5, a good number?
 

As of right now now KJ, Zormite and Dustari are all alligned, Forest is for now gone, which leaves Pirates by themselves.

3 against 1 does not make very good odds, even if Forest comes back (date? no clue) its still 3 against 2.

You can set the limit to 1 ally but then bam 2 v 2 v 1 another mismatch for the 1.

Add another kingdom? Ha it took 2 months to get the event shop running I doubt this will happend.

Remove a kingdom...Forest because right now it already is pretty much gone... get an uprising from all its old/cureent members.

The whole system is not good, no wonder kingdoms have failed.

Thats all I have to say, ideas anyone?

barbarians like celt was ;D

ahem Midevil Farmer owns all

Yes, I too noticed the triple entante (sp?) a while ago... Doesn't seem like there's going to be much fun in the area of kingdom wars anytime soon... basicly if on of the three allied kingdoms are attacked by... well really only the pirates would be the one attacking... the other two will join in and it will be like a free forall brawl...

So instead of a war, its more like an extermenation, sure the pests annoying, but there are very very few compared to how many molecules of poison there are...


Also consider this... Member count:

Dustari:135
Zormite:119
Kurenai:214

Pirates:58

I see an 8:1 ratio there... for every one pirate, there are 8 people in the triple entante to gang up on them...

Numbers can be a little deceiving there, I am on many parts on the day (suspension from school =D) and if you really look at it, you will only see a
40% Pirate
20% Zormite
10% Dustari
30% KJ

Making it a bit more fair, its all about active members. The problem is during wars not only do active members participate but ussually the people you barely see come on and screws up the ration back it again around 3:1

1. Those numbers are invalid. People go inactive all the time. Some groups clean the member list. I cleared pirate's list when I was Governor, some havn't cleaned theirs since long before that.
2. The balance of numbers doesn't really matter. There doesn't have to be 2v2v2 in even numbers.
3. Even if it did have to be even, it makes sense for CP to not be allied with anyone.
4. This is not the reason kingdoms are doing bad. People need to realize that kingdoms are for RPing. They're not your traditional Graal guild which is actually not a guild, but more of a gaming clan. Guilds are for people with similar interests in goals...gaming clans are just groups for teaming up together to "kill" or defeat others. In a sense, they're simple trivial guilds where the only common aspect is the goal of "destruction".
5. Bring back RPing.
6. People who are taking over the kingdom world with their anti-RPing ideas need to be removed. Refer to graaliholic's signature (if it has not changed). (Edit: I guess I was wrong. I just changed. Either it wasn't him who quoted one person saying kingdoms needs to remove all non-RPers..... or the signature was changed.)

Mark has grudges.


I wanted to join, he said no.

1.Refer to previous post by me
2.Okay if you like lopsided wars go right ahead
3.Why CP, because they are Pirates? So does it make sense for a Knight to allign with a Samurai? No, this isn't real life, untill every single person knows the exact history (which is not going to happen) of their kingdom, Kingdoms will not have good role playing
4.Ok this is what we expect, we have all these PK guilds on classic, we take all these PK crazy people and stick them on kingdoms and tell them to RP, is it going to happen? no it will not, they will just do the exact thing they did on every other server.
5.Bring it back? I had a pretty long hiatus of Graal but I am almost certain it was never here.
6.So are you saying that anyone who PKs can not be in a kingdom amazing w lets have 2 members in each kingdom.


I am all for roleplaying in fact I enjoy it, but I enjoy killing people also, Kingdoms is driven by its powerful players all these players happen to like to PK (Or most sorry) A level 2 person can roleplay as the king of Dustari but you will nto get it through the head of one of these level 40-60 people that he can not take one swing at him and kill him.

Some significant roleplayish kingdom-wide event should take place to break up the three allies I think. As when most everyone is allied and friends, things are more bland and uneventful.


(Say, the Pirates could stage a sabotage thing on the Zormites, and frame Dustari somehow, or bribe and befriend Zormite higherups and remind them of their past warrior ways, and anti-Dustari past as well.)

I don't know, would be neat for some Kingdom subterfuge and secret plotting to happen.

Well the odds are even with Pirates having lots of the best players on graal kingdoms, so don't start crap about them being crap and all. For god sake mark probably gives them items like he did with his kingdom TBC or something..

