Revision of the Playerworld Rules
 

More like... remake.

I'm not even going to link to the old ones because they were last updated in 2003, and a lot of the rules need adjusting to even fit in today.

So, I would like everybody's opinion on what rules need to be officialized, revised, etc.

Also, and this is something very touchy and will need to be discussed with the directors, is what happens if a playerworld breaks the rules?

I am also establishing a more concrete requirement for the hosted tab inspections. So far my outline is revolving around two main things:

1) An area, however small (i.e. only 1 town is okay) that is 100% completed. This area should function as a preview/teaser for the world that is under construction, and should be representative of the final product in all it's larger glory. This way players get a taste for the style, and gameplay of a server.

2) It should draw the players interest. There should be enough activity to keep a players interest without the intervention of a tour guide or an events staff team. The server itself should have interesting enough aspects to hold interest for some time byitself, we recommend at least 1 hour.

Public input rocks.

I think the requirement for the Hosted area is a near complete server, if it's not complete or no where near finished, why should it be shown to players in a server list if It can't hold a players interest for (MORE) than 1 hour.

Definately needs to be larger than 1 hour there Houdini.

When talking about playerworlds breaking the rules, are you referring to hosted and private servers, or all servers including classic?

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My post from the other thread aswell,

So since Houdini suggested we should make a thread so Sam wouldn't stomp on us, the title pretty much speaks for itself.

I personally think we need some more PWA members.. I only really see Houdini copping alot of the flak when it comes to PWA problems.

Come on Graal, we need some more members.

Well, do you think we should differentiate between classic/hosted/private rulebreakers? There are probably several cases this is appropriate, but which do you think are?

I think hosted should be a place to showcase what you have done, and your potential. That way you can draw staff to help you and players to test things.

As for the PWA team itself, let's keep that in your other thread.

Lol I deleted the other thread. So there didn't have to be 2 different on-going discussions.

One problem I keep seeing pop up is the lack of intelligence some of the playerworld owners with their whole servers being deleted.

This can and most certainly will be a loss of money towards Graal for the simple fact, if no one informs playerworld owners that if they keep giving out stupid rights to people who don't need them, they will get sick of having their world hosted and stop buying a subscription to it every 6 months, or every year, whichever they have bought.

Personally I think if a 'Classic' server cant maintain a daily average of 10-20Unique players it should be removed from the list because obviously its doing something wrong and needs to be pushed back to near classic, development stages; Hosted Tab. Also it would bring in money because staff would need to re-upgrade to work at the server while it is at the hosted state or they will just hire new staff.

Sorry I'm posting alot, but what the guy said above me, is exactly right.

I'm sick of seeing servers that are dead, or have barely any players. It's a waste of space, and I would love to see other up and coming servers have a chance to make it to classic, it gives the playerworld owners more incentive to bring together good developers, and create a fantastic world for all people to enjoy.

I believe that in order for any rules to even be worth anything, you'll need a lot more PWA. I'm talking 20-30 of them... seriously. Loads. Then you need an admin for these PWA so that the admin can watch over them and instruct them and not let them run wild and do whatever they want.

PWA need to be the glue that holds playerworlds together and polishes them up. They need to keep a constant eye on all of the public playerworlds and the servers that are near release. They should be lending a hand to the promising servers (or trying to find people who might be willing to) so that the projects don't just fizzle out and die.

Honestly PWA should be like ninja... You work around the server owners/staff quietly and only disturb them when absolutely necessary. Also I don't like it when PWA just pop on my server unannounced and look through my sh*t without even talking to me. Kind of rude and disrespectful if you ask me.

Really though, I think the PWA could do a good job of encouraging promising playerworlds to keep going without getting too involved in their business... and also making sure to hear all sides of a "theft" case, where one playerworld is saying another is stealing from it somehow...

I just don't like the idea of some group of people having power over everything I've worked to create and all they do is randomly pop on my server and look through my stuff and leave, and don't ask how the server is doing or if I need assistance or anything like that.

Really I don't see the reason that PWA should even go on private servers unless requested by the staff there.

