Little things that make you want to rant.

[Drakeero]

LITTLE things. Not big things like no updates. Little itty bitty things that make you irritable and grouchy about GK.

I'll start:

Zormite's slow as hell ferry. Try missing it about 7 times because someone comes into your room and demands your attention to talk with them while the ferry cruises by and leaves again.

[Sky]

Hrm. The fact that you can be anything. Classes don't mean jack ****. Quite annoying. >.>

[Tigairius]

Originally Posted by Drakeero

LITTLE things. Not big things like no updates. Little itty bitty things that make you irritable and grouchy about GK.

Sam

[Sky]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

Sam

co-sign ^

[Deas_Voice]

Originally Posted by Tigairius

Sam

err sam?

[kia345]

Massive tile errors and crappy levels on the main island.

Originally Posted by Sky

Hrm. The fact that you can be anything. Classes don't mean jack ****. Quite annoying. >.>

I like this. You start very limited and have to work your way towards being able to have epic prayers as a barbarian, and mastering archery as a wizard.

[Drakeero]

I don't think the class system or Sam count as "small" but alright.

[Stephen]

People whining about how crappy stuff is, but when given the opportunity, prefer to sit on their duff and complain.

[kia345]

People who don't see complaining as helpful. Not everyone can contribute dev-wise, but anyone can say "this sucks, and this is how it should be done".

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by kia345

People who don't see complaining as helpful. Not everyone can contribute dev-wise, but anyone can say "this sucks, and this is how it should be done".

Sure, they could - but they don't. You'll only hear people saying, "That sucks!", "That's stupid", "We should have more monsters", "We should have more dungeons!"

They don't even begin to imagine what the new dungeon would look like so they could describe it - asking them to consider exactly what sucks so that it may be improved is a far stretch from impossible with the majority of them. So yea, complaining is useless and so is every single person who would rather pay their money to belly ache when they could instead get involved and make a difference.

I mean, if you want I can probably give you about 3 threads full of examples... And worse yet when I try to broaden the audience the example remains consistent - people would rather complain, or even worse - doubt monger.

There's no helping the majority of the problems on this game because they're mostly people looking for something to complain about.

[cbk1994]

Players have a right to complain. They paid to play the game, and it sucks.

It's not the job of the buyer to suggest what should be done.

[kia345]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Players have a right to complain. They paid to play the game, and it sucks.

It's not the job of the buyer to suggest what should be done.

^this

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Players have a right to complain. They paid to play the game, and it sucks.

It's not the job of the buyer to suggest what should be done.

You're absolutely right; however I think it's time you pinch yourself and wipe the sleepy dust out of your eyes - it's time for a reality check.

This game is not yet successful enough to maintain any professional standards, and I can say, despite how saddening it is, that I need not provide any example for this point.

It is now our responsibility to develop and maintain the content of this game. The majority of us are very interested in developing for Graal to begin with, so the extra responsibility is very little to ask. This is also why I am trying to introduce new players to educational developing content... so that they may also step up to the plate.

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Stephen

You're absolutely right; however I think it's time you pinch yourself and wipe the sleepy dust out of your eyes - it's time for a reality check.

This game is not yet successful enough to maintain any professional standards, and I can say, despite how saddening it is, that I need not provide any example for this point.

It is now our responsibility to develop and maintain the content of this game. The majority of us are very interested in developing for Graal to begin with, so the extra responsibility is very little to ask. This is also why I am trying to introduce new players to educational developing content... so that they may also step up to the plate.

Yes, I agree. I'm to the point where I'm not even going to bother trying to help; I refuse to upgrade my account to "gold" to develop for GK (and, it seems, the administration aren't hiring anyone anyway)

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Yes, I agree. I'm to the point where I'm not even going to bother trying to help; I refuse to upgrade my account to "gold" to develop for GK (and, it seems, the administration aren't hiring anyone anyway)

This strikes me as spiteful - and while I'm personally indifferent - it's entirely ineffective in changing the situation we're in. What our communal work would eventually lead to, if organized realistically, is a higher quality of game - making for more income. I'm hopeful that this would eventually lead to a more professional game and a healthier environment as a whole.