If there is a proper systems for war - that is, being an enemy means more than plain pk-feasts every now and then - I will personally empty a cauldron full of stew over the Empress new dress to bring some momentum to diplomacy ;)
The point is, we don't need less kingdoms, we need some enemies to rp - and to rp only. While the tripple alliance is a good thing for now, I think it should be split when such a system is added - IC only, and thats many people's problem. You can be someone's mortal enemy as well as best friend at the same time.

I was in TBC at level 11 so you can't really say it was only powerfuk players, also I din;t reveive any items from Mark

I'd quote myself: "Alliances do not last" :)
They always end up screwing over each other, two backstab one or so. Oh..and I've already started hearing rumors about a situation like this ;)

OMG sex scandel! :megaeek:

Another of the rare occasions i agree with Ziro.

;)

hmm, now for mine.
Your complaints are falling on deaf ears.
Having an odd number of kingdoms would add diversity to the roleplay (IF WE HAD DECENT ROLEPLAY ON KINGDOMS, WHICH WE DON'T); it would mean that if four kingdoms got into a scuffle, they would all be competing to get the fifth on -their- side and the fifth could benefit from this or take advantage greatly.
But, yeah seriously, i don't know why you all just don't give up; i've pretty much given up on the GK system, i'm concentrating on helping make my friend's playerworld rather than running around on this sunken old wreck. Graal Kingdoms IS NO LONGER A ROLEPLAY SERVER. The powers that be made it no more than a...graphically enhanced classic server somewhere along the line, and nothing except a completely new server will change that now. Kingdoms is overrun by PKers(coincidentally they are non-RPers) that are aided to a *****ic extent by the corrosive and imbalanced system and the amount of items and valuelessness of everything non-event/alch. They swamp the kingdoms which were set up for roleplaying, and in some cases even rule these kingdoms. If you want fairness, fun, intelligence and roleplaying, please, -please- stop looking for it on GK. You will not find it.

And whoever was rambling on about playercount....wtfs. Did you just completely neglect the fact that around 100 of those members on each side were inactive, or PKing *****s who never ever wear their tags, just to make your point seem more valid? Well, that's statistics for you, i guess. Even if there were 100 players in each army, in a battle on GK right now, the whole fight would just be a short scuffle between the people who've got the EAs; all those without die in the first wave of icestorm and powerplayers. There are no real wars on GK to have anyway, so why the hell are you whining about unfair numbers of kingdoms? (ESPECIALLY WHEN FOREST IS INACTIVE ANYWAY, DUHHHHHH). If the outnumbered kingdom didn't like being outnumbered, maybe it should have just not turned the other ones against it. Crushing it in a 3-on-1 war would serve as a valuable lesson to the outnumbered kingdom, what is your problem?

*ramble over*

Don't complain because you didn't get anything :-/

As for the alliance thing. It's pretty stupid IMO. There should be another kingdom, OR alliances shouldn't be able to be made. Yet another reason why GK is unbalanced and boring.

::Bursts out laughing::

who wants to get PKed in a dumb war, when I was a soldier Dustari lost a war with the Astri, and it sucked. Our king had to agree to an alliance with them that he hated, and made everyone hate him, and no one had fun.

In short:
It stinks being owned, so we have a strong kingdom and strong alliances that will prevent that from happening again - who wouldn't?

Should I hold a vote on the Dustari forums 'should we be lame instead?'


If there was real wars, it might be interesting to have them.

Right now, they are PK fests with respawners *cough*mark*cough* who seem to only want (delusionally) to be able to validate some means to remove a leader they don't like for very non-rp reasons.

So, right now, I am very sure, the alliance makes gameplay far better, not worse. We can RP fun kingdom events and not worry that we'll be attacked in 20 minutes, that people will get PKed by members of an aggressive kingdom and nothing will be able to be done about it because they 'own you'.

Our Alliance has not been an agressor even once, and has always been fair.

Lets get a good war system in place.


Side note: adding another kingdom would be not so hard I bet, only because its all been done before - 5 times, other than custom gfx for buildings, if needed.

If Ziro got in trouble for not RPing pirates as a kingdom with the rest of GK, (jagen said that bordered on breaking the eula or something) then what the heck is Chris doing?
5th Kingdom back please, before 2k5?