Anyway, I know I didn't post much about what I think of the rules and stuff... I have to go right now so I will make a better reply later. =P

Classic

Servers in this list should attract new players, thus they need to be entertaining and work properly. If servers can't seem to get enough players or their content is inapropriate, fails to meet a certain standart ect.. than these servers simply don't deserve to be on this list. These servers aren't paid for so they should bring in atleast some money for Graal online.

Most of the classic servers don't have owners resposible for their content, simply managers appointed by previous managers or other staff. The PWA could take a supervising role these servers.

Classic servers could have a quota set for the monthly/weekly development releases that they need to preform to keep their content updated and expand it (like most proffesional online games). The PW Team could simply have a small role in this such as checking that quota's are met and content is appropriate. *

The PW Team could also make sure that each server has certain bonus's for VIP/Gold accounts compared to expired gold & trial accounts.

Hosted

The Idea Houdiniman has is pretty good.. no comments on that :p


* The PW Team could make sure that Classic servers have a very profesional winter/christmas packadge (bug free) done in august already ect. (They don't need to play baby sitters but they could advise servers to think ahead)

One thing obviously lacking is quality. For example Zodiac was passed with the excuse of "It had good gameplay, and there was nothing else!". That's a horrible reason. You could have asked Zodiac to fix it's levels, make the graphics not look like a 9 year old drew them, and THEN passed them for the Classic List.

But obviously quality is looked down upon and everyone is after quantity. In my opinion when a server is being reviewed, you should look at more than just gameplay. I remember in 2002 Bravo was revived but PWA told them that they had to make the levels better, despite the fact that the server had a decent and stable playercount. That did more harm than good, but now you have servers that seriously need facelifts and nothing is being done.

Also what about player requirements? If the server is sitting there with 0 players...

I agree, but it shouldn't reveal too much as you need to keep some things hidden for the big BANG CHECK THIS OUT GUYS.

I so agree. Events != content. (technically it is but whatever)

While maybe I think 20-30 is overkill, I think that hiring 6-7 PWA's would be a good idea. When they had nothing to do they could randomly hop on servers and see if anything was needed. They could help solve PWA issues within the support center, etc.

I actually really like the current Playerworld Rules, they seem to be sensible and fair, but I don't know the last time they were actually really enforced.

We all know that Graal is short of Playerworld Administration right now, and that might not be such a bad thing in terms of the remaining lack of trust that people have, but in respects to Graal, it is. I know Ibonic was considdering hiring some new Playerworld Admins soon, I remember talking to him about it for a while, I can't remember what he was waiting for though, hmm..

Anyway, what I would personally really like to see more is PWA reviews. I used to always read through Malinko and Spark's reviews in the past, they are a good way of finding an unbiased view of a server (which isn't from a member of staff there), and they're a good introduction for the servers themselves.

One thing that confuses me is that we have the Playerworld rules, but I'm not actually sure what the rules are for Classic and Hosted servers, I've always wondered if they're under the same treatment. I totally agree with Crono, and I'd really like to see the playerlist cleaned up a bit more, if you're starting a new proposal, I think you should try out your new rules on every current Classic and Hosted server, to see if they actually do pass. There are too many servers these days, and like Crono said, quality is better then quantity.

Agreed. Reading old reviews back in the day by Jinx or Torankusu would motivate me to want to make a server. In-depth details about the server were always entertaining to read.

There was a detailed system that showed if a playerworld passed or failed. There were ratings for different parts of the server. Here is an example. Everyone had a better idea of why the server was put up. It also was a great way to get people interested in the server. I would love to see some sort of rendition of this come back.

Also with the lack of a PWA Admin PWA has become less efficient. For example under Spark new PWA were hired based on their applications which showed their qualifications, not by how close they were to Stefan.

Also with a PWA Admin the team would have someone to go to if they need help.

Yeah, with more images though!

I also wish more posts such as these were made:

http://forums.graal2001.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=55868
http://forums.graal2001.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=56606

I PM'd Stefan a few days before this years Halloween to see if he was going to create one this year, obviously not. Posts like are just a bit of light relief and build more of a community in my opinion. It would be nice if we had more community based posts rather then the constant "EVIL MODERATION!!11!" ones, and the Playerworld Administration could do those.