I think it's time we put on our big-boys shoes and try to get something done for the community, ignoring our own petty problems and differences.

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Stephen

This strikes me as spiteful

Perhaps; yet I refuse to pay for a gold subscription just for me to develop for a "flagship" server.

And it does seem that the staff aren't looking for help (referring to Bjorn and Stefan).

[xXziroXx]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Yes, I agree. I'm to the point where I'm not even going to bother trying to help; I refuse to upgrade my account to "gold" to develop for GK (and, it seems, the administration aren't hiring anyone anyway)

First off, the way it works, is that you PM Stefan or Björn saying you're interested to help out. If you're good enough, you'll be hired within 24 hours most likely.

And, you just need a Classic account, since that's all that's needed to logon Kingdoms Dev. I know, I've "worked" there.

[kia345]

So to put it in less terms, Stephen fully supports paying Unix money to help him make even more.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by kia345

So to put it in less terms, Stephen fully supports paying Unix money to help him make even more.

Well, that's a poor way to put it - I think the majority of us would continue to pay our money anyways and ignore how it benefits Unixmad or anyone else.

What I really think is that, with the above belief, we should focus our concerns as a group so that we might more effectively solve them and improve the entire game quality in the progress. I would love a excellent game to play and I won't hesitate at the opportunity to make one - not only so that I might enjoy it but so many others can enjoy it as well.

I find it seems to be a theme for you to antagonize me and others as of recent, I don't really know what effect you're hoping to achieve but it's been counter productive up to this point and it would be greatly appreciated if you stopped.

[kia345]

Originally Posted by Stephen

I find it seems to be a theme for you to antagonize me and others as of recent, I don't really know what effect you're hoping to achieve but it's been counter productive up to this point and it would be greatly appreciated if you stopped.

I attack everyone on rotating schedule, every other month being an adminstration member, and every other day being a forum mod

[Ravenblade1979]

yeah instead of complaining ...help out.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Ravenblade1979

yeah instead of complaining ...help out.

Ravenblade is actually a pretty good example in this situation - previous to Graal Kingdoms I'm not sure what experience he had developing but I know he struggled to make a lot of what he did... but he didn't give up and sit on duff with a series of complaints... he kept going. He's made a lot of trouble for himself and I'm sure a lot of people, including myself, don't appreciate him as a individual - but none the less, kudos... you've taken the extra step others are simply too lazy and self-inclined to take

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Stephen

you've taken the extra step others are simply too lazy and self-inclined to take

I don't know if that's aimed at me.

I can't afford to upgrade; I have other things I enjoy in life as well. Photography, design work, and more. I simply can't afford to pay for something so that I can get enjoyment out of the development when I can get enjoyment out of developing for a classic server for free.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

I don't know if that's aimed at me.

I can't afford to upgrade; I have other things I enjoy in life as well. Photography, design work, and more. I simply can't afford to pay for something so that I can get enjoyment out of the development when I can get enjoyment out of developing for a classic server for free.

No, it wasn't aimed specifically at you - however you do fall under the group for which it was intended.

You're very quick to list your accomplishments, and just as quick to make poor excuses. If you had any concern for the community - or a value for it, you would not fail to mention the money you can make doing exactly the things you listed.

[Drakeero]

Yes, thank you, thank you. Wonderful job derailing this. Once again a lot of you can't seem to figure out anything more advanced then a LIST. A simple, itemized list. *clap clap* Good job Stephen, you are truly a champion.

So, what we have so far is...

1: Zormite ferry being too long.
2: Tile/Level errors across the main island.

I'll add a third.

3: The purple carpet from Hotaru has no graphic when you put it down on the floor.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Drakeero

Yes, thank you, thank you. Wonderful job derailing this. Once again a lot of you can't seem to figure out anything more advanced then a LIST. A simple, itemized list. *clap clap* Good job Stephen, you are truly a champion.

So, what we have so far is...

1: Zormite ferry being too long.
2: Tile/Level errors across the main island.

I'll add a third.

