - the system wouldn't be changed, people who don't want to rp won't due to a reset, and those who rp will feel punished for those who didn't.
Exactly. What's very sad, though, is that staff doesn't RP neither. Stefan gets on, gets on tag
Captain *Stefan (Crescent Pirates).
Also, if anything new is released, there is nearly never a RP story behind it, except when it is made by players (like NightHawks).
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Old 01-01-2004, 08:31 PM
MasterNuke MasterNuke is offline
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Originally posted by GoZelda

Exactly. What's very sad, though, is that staff doesn't RP neither. Stefan gets on, gets on tag
Captain *Stefan (Crescent Pirates).
Also, if anything new is released, there is nearly never a RP story behind it, except when it is made by players (like NightHawks).
Stefan is a coder... not a story writer... I stopped expecting a decent RP story from him a while ago...
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Old 01-01-2004, 08:39 PM
GoZelda GoZelda is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by MasterNuke


Stefan is a coder... not a story writer... I stopped expecting a decent RP story from him a while ago...
He can ask for a story, at least.
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