1 - Under Construction
1a) I think there should be an UC tab. Some of us are interested in Under Construction servers - newbies oughtn't concern themselves.
1b) To get off the UC tab, I think Devil's right - it ought to be either voted to Publication, or it should need an hour worth of entertainment value, or it could be when the server's logged a certain ammount of hours of play value for a certain ammount of definitely-not-developers playing. Once you've got 10 or so players spending at least an hour a day on it, it's ready for review - that kinda thing.
1c) And until a Hubworld is put up, yeah, servers that run out of interest should get shunted back to UC until they're ready to represent Graal again.

2 - He Copied Me!
2a) I think there should be a framework for Originality. If you want to work on a Ninjas With Grenade Launchers server, and such a server already exists, you should be encouraged to work on that server and/or discouraged from making your own. Conversely, you should have to get your own playerbase rather than stealing from NWGL1 to pay NWGL2 - see also, Websites and Ads for Playerworlds.(not the best link, but the most specific).
2aI) How do we encourage people to work together? Well, the PWA can moderate disputes between the parties which want the Ninjas with Grenade Launchers to fight pirates and the parties which want the Ninjas with Grenade Launchers to fight aliens. If it's entirely impossible to have a server where they fight BOTH pirates AND aliens, someone has to decide which one it'll be - and if the guy who made all the levels is threatening to quit if it's not Pirates, and the owner's threatening to shut down the server sooner than give up on Aliens, this is a big deal. It's up to a neutral third party who only has Graal's best interest in mind to sit them both down, even out their powers (as currently the Owner fires the Levels Guy, keeps his stuff, prevents him from making a new server, then shuts down the server when he can't find a new Levels Guy, wasting months of development), and works out a compromise. (Space Pirates.)
2aII) How do we discourage people from making their own server? You can either let them do it (so the Levels Guy makes his Ninjas vs Pirates server and the Owner continues with his Ninjas vs Aliens) and force them to advertise and get their own players off teh intarweb instead of stealing each others' (maybe one advertises on scifi sites and one advertises on pirate sites, who knows?), OR you can just forbid anyone from starting up another server with Ninjas while there's already a Ninjas server. One Ninjas Server At A Time, and you all better get along - even if the parties involved are thinking Naruto or Ninja Turtles or Ninja Scroll or Soul Calibur or....

3 - He Deleted My Stuff!
3a) Maybe it's just me, but it seems a final decision is needed on whether these PWs are owned by Graal or owned by the PW's sponsor. If Graal owns 'em, Graal can usurp the interim manager - but said manager probably oughtn't be paying for the privelege. If the PW Owner owns his PW - can he be considered "breaking the rules" on what is effectively Private Property? Do the Java Ninjas come rampaging onto all Java apps and enforce their will? No, I think under the current methodology a PW Owner can't be in violation of any rules at all - he can be banned on every server but his own for violations elsewhere, he can be Persona Non Grata on the forums and even blacklisted as a hacker, yet his "site"/server is still hosted for as long as he's paying.
3b) So what happens when such a person decides to burn their server to the ground? Ought their level manager (or Former Level Manager) be allowed to resurrect it? I say yes - there's no conflict of originality, only a question of ownership between those two. The level manager shouldn't get access to the Last Backup of the server though, and shouldn't be handed it under any circumstances - if he has the levels he edited on his harddrive, he can rebuild and reconnect the world on his own, using only what he made himself. (Or she made herself, apologies for gender biases - but I'm in a hurry.)

4 - Open/Hiring Season
4a) There are two theories of management - the Zergling Rush theory and the Protoss theory. The Zergling Rush theory holds that in order for PWA to be effective, you need a lot of underlings, supported by a few regional managers - one to watch over every 10 or so - then an Uber Manager to watch over all of them (Houdiniman). The Protoss theory holds that you just need a handfull of really good managers, and everyone else can come to you. I like the latter (having suffered running my LAT like the former) - just sit back and wait. Have PW owners - and only owners, discard all email from other sources - petition for review. Review them when they petition, and review the existing PWs on a set schedule - though not one open to those being reviewed, you just throw together a calendar. "December 9th - check up on Classic. Next checkup: January 13." If someone complains that Classic sucks and should be reviewed, tell them they're already scheduled for a checkup sometime this week, and you'll get back to them by Sunday. Unless it's an emergency ("Lycia's drunk on RC!") they can wait, you are few and busy.
4b) Should PWA be responsible for coordinating PWs? I think no - you can't force 'em to, so why dedicate your time and energy to it? It's like teaching a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

5 - If not the PWA, then whom?
5a) I miss the old Global Scripting Admins and whatnot. We should get some more of them. They can handle encouraging the good PWs and fixing the bad.
5b) Even if I'm the only one that thinks it's a good idea, I still say there should be a global locker for things PWs don't mind sharing. Like snowflake scripts, and jack-o-lanterns. But then, I think all the servers should be connected at the Hubworld, so what do I know?