What the hell am I doing? I'll repeat, IF YOU DON'T WANT UPDATES BUT WANT PLAYERWISE THINGS RIGHT NOW SAY SO :)
Furthermore making kingdoms not RP or mistreating players because of your position in a kingdom is quite a different situation than taking down a kingdom for reconstruction (with the support of the members =D! ) Holy crap, did I mention half of the things aren't done because I don't have adequate rights and the people that do have yet to suifficiently help me?

"Right now, they are PK fests with respawners *cough*mark*cough* who seem to only want (delusionally) to be able to validate some means to remove a leader they don't like for very non-rp reasons."

That leader was also put in place with "un-RP reason" with a poor attempt as RP to justify it <3

Anyways, back on topic; another kingdom is not only uneccessary but does more bad than good as the playerbase is small. Oh and one kingdom can possibly wipe out two so why can't two not defeat 3? Personally I don't think it would be THAT bad to add another kingdom but bleh X_x

The more the merrier?

Chris, all I am saying is I've seen playerworlds written out on napkins that have more detail than I've seen of Forest, and while you plan on doing more on a rainy day, GK is now a 4 kingdom game until further notice.

Sorry to be harsh, maybe I would be better to say, what is happening with forest? Why the hold ups? When will GK get our 5th kingdom back? I am all in favor of building things up better, as long as it happens.


Is there a place where you list what's been done? I actually find it quite interesting, I think an elven culture would be excellent. I just wonder if you need to be proded a bit, it seems dead in the water for now, and I've seen zero evidence to the contrary.

If you hold a kingdom under water continuiously for months to rebirth it later, understand people will want to have some info on the progression and condition of the thing.

Stop making me sound like some kind of evil comic antagonizing villain. The only trouble I got in was with the members complaining because they disliked RPing, yet wanted to join a kingdom (though kingdoms are initially ment for roleplaying...), and then they wanted to have me removed because they obviously didn't agree with me. My biggest problem was that I enforced RPing and got mad at people who were there only to cause trouble. Every member who joined had to undergo an RP test and was shown that CP was a kingdom for RPing. That means if you were to go on tag, it was for RPing... Yet, even after reading the rules and undergoing an RP test, some members would use non-RP names on the RPing tag... some would just be talking non-RP talk while on tag... Things like this are what got me against them. I was nice enough to give them chances and just complained to them about how they behaved like idiotic children. It was nice of me to do this since they did these things even after reading the rules and having to prove knowledge and ability of RPing... Yet they still complained and wanted me thrown out or have me change my ways. I should have simply solved the problem by removing them.

I didn't want CP to waste their effort trying to RP with other kingdoms when the other kingdoms had leaders who said "lol" during RP events... they were given plenty of time and chances to change their ways (I did it instantly when becoming Governor). So then, I decided we had to keep to ourselves... otherwise it's bad RPing if we understand these people saying things like "Rping is so teh stupid" or "Go to Val if you want to play like that." while in-game and while we're RPing.

The kingdom was all fine untill those trouble-makers came in, and started causing problems. My flaw was that I didn't remove the trouble-makers who then gained support from even the best RPers in the kingdom.

If you join an RP group and are not RPing, you're only there to cause problems. That's simple enough. It's interrupting other players' gameplay and ruining fun for them. I know I surely dislike trying to RP while some idiot comes up running to me, slashes me, and says "lol, pmode nub". Or even if they're trying to be helpfull... "lol u hafta use a gov weapon b4 u can kill the rexes"... EVERY kingdom has people who do this (the OOC talk)... I take screenshots daily... :rolleyes: It's sad.

Jagen did say he believed it may be against some code (and would make sure I answer a call of war from another kingdom if the need comes... though I see that as ridiculous if I was only going to have to send my people into a PK fest to just be PKed multiple times by people who are saying things like "nubs dont u event no how 2 figth"... I've discussed with Padren before how we could avoid having stupid wars like that... if you're forced into it, it'll just be exactly like what we discussed avoiding- PK fest), but I never was actually getting into any trouble with the admins for this...

Edit: Also, Chris, about leaders being put into place without RP reason...
Notice this...
1. Valders puts me as Governor and does not have roleplay reason for it. (if the need ever comes, I just say I became acknowledged as a good pirate by him as I became a Captain and became known around the "kingdom"...)
2. Valder's plot has me "illegally" (according to MarkB, the very person Valder put as Governor) removed.
3. Valder has no RP reason/story to removing me.
4. I set up a roleplaying story to my removal and my runaway from the island.
5. Valder then puts MarkB as Governor, and no RP story is put in for this.
6. Valder leaves again with no RPing story to his leave.