3: The purple carpet from Hotaru has no graphic when you put it down on the floor.

I'm afraid the problems you're addressing are very trivial in regard to the one currently suffered by the entire Graal community and the servers involved.

The speed of the fairy will be of little concern when it no longer exists.

[Drakeero]

Originally Posted by Stephen

I'm afraid the problems you're addressing are very trivial in regard to the one currently suffered by the entire Graal community and the servers involved.

The speed of the fairy will be of little concern when it no longer exists.

Well, maybe the third one about the carpet not having a graphic is trivial.

The tile and level errors are irritating because they also look really unnatural and give the server a feeling of incompleteness and sloppiness. It doesn't look good to oldbies, it probably wouldn't look as good to newbies as well.

The long length of the Zormite ferry is more of general pain.

There's two reasons why all these little things are important. If these are little things that really irritate players then its taking a lot from the enjoyment of the game, regardless of the actual size of the problem.

That, and how do you plan on fixing anything big if you can't even fix the tiny things?

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Drakeero

That, and how do you plan on fixing anything big if you can't even fix the tiny things?

There are currently a maximum of 20 players actively playing GK, and that is on a very good day. Setting that aside there is no one capable of administrating GK, either because they are inactive or because Stefan has a staunch hold on rights.

Your chimney sure may be trimmed with gold, but that won't make much of a difference if you build it from the top down.

[kia345]

Again Stephen dazzles us with his amazing outlook on life: "Why bother fixing the little things, no one plays, there's no reason to do repairs, no matter how minor!"


Fixing these little annoyances is the first step toward saving Gk. If you can fix all these small nuisances, it'll show you care enough to save the server.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by kia345

Again Stephen dazzles us with his amazing outlook on life: "Why bother fixing the little things, no one plays, there's no reason to do repairs, no matter how minor!"


Fixing these little annoyances is the first step toward saving Gk. If you can fix all these small nuisances, it'll show you care enough to save the server.

I think Tigairius might beg to differ; someone who actually has experience working with me. Remember how I asked you to stop antagonizing me? I wasn't joking.

[kia345]

Originally Posted by Stephen

I think Tigairius might beg to differ; someone who actually has experience working with me. Remember how I asked you to stop antagonizing me? I wasn't joking.

I'm trying to get a better grasp on how you feel about these things, I'm in no way trying to antagonize you. Explain to me how simple fixing these minor problems will have any negative affects on Gk.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by kia345

I'm trying to get a better grasp on how you feel about these things, I'm in no way trying to antagonize you. Explain to me how simple fixing these minor problems will have any negative affects on Gk.

If the current manager of GK is not willing to log on or acknowledge player messages, he cannot help - if the lead developer is not concerned enough to do anything he cannot help. If the owner of the game is not concerned he cannot help. Do you think I haven't tried to help GK? Were you asleep the past four months? If developers will not be given simple rights so that they may develop what makes you think anyone, not that there's anyone willing/capable to give the rights out, would give them to fix some incredibly trivial details - and more than this these problems pale in comparison to the greater problems Graal Online as a whole is currently suffering.

This is why I thought, and still think, you're antagonizing me - so please, cut the crap.

[Elizabeth]

Originally Posted by Drakeero

LITTLE things. Not big things like no updates. Little itty bitty things that make you irritable and grouchy about GK.

I'll start:

Zormite's slow as hell ferry. Try missing it about 7 times because someone comes into your room and demands your attention to talk with them while the ferry cruises by and leaves again.

malinko

[Drakeero]

Another metaphor. I'm a jeweler by trade. That means that I take shiny little trinkets of precious metals (luxuries) and doctor them up so people can go back to loving them.

Now, the thing about luxuries, is that sometimes you can get away with just a shiny surface. It doesn't matter how valuable a diamond ring is, a person wants its shine flawless. Not a single scratch anywhere.

I can take a dinky little CZ ring from Walmart or some crappy little snap-in pendant (which the stone doesn't even fit into) and make them look beautiful with just mild alterations to what's already there as well as a good polish.