But it is all running on Graal's hosting under Graal's name and everything. If all Java apps were hosted on Sun's servers, I am sure they would have ninjas enforcing their will all over the place.


Why not? It seems like it would be in Graal's best interest that the levels dude can get a world up and running as soon as possible, so he should be handed the version of the server that is the furthest progressed.

Still voting for Ghost PWA where they just occasionally nuke servers that really suck :frown:

Stuff like that can be posted on either wiki, the scripting forum and graal.net, no?
I do not really see a lot of people contributing interoperable quality scripts, though.

Did you ever come up with a concrete design or mockup implementation of Hubworld?

@Tyhm -> Owner = Owner, he gives the rights he wants to give to the people who need them (or he wants them to have the rights he gives them)..

I think the Hosted tab is just really tacky =/

While I don't disagree with you, under the current guidelines it's quite impossible - the levels are property of Insano the Past Owner, and it would be considered theft (by some) for Graal to use it once Insano's burnt down his server. It's theft for Developo the LAT Admin to use it too. One could argue that there's still the disclaimer "All content submitted becomes property of GraalOnline.com", but if Graal starts flexing that muscle one must ask why anyone's asked to pay for that privelege.
Not as such - the Wiki doesn't have a lot of FileSpace for uploading ganis, graphics, levelfiles, etc.

But then, I think there should be a GPack filetype - a sort of Custom Graal Zip Format, just for backing up servers and transferring entire NPCs, etc. (graphics, classes and all)
Design yes, mockup not-yet. I just haven't had the time, ironically - all of last week I was bored to tears and would have, had I known Stefan had any interest in designing the necessary technology to allow Servers to communicate with one another. Now they're working me from the moment they drag me outta bed to the moment I'm allowed to sleep...

Sure, okay. But if it's Owner, why are we even discussing what happens if an Owner goes rogue? They can't, they're in charge, they can't break the law because they ARE the law. If they decide their server's gonna be DBZ themed and they're gonna ban anyone who says Inu Yasha, they're not "Wrong", because they Own that territory and set their own rules. If they decide, with a reliable 300 playercount, that they don't like Unixmad anymore and are going to delete every last shred of their server - and forbid anyone from ever making another server like it, least of all their levels administrator - they Own that content (and more dastardly, the guy who made it doesn't), and that's their right.

And that sucks. If nobody's using the content, you should be allowed to use it.

More PWA members is important, especially for timezones that other people can't get into contact with globals.

This has been a problem since I've played, is finding someone on in my timezone to help me with problems.

Hmmm....this actually ties in with another Common Complaint I've heard a lot...getting in touch with Anyone at certain times.

Maybe Graal needs a Bat-Phone. You know, the Comissioner picks up the red phone, and in Stately Wayne Manor the red phone under the glass starts blinking - same idea, in case of emergency there's a way to get in touch with ____.
But such information would necessarily be limited to precious few people, as too many people would misjudge "emergencies"...so there'd need to be a handfull of global staffers anyway...which ultimately means we'd need something like 12 PWA-type globals so one can be available at all times...in which case they may as well be capable of fixing it themselves...
*shrugs* I dunno, maybe it's something that could be worked into whatever New Website they make and maybe it can't. Log in - Report Emergency - whichever Global's on the clock/watching the taskbar/RC (be they Darlene or Houdiniman or NewIbonic or whomever - just someone the Top Two trust with the pager) checks it out and goes "OMG, Kingdoms crashed!" and they wake up Stefan.

As to actually having 8-24 PWAs so there's always at least one on at all hours to deal with any potential emergency that may arise...I never ran the GP, but Classic's GP were constantly striving for that and it never seemed to do them any good. Mind, they achieved it for a while, but it didn't last.