And I'm the bad guy here? x.x

I agree with that. Right now, there can hardly be proper wars which can be counted as fun even for those who lose. This can't really be true for "wars" that last less than an hour.

You have a good point there ziro

"Chris, all I am saying is I've seen playerworlds written out on napkins that have more detail than I've seen of Forest"

The levels have not been completed. Loriel offered to do something to wipe the random flower images and such off the terrain for me so I can make my own patterns with 'em and mushrooms and such and Calani is supposed to assist me with the outside levels and Stefan hasn't set her debug access with rw to forest levels yet.

If you read the forums you'd have the answers to most of your questions Padren. I think I'm gonna make and sticky a progress thread with every little detail, each level, each item, etc and a little "complete: yes/no" and such but of course many things need to be put in place before I can even start alot of things, the above paragraph before this is an example or two :)

To Ziro: I was refering to how Padren became leader of Dustari :x

Oh...thought you were referring to MarkB or Valder becoming leader of CP after myself...

Chris, I looked through all the threads you started in the last year in the forest forum, I saw the one from 8/6/03 where you kinda quit, but that's about it.

There are two older ones, one where you make a general, and other, I think its where you become Aran, but that's all I see.


Link?

About Tseng, listen, the man promised he'd go if he ever got badly inactive again - it was a condition of our terms when 90% of dustari chose to return after leaving in protest. He was absent for 6 months following that.

If you played GK still, you may have known about that.


Well, I guess I am in a combatitive mood, I just want to see some progress Chris, its not your Kingdom, it's GK's kingdom, and when people talk about adding a 5th kingdom to the game, and we already are supposed to have one, what you are up to does become up for critique.


You shouldn't feel singled out or offended by that, its proper for the situation.

Grr there are 38 threads, you couldn't have possibly read them all thoroughly and neither am I to prove you wrong. The point of time I quit James was appointed King but was later banned or something, I then returned.

The thing is with the Tseng situation is that you removed him illegally. You could have had the decency to do it formally, it really seemed like you saw a dishonest opportunity to become king with your power hungry self, regardless of it being wrong you went ahead and decided to take it. If he was removed formally you weren't neccessarily be given kingship, maybe that is why you did it? If I still played GK? I'm on daily, hell I can't even say daily - it's more like hourly.

You want progress? Speak to Jagen, Stefan, etc because they're who I'm forced to rely on. I have no other choice but to sit around for days and wait on them and only bloody hope they aren't too busy to help me with scripting and things I don't have rights to. I've asked members before (even in this thread) if they prefer to have playerwise things done now and screw major updates or if they'd wait and they've still chosen to wait. You've also said it yourself in a thread debating Lance being removed..I believe it was somewhere along the lines of "the difference between you and Lance is that your members are happy."

They spoke of an even number of kingdoms (6), not 5 as it's an odd number which supposedly gives a 2 vs 3 advantage in an allianced situation like the current one. Singled out or offended? Nah, I'm just defending myself from your unthought ignorance and preventing the people that would absorb it without further consideration from making me waste my time.

<3 for chris.. none for anybody else.

If I wanted anything I could get it off NY/Bosh or my brother, retard.

I'm not complaining at all but it's unfair on all the other kingdoms.
Forest is dead get a new kingdom in.

Sorry about double post, Its morning now. (Posted that last night).
Anyway, Why dont Pirates or the KJ,Dustari,Zormite alliance attact forth upon them forsaken lands?.
All you need to do is attack when chris is on, send in a level 10 **** and he can be the new owner. (No offence Chris.)

I swear you're on of the most stupid people on Graal Wan. First of all I believe it would take alot longer to make an entire new kingdom than to repair mine. Furthermore you don't become the leader of a kingdom by just pking their leader, think man - that isn't logical. If it did work that way leaders would be changed by day, Stefan would have to set a new debug RC and RP policies/fundimentals would be so flexible they shouldn't even exist. How can you insult someone and say "no offense"?

How about, Forest and Chris stays?

Everything have it's reasons and grounds.


5 kingdoms, how do you know what will happen? Perhaps all kingdoms will unite, perhaps they will go on thier own journey to power.