Each tiny little irritation is a scratch. I'm not asking for big problems with the game. I'm asking for the scratches in the game's polish. If you make it SHINY enough, people will come. And when people come, there will be money. And where this is money there is a chance of real changes being made.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Drakeero

Another metaphor. I'm a jeweler by trade. That means that I take shiny little trinkets of precious metals (luxuries) and doctor them up so people can go back to loving them.

Now, the thing about luxuries, is that sometimes you can get away with just a shiny surface. It doesn't matter how valuable a diamond ring is, a person wants its shine flawless. Not a single scratch anywhere.

I can take a dinky little CZ ring from Walmart or some crappy little snap-in pendant (which the stone doesn't even fit into) and make them look beautiful with just mild alterations to what's already there as well as a good polish.

Each tiny little irritation is a scratch. I'm not asking for big problems with the game. I'm asking for the scratches in the game's polish. If you make it SHINY enough, people will come. And when people come, there will be money. And where this is money there is a chance of real changes being made.

Drakeero, you're preaching to the choir. I have tried, it won't work - and now there is bigger things to worry about.

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Stephen

You're very quick to list your accomplishments, and just as quick to make poor excuses. If you had any concern for the community - or a value for it, you would not fail to mention the money you can make doing exactly the things you listed.

I'm not listing my accomplishments; I was explaining that I have other things that I enjoy besides Graal.

I'm sorry you feel that I should be giving my money to Graal. I pay to play the game. And, while I appreciate the community, there is no reason for me to "donate" more to it.

Perhaps you think it is bad that I don't want to give money I make through my website, or any of my other endeavors, to Graal.

You are also failing to comment on how they don't seem to want developmental staff much (or to take care of the staff they have; you have even mentioned this, as has Tig). When I had a gold subscription, I offered to help, and they would simply not answer me. They also never answered me when I reported the platinum glitch way before people starting abusing it, which helped kill the economy.

Originally Posted by xXziroXx

First off, the way it works, is that you PM Stefan or Björn saying you're interested to help out. If you're good enough, you'll be hired within 24 hours most likely.

Perhaps I'm not good enough, then? I guess that is what you are implying. The problem is, they don't seem to read their PMs much.

And, you just need a Classic account, since that's all that's needed to logon Kingdoms Dev. I know, I've "worked" there.

Perhaps that's true; yet I can't contact them anyway.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

You are also failing to comment on how they don't seem to want developmental staff much (or to take care of the staff they have; you have even mentioned this, as has Tig). When I had a gold subscription, I offered to help, and they would simply not answer me. They also never answered me when I reported the platinum glitch way before people starting abusing it, which helped kill the economy.

I saw your offers many times and, from my own perspective, I was not interested in the slightest; you exaggerate nearly every aspect of yourself and you carry an entirely unfounded self-satisfying attitude I didn't want anything to do with. It's very possible they felt exactly the same.

I don't see why you need an invitation to develop or help this new "open" concept. If you really wanted to develop you wouldn't wait for people to come knocking, "Oh please great sage, code for us!".

[cbk1994]

Originally Posted by Stephen

I saw your offers many times and, from my own perspective, I was not interested in the slightest; you exaggerate nearly every aspect of yourself

I don't know what you are referring to; examples?

and you carry an entirely unfounded self-satisfying attitude I didn't want anything to do with.

Again, I don't know what you are talking about (which of course is usually the case when I receive 'negative' criticism).

I don't see why you need an invitation to develop or help this new "open" concept.

What 'open' concept? There is very little I can make without some kind of access to the source code.

If you really wanted to develop you wouldn't wait for people to come knocking

Perhaps you will hold this against me, but I refuse to chase after someone to help them. If they don't want help, I won't try to help them, even if this means others will have a lesser product or experience.

[xXziroXx]

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Perhaps I'm not good enough, then? I guess that is what you are implying.

I wasn't trying to imply anything.

Originally Posted by cbk1994

Perhaps that's true; yet I can't contact them anyway.

Just spam their forum inboxes, and occasional in-game PMs.

[grawlgamer]

I hate when chris says amen and mentions how he is athiest and posts like 25 posts per day on average.