This problem has been drastically reduced with the support center enabling most problems to at least be acknowledged, if not handled, within 16 hours or so.

The biggest problem I've seen with getting a hold of somebody now is people who aren't aware of the support center itself.

This is a draft. Unapproved and not enforced, to be submitted to the directors for approval before being acted on. This is simply to revise the rules before submission. This is also not a GraalOnline policy at this time.

Source: http://forums.graalonline.com/forums...ad.php?t=49824

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Rules for ALL servers

These rules apply to all worlds regardless of popularity.

It is the manager’s responsibility to make sure these rules are followed, and if they are broken some punishments are:
-Being made Private
-Shut Down
-Disable playerworld for a set period of time
-Revoking free hosting (Classic worlds)
-Banning people who break rules
-Replace of manager
-Banning from being public for a period of time.
These need a lot of working-through, some of these require authority not available to the PWA and couldn't be actively managed.

Manager's Role:
-Responsible for enforcing these rules and making their staff aware of changes.
-Enforce and comply with the GraalOnline User Agreement (e.g. dealing with anyone who deserves it according to the agreement)
-Govern their staff, and must be aware of all RCs/rights given out.
-Responsible for server content, and should limit uploading to "live" areas of the world.

File Manager:
Do not upload anything into the file-manager that you do not have permission to upload. Additionally, no inappropriate or copyrighted material should be uploaded.

Do not use content that has been uploaded elsewhere on Graal without the consent of both the creator and the manager of the original world.

NO music files should be uploaded to the playerworlds file-manager. It is difficult to prove who created music so music should be hosted on a private web-server and played with the command "play". (e.g.:
play http://www.host.com/song.midi;)

Staff:
All staff positions should be have an exclusive purpose. For example, you do not need someone to upload heads when the manager or graphics admin can do this.

Staff should be given training on how to use any RC rights they have and the responsibilities of their job. If they don’t know how to use a certain thing, limit how they can use it until they learn. The manager is responsible for all staff's actions regardless of that staff member's experience.

Each staff member should have their rights given to them individually. Any rights given must be needed and fit their position.

Only managers should have level 4 RCs. The manager should be active to perform tasks that can't be done without level 4 rights. A second level 4 RC can be given to the highest positioned admin, but only if needed (e.g.: timezone conflicts).

No playerworld should have more than 3 level 4 RCs total. A third level 4 RC can be given to the Admin-Playerworld## or Admin-ClassicWorld account only.

No playerworld should have more than 3 level 3 RCs. For any task requiring level 3 rights a staff can ask a level 3 or 4 RC to do it.

All RCs should have an IP range defined to limit unauthorized access to the RC account. See Security.

Only managers are allowed to add RCs. The managers may also allow one other staff member to edit rights, if this person is trusted and their job role allows them such responsibility. E.g.: Assistant Manager

Staff should never PM or Mass Message offensive material. They should also not have offensive material in their profile.

Local Server Rules:
All playerworlds should a posted set of local rules for their world. These rules should comply with the GraalOnline agreement.

RCs:
RC should ONLY be given to those who need it.

For example, FAQ and Events staff do not need RC as they are in-game positions only. Duties such as adding/fixing events are the NAT's and LAT's responsibility. Adding new FAQ/ET members, as well as any staff tools like "boots", should be done by the manager.

Any RC in the "staff=" server-option should be an active staff member. Honorary RCs are forbidden.

Guests who help with temporary problems or projects should not be left in the staff list, nor with any rights in their account as they are often used to attack a playerworld.

Invisible and closed off playerworlds do not need staff such as FAQs or GPs and should not have any until they are visible. When they are visible as "Hosted" they should only have these staff if the playercount warrants it.

Security:
Only managers should have full rights RCs for security reasons.

Do not give out rights if they are not needed... If a staff member doesn’t use a right for their job, they don’t need the right.

Nobody other than the manager should have rw access to any important logs such as rclog.txt

NPCs should be used to substitute RC actions (e.g. warpto) where possible. These should be secure (e.g. account and guild checking).

NPCs should not be used to substitute RC rights if they can’t be made secure.