If you don't know, don't talk.

Smeh, I don't care. Your doing a great job as a kingdom leader. fun fun sarcasm.

I know the entire history of Astri, from 2k1 to the begginning of Forest.

Griffon (sp?) knows everything about Dustari and Zormite (i believe at least). Zurkiba knows just about everything about those three kingdoms.

Ghost knows all there is to know about CP, however, he won't be coming back to tell us anytime soon.

Samurai, well, has no RP history.. they haven't ever really.

I'll post more about you all bashing Chris since you're all obviously ****ing *****s.

Chris, my turn to say something. You became leader from Zurk, correct? I gave Forest to Zurk who gave it to you? Or am I forgetting someone? Well, anyways. Since you've gotten it IT HAS DIED. You claim that you are working on fixing it, but it has been months. You can create a new rank structure and policy in a matter of minutes-hours and they can be good. I have no idea what the hell you are doing, but it seems like nothing. Just resign and give it to someone who has atleast some passion for the game. Forest was dead months ago, now it is just rotting.

Eff you too. :(

Yeah, I believe that's how it happened.. though, in a RP manner (i was sick that day :mad: ). It prospered, for many months, but then event items were being released (other then the forest shield) and people left, when people left, it was hard to recruit.

Incredibly hard... Chris' rp standards are high... quite high. Reason's why he didn't want me re-recruiting you or Toran. Or NY, or Bosh, or anybody that couldn't RP on-screen with out 'loling' or 'omg'ing.

The main reason alot of people went to Samurai or Pirates was because Forest, Dustari, and Zormite were allied. That caused for alot of same-kingdom messages (when pking) so people left the kingdom...

RP was never, ever, EVER actually in kingdoms. We have weapons, looks, hair, clothes, and the cool 'prep your weapon!' or 'uber enchants!' to promote PKing. If Kingdoms was meant to be RP, there would be no prep, no EA. Simply level up and get damage from leveling. Level restrictions on special weapons (inferno, darkflame) and a more RP-based kingdom system.

As of now, Chris has been re-making the entire Forest island, and, as you can see now, there are not many tree's or folige (sp?) so that has to be re-done. Alot of tree's have to be placed, and made. Mushrooms, flowers, etc etc. The entire castle is being re-done, and scripted (won't say why) and through my experiences, that takes a whole lot of work...

But, the real problem here is, Jagen, and Stefen. Chris has to rely on them for RC, for uploads, for anything relative to his progress'. He had to wait MONTHS for the new scripting system, and now, Jagen ignores him and uses his 30k dagger to PK people because he's bored, and has more important things to do rather then his job.

In all honesty, the real problem with children running kingdoms, and running GK, is that all children are conceited. Self-rightous, procrastinating, etc etc. Until we have serious staff (back, <3 tseng) then we won't have staff to rely on for the kingdom uploads. Until we have mature leaders for kingdoms, we won't have a good system, period. Children cannot be relied on, and until we do something about the children running kingdoms, you have a problem..

On the contrary (sp), this game is for children, and I expect such from this game.

That's all for now.

Thought you were smarter than that. Toran and myself can rp better than 90% of the server. If you're trying to insult my rp skills you should probably think again. I could care less how "high" his standards are. When you have 1 member on at a time and absolutely no rping being done, you know you need a change. Look at the population of Forest. Maybe he should lower it a bit so that Forest ACTUALLY IS A KINGDOM. As of now, its 3-4 idiots claiming they are god of rping. It doesn't take 4 months to re-make an island/fix a few things. Chris, you are lazy. Takes you a week, AT MOST. I've made GK levels before, and trust me it does NOT take this long. If you are insulting Jagen, then I have absolutely no idea why you are praising Tseng. Jagen is 100x the staff member Tseng will ever be. If Chris can't contact Jagen to get something online, it is HIS fault. Whenever I needed Jagen for any problem I could get in touch with him within 5 minutes. Jagen was NEVER conceited, and I know for a fact he does work. Sure, as all staff do, he has some fun. Oh no? Rping can happen on kingdoms at any time. All that I see is laziness from leaders not to promote it. Sadly enough, Anu seems to be the most active kingdom leader as of now. For a final note, if there was ONE person I could rely on the most online..it is Jagen.

When Marle was our Empress on 2k1 we did a lot more RPing then most other kingdoms...