ALL RCs need an IP range set. This can be no less than two numbers. e.g:
12.34.*.*

Managers should limit the amount of people who have ‘rw’ (read & write) rights to "live" folders, the folders current downloadable levels are in. Management should transfer files into "live" folders from non-live staff folders after checking them.

NPCs:
NO NPC Should be abusive such as changing players names, changing players looks etc. IF you really need this then it should have security measures such as account and guild checking, and the NPC must log all users' actions.

All NPCs must be created for your world or you should have permission to use them.

Bans:
All bans must be for a clear reason. You can not just ban someone because you dislike them.

Players should be warned and go through some sort of punishment system before a ban, such as warning, then jail. Big offenses such as disruptive behavior affecting the whole playerworld do not need a warning first. However it is suggested you use the jail before a ban.

Players using trainers can by banned on first offense if there was obvious cheating. Messages from the server that "player is using cheat tool:" should be verified by staff in game whenever possible.

Bans comments should include the following: Reason, Account (if PCID ban), and the banning staff member. If there isn't enough information to verify a ban that is questioned, the player may be released.

Because bans are often done for incorrect or wrong reasons only people with level 3 or 4 RCs should be allowed to ban. This means that 5 people (MAX) should be able to ban.

Guilds:
Do not make guilds that mimic any special or global staff guilds (e.g.: GM, VIP)

Do not make local guilds that are the same as global guild names.

No guilds should be offensive, allow players to be in the staff list, or have copyrighted names.

Trial Accounts:
No playerworld under any circumstances should save trial account data.

Trial accounts are accounts that allow the user to see and test the game on their computer system. Graal does not allow trial accounts to gain items/stats easier than paid accounts.

Playerworld Websites:
If you link to your playerworlds website all content found within your website must fall within Graal's rules and there must be no offensive or illegal material. This includes links out of your website.

Reviving A Playerworld Project:
Any files uploaded into the file-manager becomes the sole property of GraalOnline. When a player works for a playerworld as a 'Staff' member all files given to the manager to upload, or uploaded themselves, becomes property of GraalOnline. Temporary usage rights (until shutdown of a playerworld) is given to the playerworld manager while the playerworld is online. This right of usage is terminated when the playerworld is shut down. If someone wants to use any of the files again (i.e.: Playerworld Revive Project) Graal and its representatives must be contacted before they can be uploaded again. To gain usage rights to any Playerworld previously online, the individual must contact Graal's representative and the last active manager(s) to gain permission and usage rights to the files of a shutdown Playerworld.

Any scripts with ‘NPC Made By ’ need separate permission for their usage. If any file, like a graphic, is being used elsewhere you also need permission from the creator and any playerworld using it. This also applies if the filename contains a player’s name: e.g. player_gfx1.png

Need two posts :(

System Abuse:
NO NPC should be able to imitate an account name (e.g. *Accoutname)

NO NPC should interfere with or stop the automatic disconnection for not moving (e.g. an NPC that alters players X,Y,Z over and over)

NO one should abuse the Graal system (against its intended purpose), such as multiple disconnecting, warping or player attribute editing, on anyone.

Data Loss:
All data held within the File-Manager is there at the uploader's risk. GraalOnline can not take responsibility for any data loss. Managers should backup all files and logs frequently to avoid any problems that may occur due to data loss (accidental or otherwise).

GraalOnline reserves the right to make special-case amendments and additions to its rules and policies and the steps it takes concerning violation of these policies and rules. Rule amendments may occur when a potential violation will effect the general services of GraalOnline. Players are required to keep up-to-date with any changes to Graal policy concerning rules and gameplay by checking it frequently. To keep users aware of any amendments they will be posted in the GraalOnline Communication Center forums, under the section 'PlayerWorlds Main Forum'

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Reminder: This draft is unofficial, not applicable, and not representative of GraalOnline.

So far I've made mostly grammatical corrections, and only a few tweaks to bring the policies up to date with today's systems. i.e. "Third tab" is "Hosted tab", for bans you dont need to list a release date as this is automatic, etc.

Edit: Quadruple post FTW :cool:

I like the rules, and things like that. They are simple to follow even for the most silly of people.

In regards to the support centre, that is all well and dandy having that there, I quite like using it and always get speedy responses. That is say, when there are actually people around to ANSWER for that actual subject I would be expressing my opinion about.

At the moment I can think of 2 people who answer them, yourself and Darlene, and sometimes Sam who wishes to butt into my tickets even after someone has replied to me with sufficient information.

Where is the rest of the player world admin help, you certainly don't want to, nor should you have to deal with 100 servers. Have you spoken to the directors to figure out a new plan on hiring? I'm sick of seeing (some) suckups getting jobs around here, or the people that play GK/Zone (whatever) server the most. It should be based on alot more other things than this.

There is a lot i could say right now about the post you have made HoudiniMan but im afraid im getting a little tired and wouldnt be able to completely think through my ideas, ill just shoot a few of them out there and see what happens.

What does this even mean? "live" areas of the world, how do you even begin to determine something like that?

This should be up to the playerworld Manager, not the PWA. There are various reasons for this. If a playerworld gets deleted, ban the person who deleted it, and reupload the content. The entirety of the situation takes longer on the global to ban the guy who did it, then it does to reupload the backup. Is that why this rule is trying to be pushed?

Im simply grasping at straws or something tonight but it seems you are pushing to make the job as easy as possible, i know you dont get paid but you are expected to deliver a service. Most people who are requesting that service pay for it. Granted Classic playrworlds are frozen, and recieve free time, but (Starting with Zodiac) have paid for awhile to be where they are.

I am going to draft up a bigger reply to this later, for the most part it seems like rather then helping the worlds and letting them have fun, this new layout is ment to govern and control them, and thats something I cant say I agree with. There should be limits yes, but the limits you are allowed to set should also be limited.

Let people make mistakes, it makes money.

Why does any content uploaded on a Graal server automatically become Graal's property? It's like we're paying you so that you can use our material that is copyright to us the moment it is created.

Live parts of the playerworld would most likely be parts that are open to the public, and players are always there, maybe?

smirt362 : This would be because alot of companies do the same thing, if they wish to make those rules, that is their business and if you agree to this by agreeing to the ToS, you must comply with this, or leave the game. It's pretty simple and has been around for years, no need in bringing it back up.

I'd say a live area is an area a normal player can access without the aid of an adminstrator.


It is a serious security issue to have lots of people with full rights. It's a rule in the IT world to never give anyone more rights than they need to complete their duties, and for good reason. If tons of people can do anything, it's only asking for trouble. Lots of people renting servers don't want to bother with managing their rights properly, and I've seen people get burned by it many times. I'd say limiting servers to 3 level 4 RCs is actually lenient.

Many servers also don't keep their own backups and rely on Stefan to provide them when needed. Stefan's pretty busy and it can take days to restore a server sometimes, which results in a lot of lost productivity and angry players.

Stefan doesn't charge for fixing problems :confused:

I upload material to a server and the server owner gets permission to use it, I found that a bit sad.

SO you complain about that now, when that's not the problem we are supposed to be having a discussion about?

While I do agree the management of the server should decide the majority of staffing policies, with guidelines, I can't see a situation where you would need more than 2 level 4 admins and more than 3 level 3 admins.

Yes! The rule I've been waiting for :D

By the way Houdini, I think Unholy Nation breaks every single rule you've just listed. Oh, that reminds me.. is placing a chat logger on a player that records every single thing they say allowed? If so, it shouldn't be as that is clearly over the line in terms of invading privacy.

I made a chat logger on N-Pulse for staff use. I'm hoping only high staff members can authorize it's use as it should only be used on suspects: not freely used and abused.

Chat loggers shouldn't be made to log EVERY single little thing a player says, that is invading privacy.

I really don't see a problem with a chat logger, because it is game chat which any player can see, or walk-in on.

A PM logger, which isn't currently possible, would be crossing the line; but, if there was a suspected trainer user online it would not be overly heinous to send their chat to RC, although it shouldn't be kept unless they did something bad.

The part where it says any files uploaded to the file manager belongs to graal online, apparrently the rule that the dudes made up cant really be enforced >.>

That rule is covered in the user agreement I believe, it's not really up for debate. Nobody has any other comments?

I got a question to this "Only RC for the people who need it." thingy. Can we also give RC to the people who dont need it for a period of time? So they can motivate some of the Devs to work more or something like that. Trust me, that worked before, and will work again :o